Kzin Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 My current sg standard has a dead spot on F#, its most prominent on the g string. I had one before wich I got replaced due to a waped neck, and it also had the same dead note. It seems to me to be a quite common problem with sg´s since i´ve tried two other sg cherry standards with the exact same problem. I´ve tried two sg´s wich didnt have this dead note, a gothic (i think? all black with emg pickups) and a special faded. Anyways, have anyone else noticed this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bert plays a SG? Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 Haven't notice dead spots excepts when my guitar needed adjustments. It needed intonation. First you got to choose the string gauge you like.. And get a pack of brand new ones.. Then you set the neck relief the way you want it... If you like it, don't play with the neck! Just make sure the strings aren't too close to the neck. A reasonable relief allows the sting to vibrate completely with a lot of overtones... For the intonation, tune your new guitar strings (with an electronic tuner)... Strings that are smaller then 10-46s sound thin on a SG and chosing them makes it easier to "get" dead spots... Then make sure the harmonics at the 12th fret of each string sounds in tune. It has to be dead on! Now that your guitar seems tuned, the next step is to fret each string at the 12th and again, check if it is in tune. Depending on how the pitch is on a string, adjust the saddle that goes with it. It sounds a bit too high? ( If you don't hear it but see the tuner indicates it's slighly higher...) Bring back the saddle. Sounds too low? Screw it closer to the neck. You got to make sure it sounds dead on in all 3 ways: open, harmonic 12th fret and fretted 12th fret. Tune your guitar again. It should sound allright. Without dead spots... Of course, even with absolutely incredible guitars, you do get spots that don't sound as rich as others. If you still have the dead spots' problem, I'd say bring it to a luthier. If everything's allright, play... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sliptrip Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 I have a 2003 black SG standard with 9-46s on it and I don't recall any dead spots. I've had it professionally setup as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 My current sg standard has a dead spot on F#' date=' its most prominent on the g string. I had one before wich I got replaced due to a waped neck, and it also had the same dead note. It seems to me to be a quite common problem with sg´s since i´ve tried two other sg cherry standards with the exact same problem. I´ve tried two sg´s wich didnt have this dead note, a gothic (i think? all black with emg pickups) and a special faded. Anyways, have anyone else noticed this?[/quote'] I'm sure I started a short lived thread about this about 6 months ago. My issue is at the 12th fret on the G. Tried and checked everything!It actually got 60% better when I went to a lighter gauge from 12's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dickey Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 Haven't noticed the problem on any of my '61 RI's, but back in the seventies I was always trading & dealing Gibsons. I noticed a good portion of them, especially 335's, would have an unusual problem. If the G string was in tune open, it would sound sharp at the 2nd fret, and ONLY the 2nd fret. Had about 3 or 4 Gibsons that did that. As far as tuning stability & intonation, the newer ones are far superior to the vintage ones. Sound & playability?--that's another matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
80LPC Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 Different people hear differently. What could be a 'dead spot' to one person could sound normal to another. It just might be that you have a hearing anomaly. Tune your G string down a whole tone, then fret F# again. Does it still sound dead ? Notes that are sharp at the first few frets are always due to nut slots being too high. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murph Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 I set mine up myself, and have gigged Gibsons for well over 30 years, never had any such problem. My '61 Melody Maker (with a Leo Quan bridge) could be gigged tonight. (the frets are about gone though......) I also wore the frets off a '72 Recording Les Paul. But it took 14 years.... (shoulda kept that one) Murph. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzin Posted May 27, 2009 Author Share Posted May 27, 2009 Haven't notice dead spots excepts when my guitar needed adjustments. It needed intonation. So if the intonation isnt correct that can affect dead spots? I thought that dead spots were caused by the wood in the guitar was resonating at the same frequancy as some notes, and that caused the string vibration energy to transfer to the wood making the note die faster. The intonation is a little off though, so I might fix that. Other than that I think it´s set up nice. I dont wanna mess with it. It doesnt bother me much any more though, to my experience it seem to be a very common problem with sg´s. But it would be nice if it werent there. I thought all guitars had dead spots, more or less prominent? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzin Posted May 27, 2009 Author Share Posted May 27, 2009 I'm sure I started a short lived thread about this about 6 months ago. My issue is at the 12th fret on the G. Tried and checked everything!It actually got 60% better when I went to a lighter gauge from 12's. Mine is in that area as well. I think F# is the worst, But F and G are affected to. My guess is that when you changed strings you altered the mass of the guitar, moving the dead spot i bit. Are the same notes affected when you play with a slide? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzin Posted May 27, 2009 Author Share Posted May 27, 2009 Different people hear differently. What could be a 'dead spot' to one person could sound normal to another. It just might be that you have a hearing anomaly. Tune your G string down a whole tone' date=' then fret F# again. Does it still sound dead ? Notes that are sharp at the first few frets are always due to nut slots being too high. [/quote'] Other people have heard it to, and I´ve done blind tests. When I alter the tuning it is still F# wich is dead, so it has nothing to do with the frets. Its also more prominent on the g string than on the b string. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
80LPC Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 This could be a true dead spot where the resonance of the neck and body suppress certain frequencies, or possibly a set-up issue. I would first measure neck relief, and action height across all strings at the 12th fret, and the last fret. Is your string height slightly lower at the last fret compared to the 12th ? If so, there is a strong possibilty that the strings will not vibrate cleanly. Despite fret leveling by Gibson (whether by hand or Plek), fretboard dimensions change with temperature, humidity and time. Naturally, this changes the alignment of the frets, and further work is often required. Frets can be checked by using a machined straight-edge placed across all the frets with the neck adjusted straight. If you use an engineer's square, you can check the frets from the 12th to the last, (there is no relief in this area, so you can check these frets without needing to adjust the truss rod). In order to do this, you must use sunlight to backlight the neck while you look carefully for uneven frets. Of course, actions that are simply too low, or pickups adjusted very close to the strings cause problems. If your guitar has a true dead spot, I would try different gauge strings and make an adjustment to the truss rod. It's possible that a slight truss rod adjustment alone might be just enought to reduce the dead spot, since you are altering the resonant frequency of the neck. Here's the recent similar post. http://forums.gibson.com/Default.aspx?g=posts&t=15669 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cat&mouse Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 I've never experienced a dead spot on my SG and I've played it up and down the neck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzin Posted May 27, 2009 Author Share Posted May 27, 2009 @80LPC Yeah, I´m certian its a true dead spot. It´s the note thats dead, not a postion on the neck. If I press the head of the guitar at a table lightly when the note rings it sustains great. Thanks for the link. The link, and the fact that all five cherry standards I´ve tried have had the same problem lead me to belvie that this is not an uncommon problem. My guess is that the mass and maybe the shape of the sg leads to that frequency often being cancelled out. Strangly enough its not as noticeble on the b string. Luckily I´m not bothered by it anymore. If it had been just MY SG then Í would be pretty upset. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzin Posted May 27, 2009 Author Share Posted May 27, 2009 I've never experienced a dead spot on my SG and I've played it up and down the neck. Good to hear =) I think you´ve been lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bert plays a SG? Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 Kzin: "The intonation is a little off though, so I might fix that. Other than that I think it´s set up nice. I dont wanna mess with it." You ask for answers and then you don't wanna do anything about it.... WTF!?!?! It's not "messing with it", it's taking care of it! Man, why play an instrument you can't even set-up well! You won't even try... lol... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzin Posted May 27, 2009 Author Share Posted May 27, 2009 Kzin: "The intonation is a little off though' date=' so I might fix that. Other than that I think it´s set up nice. I dont wanna mess with it." You ask for answers and then you don't wanna do anything about it.... WTF!?!?! It's not "messing with it", it's taking care of it! Man, why play an instrument you can't even set-up well! You won't even try... lol... [/quote'] I said I might fix the intonation. But I dont know enough about setting up guitars that I would try adjusting the thrusrod myself, especially not an expensive guitar like this whith a set neck. My previous SG was set up by a pro, and since that didnt effect the dead spot I´m hesitant to start messing with this one since I think the setup is good. And why wouldn´t I play a nice guitar even if I can´t set it up myself?? Edit: Spelling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bert plays a SG? Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 http://users.powernet.co.uk/guitars/setup3.htm http://koivi.com/guitar-intonation.php That should help a bit... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
80LPC Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 My guess is that the mass and maybe the shape of the sg leads to that frequency often being cancelled out. Strangly enough its not as noticeble on the b string. This is called 'character' To those perceptive enough, clear differences can exist between similar guitars. People often recommend trying as many guitars as possible - with good reason. When manufacturers build instruments from synthetic materials to give an even tonal response across the fretboard, the result can be a boring characterless instrument. So I'm happy to stick with wood, since each guitar has an identity. If I wanted the same tone at every note, I'd buy a keyboard ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 Mine is in that area as well. I think F# is the worst' date=' But F and G are affected to. My guess is that when you changed strings you altered the mass of the guitar, moving the dead spot i bit. Are the same notes affected when you play with a slide?[/quote'] I Dont normally play swith a slide, but just checked this , and things seem slightly weaker with a slide too.I subscribe to the resonance of the neck and body theory as mentioned below by yourself and by 80LPC.I think you have to just work round it as best you can As for climate,temperature ,humidity- I will see if there's any difference when the season/climate here in Glasgow changes from cold+very wet to "not quite so cold" and very wet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geff Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 I went to Glasgow once and it was warm and sunny. I think it must have been a leap year or somesuch! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Plains Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 I've noticed that on several SGs. I've also noticed the F on the A string is another common dead spot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzin Posted May 28, 2009 Author Share Posted May 28, 2009 http://users.powernet.co.uk/guitars/setup3.htm http://koivi.com/guitar-intonation.php That should help a bit... Thanks, I´ll try it next time I change strings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzin Posted May 28, 2009 Author Share Posted May 28, 2009 I Dont normally play swith a slide' date=' but just checked this , and things seem slightly weaker with a slide too.I subscribe to the resonance of the neck and body theory as mentioned below by yourself and by 80LPC.I think you have to just work round it as best you can As for climate,temperature ,humidity- I will see if there's any difference when the season/climate here in Glasgow changes from cold+very wet to "not quite so cold" and very wet.[/quote'] Did you notice if the dead spot moved slightly to another note? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo Posted May 28, 2009 Share Posted May 28, 2009 I went to Glasgow once and it was warm and sunny. I think it must have been a leap year or somesuch! It has its compensations for the non existent summers. Apparently this weekend is supposed to be good!--Fingers crossed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo Posted May 28, 2009 Share Posted May 28, 2009 Did you notice if the dead spot moved slightly to another note? It seemed to be at the same place.Tried everything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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