TWANG Posted August 26, 2008 Share Posted August 26, 2008 so.. I checked again. just because it was ok last check. doesn't mean it was still ok. the wire from Cwhatsit to C5.. little short hop underneath. one loose end. test results are: with tubes in and bulb limiter connected: R10 259/247 R12 240 R12 225 forgot to check R3 in all the excitement, sorry. ax 1.... 157 3... .995 6... 149 8... 1.0 6V6 3 ... 235 5.. this buzzes when the probe hits.. 4.8mV.. 7.. 3mV .. on the el84 that's up around 300. what gives? bad tube? 8... 13.38.. and again. that seems low.. forgot to check the dang heaters.. was too thrilled at finding a loose wire. now what? switch to other tube and retest? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted August 26, 2008 Author Share Posted August 26, 2008 second test.. other old 6V6 tube.. took about four minutes.. let it warm only seconds.. bulb went dim right away.. but I noticed it was glowing slightly at the end of the test. pt and ot were relatively cool.. not as cool as not running, but not warm by any stretch. R10 .....279/270 R12 ........263 R13............245 R3...............168 ax 1..........167 3..............1.0 orange to orange 5.5 6.........155.8........no pop when probed 8...........1.1 6V6 3......249 4.....251 5..........5.1mV buzzes as probed 7.......5mV 8...........12.18 gonna go do some reading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cGil Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 If you got a buzz when you tapped pin 5 (the input grid) that's good! The tube's alive! And I noticed you have about 20v drop across the OT now. That's good, too. Pin 7 on the 6V6 is one of the heater connections. Here's a handy dandy tube pinout guide. http://www.amplates.com/images/AmplatesTubePinouts.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted August 27, 2008 Author Share Posted August 27, 2008 I'm on the wrong pc..no pdf files.. have to switch. took another look.. did a ground continuity check first.. and looked for any tiny wires or other such. grn to 6v6 in 8 gives a squeak.. but not continuous. will do it every time. beep! full signal from ground to pins 1 6 7 on the ax full to 4 5 7 and nfb tap all resistor values I could check were on the money. so.. I don't know but it seems to me that I ought to get a pop off pin 6.. but I don't. glad to know that buzz was normal. I checked all the grounds.. pot input both star.. ground paths are all correct as far I can tell. had the diagram right there and everything made sense except the squeak on pin8 of the 6v6 what 'hot' pathways I could test also seemed normal. I know there's a ferret, but it must be Lemi Winks.. *south park fans will know... sort of a richard gere joke* 'cause he's sure not in front of me. I'll go downstairs and read that pdf. right now. I'm still stumped though. my heaters should be around 7? and I'm not sure what's happening at pin8. or why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted August 27, 2008 Author Share Posted August 27, 2008 great chart.. too bad I don't know what to look for. Is there a chart for the symbols? I can't tell some things.. for instance. which pins ought to pass signal, if any, from pin to pin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cGil Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 Okay, translations... ummm Look at the lower section of this page for the I/O chart. http://www.r-type.org/exhib/aaa0027.htm That I/O chart lists the pins of the 6V6 tube and an abbreviation letter for what they do. The little book icon on the chart will take you to the key to abbreviations. Take note of what the graphic symbols inside the tube look like for the corresponding part in the I/O chart. Then you'll be able to recognize the plates, grids, cathodes and filaments, right away whenever you look at tube data pages like these. http://tdsl.duncanamps.com/show.php?des=6V6GT http://www.nj7p.org/Tube4.php?tube=6V6GT Yeah, I know, there's gotta be an easier way. I just can't remember where the link was. Arrrgh! Now I remember where the links were... SEwatt! If it ever comes back online, I should probably take time to copy all the FAQ links. Ya think? Gil... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted August 27, 2008 Author Share Posted August 27, 2008 I'm kinda getting it.. I can tell whether or not the test is showing the 6V6 in operating range.. the pins correspond to the symbols and the voltages are listed on that other page for a 6V6.. I see different listings for Class A use, so I assume that's the operating range. It seems to me, we're going for the third one.. @315V plate. so let's see. pin 3 is anode.. I'm reading 249 I just don't see anything to inform me of anymore there.. pin 4 is screen grid.. range of 180 to 225, I've got 251.. so that's high.. I'll have to look at it a bit and see if I tell how to lower that, I guess. I do see one of the Class A tables reads 250 for this.. but it's with a 250V at the plate.. pin 5 is problematical also.. range of -8.5 to -13 for this control grid.. whatever control grid means..and I've got 12 I don't remember seeing a -, but I'll test again and also see if I can figure out what makes that tick. pin 7 being a heater as is pin 2.. I get .5mV I think that was supposed to be 7.5max? so I'm not getting much to the heaters. ruh roh. pin 8 is cathode..I've got 12... I don't find anything on this for a range.. so I've got something to go on.. better and some cool charts printed out.. and I'll reread some stuff I have which gives different reasons/explanation for voltages. and probably find some values there as well as be able to trace pathways and decide what to swap. the heater thing bugs me the most right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarGeezers Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 Twang, we had that SG V higher than the plate before thingie'... turned out to be a bad solder joint...and as we hear, a tube eater too.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted August 27, 2008 Author Share Posted August 27, 2008 thanks.. getting on it today... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted August 27, 2008 Author Share Posted August 27, 2008 I'm still having some problems figuring out what's what.. I found http://www.electronicrepairguide.com/testing-transformer.html?gclid=CO3CucHOrpUCFQEuxwodZlsaag and http://acapella.harmony-central.com/archive/index.php/t-1042093.html but the first seems over my head and I don't know where to get a small 6.3 V filament transformer. rat shack? I'll go over the solder joints.. but I'm leaning also toward an ot problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarGeezers Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 Never give up, never surrender...!!! Twang, if you didn't live so far away, I'd drop on by to help...for what good that would do ...hahahaha We'll probably be evacuating for Gustav, just not that far ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted August 27, 2008 Author Share Posted August 27, 2008 we don't get many hurricanes up here... but now and the corn blows over pretty good. got a way to test the ot's now.. so that will be handy.. I never was positive I fried any.. but I had some resistors fry so.. it'll be nice to check them all and know what I've got as well as what I've got in this. amps on the side until I get my tester made.. guitars getting done pretty fast. TWANG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eracer_Team Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 I just wanted to add the if you have the current limiting light bulb in while testing voltages your voltages may appear low. It's only used to make sure you're not going to fry anything, then once you've got that, don't use it anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cGil Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 Never give up' date=' never surrender...!!! [/quote'] I have that movie! :) Ahh, don't worry. At the moment, these guys http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/ say all the models are in agreement that Gustave is only pointed a bullseye in your general direction!!! Plus or minus 300 miles, of course. And at the moment they all agree it'll still probably go west of the projected target? According to the models? What the hell are they doing? Did somebody pull NOLA out of a hat and say dat's it? Gil... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted August 28, 2008 Author Share Posted August 28, 2008 I just wanted to add the if you have the current limiting light bulb in while testing voltages your voltages may appear low.It's only used to make sure you're not going to fry anything' date=' then once you've got that, don't use it anymore.[/quote'] I guess it's not really going to protect the ot.. if that's part of the problem.. anymore than it has. So yeah I think I will.. but then. I'm going to set up the ot test stuff after I go to radio shack tomorrow, so I may as well wait and test the ot first. Got four guitars done. 'cept one needs a bit more fret polishing. two to go, two were done already. soon, I'll be going broke on ebay! or.. making enough to build another amp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarGeezers Posted August 28, 2008 Share Posted August 28, 2008 cGil, we seem to be a popular target... TWANG , as a precautionary measure, maybe a good fuse on the OT??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted August 28, 2008 Author Share Posted August 28, 2008 ok.. got a few fuse holders and fuses.. so.. a neon bulb a 6V battery.. may as well pick up some new fuses.. and a some solder while I'm at rat shack.. and then to work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cGil Posted August 28, 2008 Share Posted August 28, 2008 I can't stand the suspense! Worse. That darn JAWS ditty keeps rolling through my head every time I check this thread now. Fix it! Fix it! Fix it! Fix it! Fix it! FIX IT! ;) Gil... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted August 28, 2008 Author Share Posted August 28, 2008 Sorry man. Had to do the shopping thing... went with my son and caught Hamlet2.. I laughed so hard, my nose started running and spent the last 20 min of the movie trying not to snot on people.. that url said a neon bulb.. rat shack said.. they must be nuts, that would be expensive.. which I thought, too. so I just got a lantern bulb.. will that work? Seems to me it ought to but.. d'oh! So. tomorrow for sure.. but I have to get at least one guitar finished up first. But yep. test the ot's tomorrow and I'll reflow solder first, too... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cGil Posted August 29, 2008 Share Posted August 29, 2008 Sorry man. Had to do the shopping thing... went with my son and caught Hamlet2.. I laughed so hard' date=' my nose started running and spent the last 20 min of the movie trying not to snot on people.. that url said a neon bulb.. rat shack said.. they must be nuts, that would be expensive.. which I thought, too. so I just got a lantern bulb.. will that work? Seems to me it ought to but.. d'oh! So. tomorrow for sure.. but I have to get at least one guitar finished up first. But yep. test the ot's tomorrow and I'll reflow solder first, too... [/quote'] Lantern bulb for a transformer test? Nope. Lantern bulbs will work on DC or AC. Sorry. It's gotta be a neon bulb. Neon bulbs only work on AC, not DC, and that's what's being taken advantage of to test the windings. When you apply the battery to the transformer, it creates a field. When you remove the battery, the field collapses. But transformers being transformers, it resists that change, IF, the windings are intact. If so, the neon bulb will light up for a split second. But, if the windings are shorted there will be no momentary 1/4 wave of "AC", and the bulb won't light up at all. It's gotta be a neon bulb to be able to determine if the OT works or not. Gil... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eracer_Team Posted August 29, 2008 Share Posted August 29, 2008 remember this bulb is only a short little thing maybe 1/2~1" long, we're not talking Vegas here. maybe this might work: http://www.radioshack.com/sm-120vac-neon-lamp-assembly--pi-2062374.html R-Shack has 7 matches in thier search and all rated at 110 or 120vac. I remember reading that "secret transformer test" article like sometime last year, can't remember what voltage they recommended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cGil Posted August 29, 2008 Share Posted August 29, 2008 Yeah, never trust a Rat Shack clerk to know anything about anything. Okay, maybe they know what batteries my cell phone needs, but that's about it. Oh yeah, as to the recommended battery for a transformer test, who cares. I just use one of the 9volts I have scattered about the bench. Gil... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted August 29, 2008 Author Share Posted August 29, 2008 connect a common neon lamp like the venerable NE-2 bulb that's all the info they gave.. the pic looks like the ET RShack bulb.. http://www.premierguitar.com/education/images/200704_techviews_1.gif I use a 6V lantern battery, but any DC supply will work as long as it will not be damaged by being connected to a low-resistance transformer winding. sez he.. as if I'd know if it would be damaged.. I'll go with Gils 9V. But... should I have the kid pick up that "120VAC Neon Lamp Assembly (2-Pack) " ?? link http://www.premierguitar.com/Magazine/Issue/2007/Apr/The_Super_Secret_Transformer_Tester.aspx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eracer_Team Posted August 29, 2008 Share Posted August 29, 2008 did a quick googlly on NE-2 and got this... http://www.donsbulbs.com/cgi-bin/r/b.pl/neon%7Cne2~usa.html rated 120v so the Rat Shack stuff should work Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted August 29, 2008 Author Share Posted August 29, 2008 great.. hope they have one in stock... will have the kid pick it up when he goes to work. thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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