DrGregC Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 Several years ago I purchased an Epi LP Special from my local Sam Ash. Love the look and sound of the guitar, but I never play it. It will not stay in tune. I have been advised to swap out the original tuners but have been reluctant to do so due to the relative cost vs. the value of the guitar. Need a recommendation for some good replacement tuning machine heads that will keep the guitar in tune and are an east replacement. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 you ought to be able to put a set of grovers in there with no problem. I'll have to look up the old lp specials and see the tuners. But import tuners , no name brand, will also do the job and last, and for less money. I'd say check AllParts.com and WDmusic.com and just choose a nice set of closed back imports. I don't have my catalogs handy or I'd look 'em up for ya. You can pm me and I'll give you part numbers and urls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iansmitchell Posted August 1, 2008 Share Posted August 1, 2008 store.guitarfetish.com They sell whole sets for 22 bucks, much improvement over the no-name asian ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RotcanX Posted August 1, 2008 Share Posted August 1, 2008 Yes, the Special IIs (and the Juniors) have particularly cruddy tuners. I've found that the best replacements in terms of cost are the Dixon brand keystone tuners, which sell for around $25 a set up here in Canada. These are far cheaper than any other set of keystones I've been able to find and they hold tune very well. You might still have to open up the holes a tad to get the new bushings to fit but it's worth the effort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrGregC Posted August 1, 2008 Author Share Posted August 1, 2008 For TWANG and anyone else who wants to help, the guitar is an Epi LP Special II (serial 0999090066) purchased from Sam Ash in December 1999. Thanks for all of your help. Although a newbie here, I belong to several other message boards and have never received so much help so quickly. Thanks muchly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobinTheHood Posted August 1, 2008 Share Posted August 1, 2008 This might be a dumb question, but have you changed out the original strings? A bad set of strings will make the problem even worse. I'm not trying to discourage you from replacing the tuners by any means. You definately should. But it may help out in the meantime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrGregC Posted August 1, 2008 Author Share Posted August 1, 2008 I changed the strings several times during the first year or so after I got the guitar. It did not help the tuning problem. Thanks for the suggestion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigtufguy Posted December 31, 2008 Share Posted December 31, 2008 Hello, I have a question I hope someone will be able to help with. I'm a newbie to the electric forum so please bare with me. I just purchased a new epi LP Special L/E Deluxe. Black with gold hardware. I bought it because I have two acoustic epis and have had great luck with them and love playing them (I use the term "playing" VERY loosely). I was considering a squier affinity strat but chose the epi again, because it got better reviews around the web. The only consistant problem I seem to see mentioned was the guitars inability to stay in tune. Lots of recommendations to upgrade the tuners. I am obviously looking for a direct replacement without having to do any modification the the peg holes. After some internet research, I am considering the Grover 205G tuners found here. Could someone tell me if these will fit without any modification needing to be done ? Also any thoughts on these tuners. Grovers seem to get good reviews. Lastly, any opinions on anything else to look for on this guitar. I know it isn't going to be a true Gibby LP for $150. I'm just looking for a decent sounding , dependable guitar that will be easy to play and that I will not get frustrated learning on and will enjoy playing. Thank you. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted December 31, 2008 Share Posted December 31, 2008 For TWANG and anyone else who wants to help' date=' the guitar is an Epi LP Special II (serial 0999090066) purchased from Sam Ash in December 1999. Thanks for all of your help. Although a newbie here, I belong to several other message boards and have never received so much help so quickly. Thanks muchly. that picture helped.. yeah, those tuners suck. I've got a box full of those type. I've got a set of three per side, kluson imitations.. they will pop right in. and less than 22.00, too.. I'll look up the price on them and get back to you when I take another coffee break today. First I want to pull them out and mount one and make sure they're good. they were bought as replacements for tuners like yours, I think the ratio is 14:1 or 16:1.. I'll give you a part number, too so you can see them online. I don't have anything in the shop for them so I'll make you a very good deal. If you don't like those, you have to remember any screw in bushing will mean drilling the headstock.. and that grovers, etc, don't have holes that line up. the problem is right there.. those holes are angled.. and only cheap tuners use angled holes that I've found so far. I'll look though.. maybe gotoh or someone has a good replacement that fits perfect. tWANG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted December 31, 2008 Share Posted December 31, 2008 Hello' date=' I have a question I hope someone will be able to help with. I'm a newbie to the electric forum so please bare with me. I just purchased a new epi LP Special L/E Deluxe. Black with gold hardware. I bought it because I have two acoustic epis and have had great luck with them and love playing them (I use the term "playing" VERY loosely). I was considering a squier affinity strat but chose the epi again, because it got better reviews around the web. The only consistant problem I seem to see mentioned was the guitars inability to stay in tune. Lots of recommendations to upgrade the tuners. I am obviously looking for a direct replacement without having to do any modification the the peg holes. After some internet research, I am considering the Grover 205G tuners found here. Could someone tell me if these will fit without any modification needing to be done ? Also any thoughts on these tuners. Grovers seem to get good reviews. Lastly, any opinions on anything else to look for on this guitar. I know it isn't going to be a true Gibby LP for $150. I'm just looking for a decent sounding , dependable guitar that will be easy to play and that I will not get frustrated learning on and will enjoy playing. Thank you. Mike remove a string.. see if the bushing on that tuner is press fit, or screw in.. the bushing is the part on the top of the headstock that fits around the winding post.. If it's press fit.. the grovers will be screw in, which are larger and would mean redrilling your headstock. Also look at the back.. is your screw hole on the back at the same spot as the grovers you showed? if not that would mean drilling a new hole, and having an empty hole to cover up. I'm really busy today, I just came in on coffee break.. but I'll check this out for you and see if I can find the right tuners out there that don't require redrilling.. tWANG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigtufguy Posted December 31, 2008 Share Posted December 31, 2008 remove a string.. see if the bushing on that tuner is press fit' date=' or screw in.. the bushing is the part on the top of the headstock that fits around the winding post.. If it's press fit.. the grovers will be screw in, which are larger and would mean redrilling your headstock. Also look at the back.. is your screw hole on the back at the same spot as the grovers you showed? if not that would mean drilling a new hole, and having an empty hole to cover up. I'm really busy today, I just came in on coffee break.. but I'll check this out for you and see if I can find the right tuners out there that don't require redrilling.. tWANG[/quote'] tWANG, Thanks for your help. I have not received the guitar. It should be here on Monday (maybe Tuesday). I guess I was just planning ahead. If you can find direct replacement tuners, Please let me know. This will be a big time saver and my luthier skills are more than novice. Thanks again. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted December 31, 2008 Share Posted December 31, 2008 will get to it asap.. gotta finish my guards up. TWANG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigtufguy Posted December 31, 2008 Share Posted December 31, 2008 Thank you kindly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted December 31, 2008 Share Posted December 31, 2008 didn't get to it yet. *L* got the guards done though. pretty quick. TWANG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigtufguy Posted December 31, 2008 Share Posted December 31, 2008 didn't get to it yet. *L*got the guards done though. pretty quick. TWANG Thanks, I'll check back later Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted January 1, 2009 Share Posted January 1, 2009 I've got to finish my guards and get them shipped so it may be this afternoon before I figure this out. Meantime. I've got all parts TK 0780-001 and they are packaged three per side, but are actually six in line. So that wont work! I'll get into the site later, you take a look too, if you have time. www.allparts.com under tuners three per side. TWANG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigtufguy Posted January 1, 2009 Share Posted January 1, 2009 Thanks tWANG, I'll look around. The only other info I could find so far was here: http://www.mylespaul.com/forums/epiphone-les-pauls/27807-epiphone-les-paul-special-ii-question-replacement-tuners-setup.html this post in particular "These are typical drop in replacements for your aftermarket tuners on that Special II. The one thing you have to be mindful of is the screw placement in the back (whether it's located directly beneath, or off to the side.) If you have some of those tuners which have 2 screws in the back, then you're probably going to have put a new hole in the back...no worries though...this is a Special II: Buy Grover 205C 3-Per-Side Mini Tuners | Tuning Machine Heads | Musician's Friend Of course mine would need to be in gold (I suppose black would work well also) Please let me know if you find anything on your end. Thanks again. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted January 1, 2009 Share Posted January 1, 2009 taking a look at all parts.. http://www.allparts.com/store/tuning-keys-3-x-3-tuning-keys-tk-7855-010,Product.asp and http://www.allparts.com/store/tuning-keys-3-x-3-tuning-keys-tk-7858-010,Product.asp let me see if those come in gold now. Nope. the tuners at MF mentioned, http://accessories.musiciansfriend.com/product/Grover-205C-3PerSide-Mini-Tuners?sku=361002 have the single screw hole off to the side. But I don't believe it's really going to match yours. the problem is, if we match holes we're down in quality.. only the cheaper tuners have that hole match. So I'd say, give that up, fill the holes with a elmers glued in toothpick.. dot it with a black marker and let it be. Let me check out gold and see what's good. These http://www.allparts.com/store/tuning-keys-3-x-3-tuning-keys-tk-0700-002,Product.asp would work.. doubt they'd cover holes though since the originals are angled. these http://www.allparts.com/store/tuning-keys-3-x-3-tuning-keys-tk-0775-002,Product.asp are the lowest priced in gold.. and would work.. I'd have to guess at their lifespan or accuracy though, at that price. but that is a press fit bushing. and a better tuner than you have, for sure. so they'd fit. and look pretty darn good. Next up in price is a sealed tuner http://www.allparts.com/store/tuning-keys-3-x-3-tuning-keys-tk-0777-002,Product.asp but with a screw in bushing.. usually larger than a press fit bushing. I think yours have press fit not screw in. so you might have to drill the headstock. you'd have to with grovers, too. that's a nice little tuner with strength and smooth turning.. I've used the chrome ones. just to complicate things http://www.allparts.com/store/tuning-keys-3-x-3-tuning-keys-tk-0962-002,Product.asp those are nice also.. but I doubt minis will reallly be any smaller so you'd still be stuck with headstock drilling. up a little in price http://www.allparts.com/store/tuning-keys-3-x-3-tuning-keys-tk-7740-002,Product.asp I'd say that's gonna be a very good bet.. you'd have to drill for the screw in bushing again.. I can help you through that, by the way. But nice tuner and less than grovers. and then http://www.allparts.com/store/tuning-keys-3-x-3-tuning-keys-tk-7905-002,Product.asp grover minis in gold.. and I'd go 55.00 on those plus actual shipping... typically 3.00 to 4.00. I think the minis MAY have smaller shafts.. I doubt it though. If they do, cool beans probably would fit your current holes. If not, back to drilling the headstock. these have a different look http://www.allparts.com/store/tuning-keys-3-x-3-tuning-keys-tk-7901-002,Product.asp and a little less money.. still a great tuner in gold. and here's some gotoh in gold minis http://www.allparts.com/store/tuning-keys-3-x-3-tuning-keys-tk-7762-002,Product.asp quite a few choices there.. minis seem to get the other guys recomendation. I have sprague orange drops and mallory caps, too. I can get you a tusq nut to fit it if you want, or graph tech. Maybe bone I'd have to check for epis though. All prices will be lower than those listed at the pages. To drill the headstock, you put masking tape on each side of the hole.. choose your bit.. wrap several layers of tape around the bit so that it can't go farther than through the headstock.. hold it steady and drill it out. I've only had one thing go wrong doing it that way, and that was because the guitar was like 40 years old and abused.. also was previously chipped so it chipped a bit more. Nothing I could really do about wood that dried out and cheap besides, not problems with yours. the hassle is mini or not a screw in bushing is usually bigger than a press fit.. the shaft size should stay the same minio or not.. mini typically talking about the gear cover size, or the button size only. So I think you have a choice between the lesser priced press fit bushing models above.. which will more than likely be a very nice tuner and much better than stock. Or drilling the headstock. I can't offer to let you try them and then replace, as I wouldn't have anything to put them in if I got them back. black would cost a bit less.. 5.00 or so per set. Hope that helps. TWANG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted January 1, 2009 Share Posted January 1, 2009 ps I'd probably go gotoh minis! TWANG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigtufguy Posted January 1, 2009 Share Posted January 1, 2009 psI'd probably go gotoh minis! TWANG tWANG' date=' That's what I was king of thinking also. Just a couple more questions if I may. 1. What is the difference between the following http://www.allparts.com/store/tuning-keys-3-x-3-tuning-keys-tk-7762-002,Product.asp and http://www.allparts.com/store/tuning-keys-3-x-3-tuning-keys-tk-0962-002,Product.asp It looks like both use a screw in bushing but the screw holes are in different locations. When it comes to drilling, how much material are we talking about removing and would it be possible to use a reamer to widen the top of the peg hole like in the video Thanks for all of your help. I really appreciate it. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted January 1, 2009 Share Posted January 1, 2009 yeah.. you only have to go as far as the bushing goes in.. unless the shaft case is larger, too. and a reamer works. I think the difference is in the case shape, the button style, and the angle of the screw hole leg. 0962 looks like it could line up with at least one of your holes. TWANG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigtufguy Posted January 1, 2009 Share Posted January 1, 2009 yeah.. you only have to go as far as the bushing goes in.. unless the shaft case is larger' date=' too.and a reamer works. I think the difference is in the case shape, the button style, and the angle of the screw hole leg. 0962 looks like it could line up with at least one of your holes. TWANG[/quote'] I'm assuming the tuners look like this If that is the case, I believe you are correct and at least one of the holes would line up. Can you shoot me a price on the 0962 tuners ? Thanks again, Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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