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Silenced Fred

Tips on solo-ing

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Hemp00n!!

Fred, do you know what modes are? If not, learn them; they're fairly simple to learn but a little trickier to apply at first. If you're playing rock, start with Ionion, Lydian & Mixolydian and remember that scales aren't linear.

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Hemp00n!!

Fred' date=' do you know what modes are? If not, learn them; they're fairly simple to learn but a little trickier to apply at first. If you're playing rock, start with Lydian & Mixolydian and go from there.[/quote']

 

Yeah, I know what they are... I hate theory [blink]

 

Eh, I will look it up, see what I come up with.

 

Dem00n, you are my least favorite person named dem00n I know

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I don't get him either

 

BTW' date=' you misspelled Fender in your sig, you might want to fix that, unless you don't cuz thats cool too[/quote']

I blame the keyboard!

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The best solos ever writen werent on scales man.

 

LOL.

 

This is the same as saying that words aren't based on the alphabet.

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LOL.

 

This is the same as saying that words aren't based on the alphabet.

 

 

Yeah man, the best words ever written didn't use letters....

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Try to stop thinking about Leads and Rhythms ad different things. It's all guitar playing. Lead Lines, Bass Lines, and Chords are built from the same scales. Even the Chromatic Scales used by the Death Metal Shredmeisters that Dem00n was possibly referring to.

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I am writing songs' date=' have a couple almost done, just some finishing touches such as solos, and some intros/riffs. I have about 5 almost done, most of the lyrics written. Most are like a blues/alternative kind of sound. Think Black Keys and White Stripes, with some softer stuff. I don't want to keep in the pentatonic for all of the songs, any suggestions on styles or different scales?[/quote']

 

If it helps, the jazz soloing approach is to first analyse the song and determine the tone centres - basically the keys that operate in different parts of the song. For instance, a Dm7 G7 Cmaj7 is a 2-5-1 in C. This means that you are "safe" playing notes out of the scale of C major over these chords. Elsewhere in the song, you might see an Em7 A7 which is a 2-5 in D, so you are safe with notes from the scale of D major. Do you know any of this stuff?

 

Now, which notes of the scale? Solos often sound more interesting if you start the phrase off the 3 or 7 of the chord. For Dm7, this would be F or C, and for G7, B or F. 9s and 6s are kind of interesting too. It is common to end the phrase on the 1 or 5 of the chord as these have a resolving quality. 4s are generally avoided.

 

As you move from one tone centre to the other, try to start with a note that is in the new tone centre but not in the old one. This outlines the change and adds interest.

 

And avoid just playing scales like C D E F G A B C. Rather, play arpeggios. D F A C for Dm7 (or taking the advice above, F A C D) or other sequences of notes. (I think this is what Demoon was getting at.)

 

And you don't need to play lots of notes. A few well-chosen ones will sound much more effective than a sweep-puck scale.

 

Or you can play a two bar phrase (the question) and then let the rhythm section answer for two bars.

 

How are we doing?

 

RN

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If it helps' date=' the jazz soloing approach is to first analyse the song and determine the tone centres - basically the keys that operate in different parts of the song. For instance, a Dm7 G7 Cmaj7 is a 2-5-1 in C. This means that you are "safe" playing notes out of the scale of C major over these chords. Elsewhere in the song, you might see an Em7 A7 which is a 2-5 in D, so you are safe with notes from the scale of D major. Do you know any of this stuff?

[/quote']

 

This is what I hate about Jazz - key changes for the sake of key changes. It does my head in lol.

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If it helps' date=' the jazz soloing approach is to first analyse the song and determine the tone centres - basically the keys that operate in different parts of the song. For instance, a Dm7 G7 Cmaj7 is a 2-5-1 in C. This means that you are "safe" playing notes out of the scale of C major over these chords. Elsewhere in the song, you might see an Em7 A7 which is a 2-5 in D, so you are safe with notes from the scale of D major. Do you know any of this stuff?

 

Now, which notes of the scale? Solos often sound more interesting if you start the phrase off the 3 or 7 of the chord. For Dm7, this would be F or C, and for G7, B or F. 9s and 6s are kind of interesting too. It is common to end the phrase on the 1 or 5 of the chord as these have a resolving quality. 4s are generally avoided.

 

As you move from one tone centre to the other, try to start with a note that is in the new tone centre but not in the old one. This outlines the change and adds interest.

 

And avoid just playing scales like C D E F G A B C. Rather, play arpeggios. D F A C for Dm7 (or taking the advice above, F A C D) or other sequences of notes. (I think this is what Demoon was getting at.)

 

And you don't need to play lots of notes. A few well-chosen ones will sound much more effective than a sweep-puck scale.

 

Or you can play a two bar phrase (the question) and then let the rhythm section answer for two bars.

 

How are we doing?

 

RN [/quote']

 

 

 

Great stuff... Thanks. I would also add try throwing some double notes in there, say you are soloing in E pentatonic (Minor) on the 12th fret, the D and G hit together alternating with the E and A on the 14 fret add a great feel and don't be afraid to throw a chord either.... Say your soloing on a tune that has a funk feel chord rhythm happening, in the middle of your solo you can regress to that for a second or two and carry on with the lead...

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I blame the keyboard!

 

Sorry' date=' I just saw that and had to point that out.

 

I have started doing some stuff while in a pentatonic or blues scale, playing the same fret on two neighboring strings, get some cool stuff. Also, jumping up two frets adds a little bit of spice [biggrin

 

Thanks, keep em coming though

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Blues and Minor scales ftw. I guess I'm more a vertical than a horizontal, I really need to work on my horizontal fret work. Also, if you'd rather take the no scale approach I suggest wearing oven mitts and just go for it, it'll sound awesome.

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I have trouble with solos too Fred. My solution...keep trying stuff. Listen hard for the bad notes and avoid them (or place them intelligently)....

 

Its not easy but i find i am training my ear this way....i have no idea what scale i am playing in most of the time....eh...

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when i am creating a solo, i try to stay close to the melody line to reinforce it. also, i will find a scale that works for the current underlying chord at that point in the song, and choose notes that work for that chord regardless of the key. also, don't forget the rhythm pattern used in the melody and bassline: they are good sources for solo ideas. harmony notes in particular can sound really cool.

 

my stepfather, a piano teacher, always said once you know the rules you can break them: remember if it sounds good, it is good. :-)

 

-Don

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IMHO, there are a variety of scales you can draw from to construct a great solo, but regardless of how your solo takes shape, it should somehow relate to the melody, and various techniques like bending, sliding up to and away from a note, double stops, dynamics, and good vibrato will make your solos slicker. Dynamics not only involve changes in volume, but also changes in speed and the number of notes played. Letting a note ring can really work for you. And incorporating chords into your solos can add a nice touch, too.

 

Robin had some great advice on page two. Learning modes is a must if you want to take the leap to the next level. Do youself a favor. If you want to be a good musician, learning theory is a really good idea. If you're a serious guitar player, then you'll make time to learn it.

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My approach relies heavily on building and releasing tension, creating mood and variation, referencing the melody of the song, and alternating between expressive articulation and space-filling runs (which I use to build tension.) Remember that empty spaces can be used judiciously, but that they can often run too long. I don't have a rule of thumb for not playing, but my advice is if it feels like it's lost momentum, then it has.

 

What I mean by "space-filling runs" is a bit of a trick I learned mostly from about two seconds in Jimmy Page's solo in "Stairway To Heaven." At around 6:42-6:44, he very effectively does just what I'm talking about. He uses a short, interesting lick, repeats it a few times, and then breaks the cycle. It's compelling. Also, listen to some Duane Allman for more of what I'm talking about. He does a lot of this, and it sounds interesting because it builds up to something else. However, I have to say that it doesn't always work out right. Sometimes if you repeat a lick too many times, and maybe you lose track of the piece's rhythm, then you actually lose momentum and it backfires on you, in a manner of speaking. It's a bit of a nuanced technique, so if you plan to use it, practice it a lot to get a feel for it. This is also where practicing with a metronome comes in handy, to get you used to manipulating feel while maintaining rhythm.

 

When I talk about referencing melody, I don't necessarily mean play the melody straight out as it is. I really mean to reference the melody, in a loose sense--if you create a sound that's reminiscent of the melody, without being a blatant restatement, it often makes for a very compelling solo. It was done very often in swing music (I'm thinking mostly the ensembles employed by Benny Goodman, Louis Armstrong, and Glenn Miller), and so listening to swing is, IMHO, a really good place to start thinking about this. However, in more of a blues/rock context, check out Gary Ray Thompson's intro in this song (and dig the tone also, because it's really sweet):

[YOUTUBE]

[/YOUTUBE]

 

As far as creating mood and using expressive articulation, there's no better example I can think of than Neil Young. Just for starters, listen (if you have or can find a copy) to his solo on "F*!#in' Up" off of Ragged Glory. It starts at around 2:07, and it uses very (and I mean very) few notes. What he does, though, is establish a mood and a feel through expressive use of dynamics and tonal variation. I feel like, in context, it's a tasteful and appropriate solo.

 

Actually, here's a video of him doing that tune. Check out 2:47-3:36 (that's the bulk of the solo,) it's the same basic idea. Tonal variation, building and releasing tension, expressive articulation:

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ewKdLEBcHRQ[/YOUTUBE]

 

I hope that helped, and that it wasn't too much to read.

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I was just reading the Gibson Interview with Randy Bachman. I like his solo advice:

 

I think Peter Buck of R.E.M. once said about a certain solo: “It’s only one note but it’s the right note.”

 

Exactly, you play the right note in the right spot and holes, just like The Beatles’ guitar solos, they seem to have every solo – it’s the right thing that the song needed. And they are all very sing-able. I can sing you every Beatles guitar solo and you could probably sing it too. They were just very melodic, as if George Martin composed them or the guys in the band actually composed them as counter-melodies, because that’s what they were.

 

I think those Beatle solos are ingrained in the songwriting.

 

Right, well I mean a lot of guys say, “Well, I’m in the key of A. How many notes can I play? And what licks can I play? And I will put them all in so everyone thinks I’m great.” And there’s other guys that sit back and go, “Gee, here’s a space here, what can I put in there and you sing it. Lenny Breau taught me that also. Sing it first in your head, then you can play it, then learn to play it. Just tell your head to tell your fingers to play the notes. And when other people hear it, it will stay in their head. Don’t play anything that people can’t sing back to you.

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I was just reading the Gibson Interview with Randy Bachman. I like his solo advice:

 

I think Peter Buck of R.E.M. once said about a certain solo: “It’s only one note but it’s the right note.”

 

Exactly' date=' you play the right note in the right spot and holes, just like The Beatles’ guitar solos, they seem to have every solo – it’s the right thing that the song needed. And they are all very sing-able. I can sing you every Beatles guitar solo and you could probably sing it too. They were just very melodic, as if George Martin composed them or the guys in the band actually composed them as counter-melodies, because that’s what they were.

 

[b']I think those Beatle solos are ingrained in the songwriting.[/b]

 

Right, well I mean a lot of guys say, “Well, I’m in the key of A. How many notes can I play? And what licks can I play? And I will put them all in so everyone thinks I’m great.” And there’s other guys that sit back and go, “Gee, here’s a space here, what can I put in there and you sing it. Lenny Breau taught me that also. Sing it first in your head, then you can play it, then learn to play it. Just tell your head to tell your fingers to play the notes. And when other people hear it, it will stay in their head. Don’t play anything that people can’t sing back to you.

 

 

 

 

There you go.... Nuff said

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I was just reading the Gibson Interview with Randy Bachman. I like his solo advice:

 

I think Peter Buck of R.E.M. once said about a certain solo: “It’s only one note but it’s the right note.”

 

Exactly' date=' you play the right note in the right spot and holes, just like The Beatles’ guitar solos, they seem to have every solo – it’s the right thing that the song needed. And they are all very sing-able. I can sing you every Beatles guitar solo and you could probably sing it too. They were just very melodic, as if George Martin composed them or the guys in the band actually composed them as counter-melodies, because that’s what they were.

 

[b']I think those Beatle solos are ingrained in the songwriting.[/b]

 

Right, well I mean a lot of guys say, “Well, I’m in the key of A. How many notes can I play? And what licks can I play? And I will put them all in so everyone thinks I’m great.” And there’s other guys that sit back and go, “Gee, here’s a space here, what can I put in there and you sing it. Lenny Breau taught me that also. Sing it first in your head, then you can play it, then learn to play it. Just tell your head to tell your fingers to play the notes. And when other people hear it, it will stay in their head. Don’t play anything that people can’t sing back to you.

 

 

THATS IT!!!

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