retrosurfer1959 Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 Not really sure where I fall in here. Born and raised Catholic and went for much of my life, I got sick and tired of the church about ten years ago, when a new priest came in that gave the everyone human sucks and your all going to hell sermon every week. Then they decided to build a new church and became a lot more interested in collecting money than spreading the word. I pretty much gave up on religion even though my beliefs did not change. If I had a church I could stand near me I would likely attend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Robot Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 When I was a new born and very sick in hospital, a priest refused my fathers request for prayer because my dad was not a practising catholic. Later, my grandfather and grandmother left the country back to Scotland because my dad refused to enrol me in a catholic school. So, I think you might be getting the drift here. I believe and live by the christian values but believe it is possible to live by a moral code without needing a religion or a church. I am basically an atheist. There are too many sick things in this world to believe in a God. Also, given there are so many religions in the world, how can one religion claim that theirs is the right one and then go and kill people of the other faith and claim it is 'god's will' or 'alah's will' ? I think religion is all hypocracy designed to support power structures and protect assets and wealth I respect other people's right to believe in a faith. However, I think it should be illegal to base a system of government on a particular religion. The US Constitution was written with this in mind.....hence why I always cringe when someone claims that the US is 'god's country'. A secular government is what makes the US, Britain and Australia a civilised society in my view. A government based on a religion is the equivalent of barbarianism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeoConMan Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 No time - schedule conflicts, work. My wife attends more than I do, since I work at least 2 Sundays out of 5, rotating shifts. Still, I manage to go once a month if at all possible but I'm not a full-timer. Never have been. (I know, it doesn't seem right for me being less than a Bible-thumper - but I never said I was.... ) Still, it's nice to hear something I hadn't considered before - perspectives and such. Get the brain working on some things I don't normally think of, but they have to have a good pastor or I'm walking. I won't sit and listen to the same old blah, blah, blah... I'm guessing that's an issue for many of you - many pastors really have no gift, it's just a job. I won't pay them. The small church my wife attended since she was a preteen has grown into a huge Mega-Church - televised and all. We got married by the pastor (very smart, thought-provoking man) at a cermony off-site. Couldn't stand the thought of doing it there because we were so tired of the whole Mega thing. It's funny, my wife actually set up and coordinated weddings in the church for several years. On top of that, we got married on an Air Force golf course (with all the military in our families) and I don't even play golf. Ironic, no? More often now, we attend a small Baptist church near her parents place in the country. I KNEW it was my kinda church when they held CCW classes (Concealed Carry Weapon) there for handgun permits!!!! (I already had mine.) Let's just say I fit right in. "Praise the Lord, and pass the ammunition...." That oughta get 'em going..... :- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChanMan Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 My beliefs, at some point, vary from most organized Christian religions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Notes_Norton Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 I have nothing against God/god, but I have a lot against organized religion. It isn't the spirit that is at fault, but the humans that run the religions are too often tempted by greed and power and thus create hate, wars, and backwards thinking. I see the problem, but I don't know how to fix it. Notes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djroge1 Posted April 18, 2009 Author Share Posted April 18, 2009 Thanks to everyone for their input. My reason for asking is two-fold. 1. I'm preaching soon at our church and I was led to this Bible verse that says, "For David, after he had served the purpose of God in his own generation, fell asleep, and was laid among his fathers and underwent decay;" (Acts 13:36). I see many of our church members are more inward focused and not serving thier generation unless they come into the church. They are very good at taking care of themselves and anyone who desires to become like them. However, a lot of people don't want to be like them (me included) so there is a need to help them have a shift in thinking and attitude and minister to and help the un-churched. The way I see Jesus is that He was a true Revolutionary leader. He helped people when others wouldn't. He taught truths that others mis-handled or ignored. For me and those I teach and lead being a christian is not just about going to church and getting all this head knowledge like some big bible fat-head. It's about learning, growing, and doing what the bible teaches - you know helping others who need a hand. 2. I'm reading a book by George Barna called "Grow your church from the outside in." Barna group does research about churches and spiritual matters via polls so he gets a lot of numbers. This was one of the questions from his book. According to his research the highest reason for not attending was schedule conflict. However, I believe he specifically asked those who consider themselves Christians and in this group some are and some are not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Notes_Norton Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 Thanks to everyone for their input. My reason for asking is two-fold. 1. I'm preaching soon at our church <...>Barna group does research about churches and spiritual matters via polls so he gets a lot of numbers. This was one of the questions from his book. According to his research the highest reason for not attending was schedule conflict.<...> I'm sure the majority of clergy people are doing the right thing, but it's the few, and often the leaders, that ruin it for me. I was brought up as a Roman Catholic, and the Holy See has had it's long history of doing the wrong thing, from the Crusades, to the recent rash of molesting priests, to selling indulgences, to the inquisitions, to the slavery of the native Americans during the colonial era, to the witch hunts, and on and on. How about the hate between the Christians, Jews and Muslims? How many lives have been lost and ruined by these 3 warring religions who all worship the same God? And what's this deal about the Christians hating the Jews because they killed Jesus? Didn't the Romans kill him? And if he wasn't crucified, according to the Bible, we wouldn't be saved from original sin so we should thank them. And I refuse to believe my soul was tarnished because someone ate an apple they weren't supposed to eat. I believe I came into the world pure and it is up to me to remain that way the best way I can. And all the armies who are sure God is on their side, even if it is the same God as the people they are killing? How about a president who bears false witness against his neighbor (WMDs), and for the first time in history invades a sovereign country and kills hundreds of thousands of people, invoking the name of God and being supported by church leaders all over the country? The church leaders should have condemned this action as the sin that it is. And the TV Evangalists who do not lay down their possessions and follow the way of the Lord but instead take money from poor people and give it to the rich (themselves). Or the exclusive rule that says nobody except those in my religion will see the promised land in the afterlife, the rest will rot in hell. I don't think a good God will punish someone who is a good person but has been brought up in a different religion. I repeat, most of the clergy are good people following their belief system with the best intentions. But if organized religion wants me back in church, it has to completely clean it's own house first. When I was young, the nuns told me not to follow anyone, even the pope if the pope yielded to the devil's temptation. It's not about schedule conflict for me, it's about hypocrisy and too many clergy people preaching "Do as I say, not as I do." So I've remained spiritual, and as I have gained knowledge (hopefully wisdom) I've become a bit eclectic and I can appreciate the good parts about all the major religions. I say this because you seemed to ask (forgive me if I misunderstood). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocketman Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 Well I'm the church organist and I don't do it because of the music... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deepblue Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 Jesus preached the word of God, not religion. Organized religion is a money making industry who seek out the old and the weak minded and pray upon their darkest fears. Bastards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mick Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 I see many of our church members are more inward focused and not serving thier generation unless they come into the church. They are very good at taking care of themselves and anyone who desires to become like them. However' date=' a lot of people don't want to be like them (me included) so there is a need to help them have a shift in thinking and attitude and minister to and help the un-churched. [/quote'] By this do you mean soliciting people to join the church ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vinnie Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 I'm a heathen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swampking Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 *strum*...and she's buying.......a stairwaaaaaay......to...heaven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djroge1 Posted April 18, 2009 Author Share Posted April 18, 2009 By this do you mean soliciting people to join the church ? Not really, I'm talking about getting people to catch the vision of helping out at the rescue mission (more than the few we have now). People going thru the neighborhoods and finding homes that belong to the elderly and help them take care of their yard or fix shuddars etc... Paying for the person behind you in line at the coffee shop just because we care during the hard economic times. Offering free finanacial classes to those who need help, free classes to those (elderly again?) who want to learn to use a computer. Finding a way to partner with the local schools to help keep our kids safe and offer free tutoring. I'm talking about getting the church active in helping others - because God loves all of them. If people join because they like what we are doing then that is just the by-product so to speak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wicked1 Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 My religious belief is just that ......... mine. Axe sacrifices Cheetos at the altar of the wicked 1. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wicked1 Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 Yeah' date=' but I don't like tiddy little lables like Agnostic. You end up in a Cubby Hole next to Heathen and Antichrist.[/quote'] Yes, but the next cubby hole to the left of "Antichrist" is wicked. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FirstMeasure Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 Yes' date=' but the next cubby hole to the left of "Antichrist" is wicked. :)[/quote'] Well I guess it can't be all bad then :- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesus Is Dead In My Basement Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 [b Let's just say I fit right in. "Praise the Lord' date=' and pass the ammunition...."[/b'] That oughta get 'em going..... Yeah because i am pretty sure when Jesus comes back he will have a ****ing Uzi on him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Notes_Norton Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 Not really' date=' I'm talking about getting people to catch the vision of helping out at the rescue mission (more than the few we have now). People going thru the neighborhoods and finding homes that belong to the elderly and help them take care of their yard or fix shuddars etc... Paying for the person behind you in line at the coffee shop just because we care during the hard economic times. Offering free finanacial classes to those who need help, free classes to those (elderly again?) who want to learn to use a computer. Finding a way to partner with the local schools to help keep our kids safe and offer free tutoring. I'm talking about getting the church active in helping others - because God loves all of them. If people join because they like what we are doing then that is just the by-product so to speak.[/quote'] I think these are some of the greatest things that religion offers. I don't go to church, but I do play charity gigs and nursing homes for no money (if I believe in the charity), give money to local causes, and often reach out and help my fellow human when the occasion calls for that. I also do my best to take care of the environment, after all, we are supposed to be the stewards of the earth See my environment page for details I don't listen to the hate mongers in the media, as I think the would would be a better place without them. During hurricanes, a few of us go around and put up the storm shutters for the widows and other people in the neighborhood who cannot do it themselves - and whoever has electricity or water shares it with the rest. During the last hurricane we were without power for 10 days, and the water hoses and electric cords were strung out all over the neighborhood, the ones with generators and primed wells sharing with the others. I sincerely think if the churches did only good things, if they cleaned their own houses immediately when a leader succumbs to temptation, and if they stayed out of politics, respecting the division between church and state, they would gain many more members. Good luck to you, you sound like a decent fellow (not one of the minority that gives religion a bad name), and I applaud all the positive effects you have on other people's lives. Notes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mick Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 Not really' date=' I'm talking about getting people to catch the vision of helping out at the rescue mission (more than the few we have now). People going thru the neighborhoods and finding homes that belong to the elderly and help them take care of their yard or fix shuddars etc... Paying for the person behind you in line at the coffee shop just because we care during the hard economic times. Offering free finanacial classes to those who need help, free classes to those (elderly again?) who want to learn to use a computer. Finding a way to partner with the local schools to help keep our kids safe and offer free tutoring. I'm talking about getting the church active in helping others - because God loves all of them. If people join because they like what we are doing then that is just the by-product so to speak.[/quote'] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jameswithesg Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 i believe the body is the church, i am there every day, and i watch what i put into it, cause what comes in goes out and i believe i am god but whatever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevezapp Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 I believe and live by the christian values but believe it is possible to live by a moral code without needing a religion or a church. This is exactly my point of view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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