Any J-200 Jr. history buffs out there?

[Jack6849]

I had a J-200 Jr., one of the first, back in 1992. Does anyone here have historical details about the model, e.g. specifications, when it was officially introduced, when and why it was discontinued, production totals? I loved mine and I just ordered a special-order J-200 Jr. from Bozeman. Its specs include an Adirondack Spruce top and a bound fretboard and headstock, which the original J-200 Jr. didn't have. I can't wait. This is a guitar model I think should be among Gibson's regular production models. I like to refer to it as my "J-200 Jr. True Vintage" model.

 

Jack6849

[Hall]

My small book I have on hand here doesn't mention the jr. much. On your ordered model, what materials are the body, fingerboard, position markers and tuners? I know Ray Whitley had both a big one and a jr. custom made for him, per this little reference book. They were spruce top, rosewood bodies, ebony boards and fully bound. His had Tortise guards and were beautiful, per these pictures. Enjoy your's when she comes!

[Jinder]

An acquaintance of mine, Alyssa Bonagura, plays an incredible Jr., Brazilian back and sides and what looks to me like an Adi top, which was custom made for her mother, Kathy Bailie, back in the early '90s.

 

The thing sounds utterly mesmerising...like dewdrops falling from diamonds.

 

Next time I see her, I'm going to try to trade her the entirety of the UK for it.

[J185-4Me]

Sure, I'll play!

 

The J200-Jr was introduced in 1992, and it essentially took over the 16" jumbo design from the J-185, which preceded it for two years ('90-'91).

 

For comparison, here's a 1992 J-200Jr and a later J-185:

 

 

The Jr was built using the same long scale that the J-185 before it had, but they took the design aesthetic elements of the J-200 and used those -- some, but not all. So the Jr got the same inlays on the fingerboard, similar bridge (two pearl bars though). Same inlay pattern on the backstrip as on the J-200. Same tuners. NO binding on the fingerboard (and I love that about the Jr).

 

They also introduced a 12-string version of the J-200Jr, built on a short scale.

 

The Jr was dropped from the production lists in 1994, BUT occasional small batches or individual J-200Jr guitars were built in the period from 1995 to now.

 

Here's a pair of 2000 J-200Jrs (note that even in the same batch, two different pickguards were used on the same model -- that's Gibson!):

 

 

I've had three over the years, a 92 6-string, a 93 12-string and my current, a Custom Shop model from 2007:

 

 

This one has -- as yours will -- a red spruce top. It sounds great!!

 

 

One of the forum regulars has (or had) a bunch of these too, only with some in red, IIRC.

 

Let us know once you get your Custom J-200Junior!

 

Fred

[Rambler]

Here's a link to one in action:

[BigKahune]

Beautiful! Nice pics.

[Jack6849]

Thanks to all who responded on my J-200 Jr. info request. Now I see why forums are fun. I will indeed let you know when my Custom Shop J-200 Jr. "True Vintage" model (that's what I like to call it, anyway....) arrives. It's also going to have a bound headstock and fretboard, unlike my first J-200 Jr., from back in 1992, and I think that will add to the vibe of it being like a small J-200. These Adirondack-topped "True Vintage" Gibson acoustics, like my 2010 SJ-200 "True Vintage" and the J-45 "True Vintage" I recently played at "Dave's" in La Crosse are really mind-blowers. Play one and you will be a believer.

 

Thanks again for the fun,

Jack6849

[J185-4Me]

.... These Adirondack-topped "True Vintage" Gibson acoustics' date=' like my 2010 SJ-200 "True Vintage" and the J-45 "True Vintage"[i'] I recently played at "Dave's" in La Crosse[/i] are really mind-blowers. Play one and you will be a believer.

 

Thanks again for the fun,

Jack6849

 

Ah, you've been to Dave's! (One of my faves. I've bought a few from his shop over the years.)

 

Have you played the 1993 J-200Jr Ultra deluxe specfreakintacular that he has there?

 

 

Over the top nutty fancy, but it is worth a look and a play!

 

Fred

[tuneitfred]

Jack

 

Love me some J-200jr's. I've owned 6 of them over the years. I bought Fred's 12 string 10 years ago. It's long gone now. I've also had a '92 (which I traded) and a '93 which (which I sold). Here's what I have now. Two '97's in cherry and a '01 in sunburst.

 

 

Some artist associated with the model include Carlene Carter, Patti Griffin, Warren Zevon & Alejandro Escovedo. Comfortable size and punchy sound. I love mine. I'm sure you'll love your's also.

 

The Other Fred

[Jack6849]

To: J1854Me and tuneitfred

 

Wow. So nice of you both to keep the excitement up for me on my Bozeman Custom Shop special order J-200 Jr.

 

I ordered this one in "Vintage Sunburst", which on my 2010 SJ-200 "True Vintage" is very dark on the edges like the one it the picture of three from "the Other Fred". I think of that dark edge as being black, but perhaps it's actually a very dark brown? At any rate, I also really love the finish in the picture of the 2007 Custom Shop guitar. What is that called? I can only hope the tonewoods on mine are as beautiful as the materials used for that guitar. It was really great to see how the Adirondack Spruce looked on the smaller top, (fantastic...) and the figure in the Maple on the side of the upper bout is beyond beautiful. (How was the "back" Maple on that 2007 guitar?) You must love it. Thanks again for all the pictures.

 

Yes, of course I looked at the Ren Ferguson-signed, "over the top" inlayed, J-200 Jr. at Dave's Guitar Shop in La Crosse. "Over the top" is right! It's actually more inlay than I would personally care to have, but, as you say, it was worth a look, and a play.

 

Your responses and all the photos are truly appreciated. I still say the "J-200 Jr." should be a regular-production model for Gibson. Especially with their "True Vintage" specs. I know there wasn't exactly a "vintage" J-200 Jr., so maybe Gibson wouldn't want to use the "True Vintage" name for the model, but to me "True Vintage" has come to mean "top of the line" in Gibson acoustic guitars, utilizing the best materials and craftsmanship available today, while acknowledging the company's great heritage in building some of the finest acoustic instruments ever made.

 

Thanks again,

Jack6849

[J185-4Me]

To: J1854Me and tuneitfred

 

Wow. So nice of you both to keep the excitement up for me on my Bozeman Custom Shop special order J-200 Jr.

 

I ordered this one in "Vintage Sunburst"' date=' which on my 2010 SJ-200 "True Vintage" is very dark on the edges like the one it the picture of three from "the Other Fred". I think of that dark edge as being black, but perhaps it's actually a very dark brown? At any rate, I also really love the finish in the picture of the 2007 Custom Shop guitar. What is that called? I can only hope the tonewoods on mine are as beautiful as the materials used for that guitar. It was really great to see how the Adirondack Spruce looked on the smaller top, (fantastic...) and the figure in the Maple on the side of the upper bout is beyond beautiful. (How was the "back" Maple on that 2007 guitar?) You must love it. Thanks again for all the pictures.

 

Thanks again,

Jack6849 [/quote']

 

I don't know what that 'burst is called; it took some tweaking to get it that way. I guess I'd call it a 'dark amberburst'. (They probably call it "PITA-Fred burst" at the plant! )

 

Back:

 

 

 

Compared with my 2001 "Dave's Guitar 1951 re-issue" J-185:

 

 

Fred

[Jack6849]

To J1854Me:

 

Wow, again. What great pictures! A gorgeous maple "back", and if I do say so myself, one of the all-time coolest Gibson Maple necks I've ever run into. Beautiful contouring at the headstock. The pictures say "play me". I also love the center stripes. Very impressive, indeed.

 

I'm curious about the "tweaking" of the finish color you mention. Did you have input into selecting the color? If so, how was that done? Email descriptions from you, or samples to "select" from them, or what? Your J-200 Jr. is really stunning. I hope mine's that nice. Yours really has a true "custom-built" vibe. Thanks so much for sharing.

 

Jack6849

[J185-4Me]

Jack,

 

I traded lots of photos of various bursts with the Custom Shop to try to illustrate the colour I had in mind. I did not want a burst that was so dark that it would obscure the top wood, the sides/back or the neck. I wanted to be able to see the wood. But I did not want it to be too light either.

 

I forgot to mention that the other custom feature I asked for was gold Waverly tuners.

 

Fred

[Jack6849]

Fred,

 

If it's okay with you, I might actually use this forum discussion with Laun Braithwaite at Dave's Guitar Shop in La Crosse, to see if he could take a look at your photos and then perhaps he might be able to get Gibson in Bozeman to use them as a reference for my J-200 Jr. special order. I really think you got that finish color right, and it's enough different from the "Vintage Sunburst" color of my 2010 SJ-200 "True Vintage" that they wouldn't quite look like identical twins. (Not that that would be bad...)

 

Another subtle difference in my two guitars will be that while the SJ-200 "True Vintage" came with Gibson's "VOS" finish, and it does truly look like a vintage J-200, for the Junior "special order", I went with the "gloss" finish option.

 

That order is only about two weeks old, so I hope it's not too late to ask for this variation to be applied. To say you and this forum have been helpful to me would be an understatement. Thanks for your time and I'll let you know what happens.

 

Jack

[J185-4Me]

Jack,

 

I've known Laun Braithwaite for quite a while now, having bought more than a few guitars from him over the years! He's a good guy.

 

If he hasn't done so already, maybe ask him to insert an instruction in the order "Ren or Val to pick wood".

 

Fred

[Jack6849]

Fred:

 

I'm now planning to share these thoughts with Laun by calling him Monday morning in La Crosse and directing him to our conversation. If I know Laun, he'll do his best to see what Gibson can do for me. He always goes the "extra" mile, as does everyone at Dave's. I'll post whatever he finds out for me, and keep you informed.

 

Thank you for your interest and your suggestions (and photos),

Jack

[Jack6849]

Fred,

 

I just talked to Laun and he's going to check with Bozeman for me on that J-200 Jr. finish. He said that he knew who you were, and I told him that you and I both think he's a good guy.

 

Thanks again,

Jack6849

[BenCasteel]

Jack, I am about to order a custom J-200 Jr specified basically the same as the one you ordered, but in natural.

So I'll be very interested in hearing your opinion when you receive yours and play it.

The logic here is - I love my L-200, the neck has opened up my abilities to where I can actually play Rev. Gary Davis songs - sort of a dream for me.

However, the bass is lacking on the E string of my L-200. At 5' 7" draping my arm over a J-200 just doesn't work well.

Gibson Montana says that Rosewood is the way to boost the bass on a guitar.

To test that theory I played what I could find around here in Rosewood (Songwriter cutaway,etc. ) . I didn't hear the highs or punch of my little L-200

and neither one encroaches on the indescribable bass of the J-200.

So I have mixed emotions on the Rosewood theory. Realizing of course you can't change physics, maybe we can at least do something and what that might be...hmm.

The 16" bout I think I should be able to handle and if they get the neck right, the woods right and it comes out anything like the others here have described ,

maybe we can do the Rev. proud. Also I would then have a backup guitar when I send the L-200 in for adjustments (like right now for example)

 

Ben

[J-1854Me]

Jack, I am about to order a custom J-200 Jr specified basically the same as the one you ordered, but in natural.

So I'll be very interested in hearing your opinion when you receive yours and play it.

The logic here is - I love my L-200, the neck has opened up my abilities to where I can actually play Rev. Gary Davis songs - sort of a dream for me.

However, the bass is lacking on the E string of my L-200. At 5' 7" draping my arm over a J-200 just doesn't work well.

Gibson Montana says that Rosewood is the way to boost the bass on a guitar.

To test that theory I played what I could find around here in Rosewood (Songwriter cutaway,etc. ) . I didn't hear the highs or punch of my little L-200

and neither one encroaches on the indescribable bass of the J-200.

So I have mixed emotions on the Rosewood theory. Realizing of course you can't change physics, maybe we can at least do something and what that might be...hmm.

The 16" bout I think I should be able to handle and if they get the neck right, the woods right and it comes out anything like the others here have described ,

maybe we can do the Rev. proud. Also I would then have a backup guitar when I send the L-200 in for adjustments (like right now for example)

 

Ben

 

Ben,

 

My Custom Shop, red spruce-topped, voiced-for-bass response J-200Jr has a very respectable bass presence for a 16" maple guitar. One of the best I've played.

 

I would strongly suggest you specifically request that they voice it according to your desires, and would also strongly urge that you consider the red spruce upgrade!

 

Fred

[BenCasteel]

Ben,

 

My Custom Shop, red spruce-topped, voiced-for-bass response J-200Jr has a very respectable bass presence for a 16" maple guitar. One of the best I've played.

 

I would strongly suggest you specifically request that they voice it according to your desires, and would also strongly urge that you consider the red spruce upgrade!

 

Fred

 

Thanks for quick response Fred, I had planned on the Red / Adirondack - what's your feelings on the Rosewood VS Maple theory, did voiced-for-bass equal Rosewood?

Ben

[J-1854Me]

Thanks for quick response Fred, I had planned on the Red / Adirondack - what's your feelings on the Rosewood VS Maple theory, did voiced-for-bass equal Rosewood?

Ben

 

Properly voiced, maple back and sides can very nicely 'colour' the tone, and provide more than suitable bass response.

 

Fred

[BenCasteel]

Properly voiced, maple back and sides can very nicely 'colour' the tone, and provide more than suitable bass response.

 

Fred

 

What's the scale length on a J-200 Jr - 25 1/2 like the J-200 ?

Ben

[Jack6849]

Ben,

 

I've been out of town for a bit and I just noticed your reopening of my J-200 Jr. thread. Ironically, I was just playing my Custom Shop J-200 Jr. and I agree with Fred about the tone of this model. The bass on mine is more than adequate and the overall tone is clear and very musical. I highly recommend the use of Adirondack Red Spruce (Picea rubens) on acoustic guitars whenever it's an available option, but I'm biased with ten acoustic guitars, nine of which, including a Gibson SJ-200 True Vintage and my J-200 Jr., have Adirondack tops. When Martin started using Adirondack on some models again, I revamped my Martin collection from top to bottom. Today six of my seven Martins have Adirondack tops, including a "just-ordered" Custom Shop D-45V that is scheduled for delivery next year. (The top on my other Martin is Carpathian Spruce...) I'm hooked on the sound of Adirondack Spruce. I guess with my playing style, it just sounds right to me.

 

Back to the J-200 Jr. If you order one, you might consider specifying an opaque pickguard like the ones used on the current SJ-200 True Vintage Models. My J-200 Jr. came from the Custom Shop with a translucent red guard and I had to have it changed because the translucence made the pickguard's adhesive show through and I thought it was distractingly unattractive on an otherwise, totally beautiful guitar. It turns out that it was only a small problem because Gibson overnighted my dealer (Dave's Guitar Shop in La Crosse, Wisconsin) an opaque replacement guard and Dave's repair department made the undetectable switch in under an hour.

 

Other than that one issue, my special order J-200 Jr.,with its Adirondack top is one of my very favorite acoustics to play, and like Fred, I love the size and feel of the model. Incidentally, when it comes to Custom Shop Gibsons, Fred knows of what he speaks. He has some of the nicest Gibsons I've seen. Good luck in your quest for that perfect Gibson guitar, Ben. I wish you the best. And thanks for giving me another chance to rant about Adirondack Spruce by reopening my old thread. (Hi, Fred).

 

One other thing, Ben... On my special order J-200 Jr., I paid a little extra and had Gibson put binding on the fretboard and headstock of my guitar. It really made it look cool to me, and it looks a lot more like a "miniature SJ-200" that way. You might want to ask about specifying that option for your natural finished special order.

 

I'm sure you're also aware that Adirondack Spruce is prone to pronounced grain patterns and mineral streaking, which are often more obvious on a "natural" top than on a "sunburst" one. I hope that trait wouldn't be of concern to you... Anyway, have fun with your special order, listen to Fred, and enjoy your new Gibson.

 

Jack6849

[J-1854Me]

What's the scale length on a J-200 Jr - 25 1/2 like the J-200 ?

Ben

 

Yes -- except for the 12-string version, which was built in '92-'93 with a 24.75" scale.

 

Fred

[shotdsherrif]

I just found this thread randomly through a search and decided to join this forum and hopefully reach a couple of the people who started and contributed to this thread.

 

I had a J-200 Jr from '93 for a long time (15+ years) and a couple years ago - during the recession - had to sell it. And it has turned out to be a huge, huge regret.

 

And well, now I've decided to either get my original back, buy another one, or possibly, from what I'm reading in this thread have one custom made. I truly loved that guitar that much.

 

I'm a relative novice about vintage guitars and more of just an avid player (mostly electric) but I think I'm going to spend some time reading through this forum and learn more about Gibson acoustics to see what it is that I really want to get.

 

So thanks for this thread.