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Gary Moore sound from epi valve junior?


mrjones200x

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Finally found the tone im looking for. Gary Moore from the song "Parisienne Walkways"

 

What mods you rekomend for this sound? Can play my heavier stuff on the Vox but this is gotta be for this. I love blues and this song sings tone all the way to me.

 

Was thinking of

 

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Alnicomagnet-Mod-Kit-Epiphone-Valve-Junior-V-3-amps_W0QQitemZ360067253576QQcmdZViewItem?_trksid=p3286.m20.l1116

 

To improve the amp overall as a start

 

Then a tone control mod (tweed or bitmo or are they the same?)

 

Do you reakon he uses a pedal or is it real raw tube tone?

 

Also what sort of output would be a good starting point when choosing pups for this kinda tone

 

Cheers fellas

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tweed and bitmo are different.. I've not done the bitmo so I'll shut up about 'how different'.

 

Those are decent mods and will help the amp quite a bit.

 

"Line-Out Jack with built-in ground lift. Rather than take the line-out signal from the pre-amp output, I decided to take the signal after the output transformer, thus giving it the true output valve distortion sound. Now there is no need to mic up at a gig, simply run a lead from the line-out jack to the mixer desk, or into a more powerful amp, with no more worries over microphone feedback."

 

I'll have to search the faq for that.. sounds good.

That doesn't seem a bad price, and with instructions, even better.

The parts don't cost all that much, but you'd have to mess around a bit to find it all.

 

I don't know what gary moore uses for pups.. google his gear!

Lots of guys use pedals.. so I wouldn't know that, either.

 

I also don't know what amp he used to play that tune.. different tubes sound different!

As an overall good idea though, the MM kit seems reasonable.. given I don't know what a pound is worth is USA buckeroonys.

 

on the other hand.. we have a faq. first post at this site.. and reading through some of that may lead you to other options.

and when sewatt.com is back up.. soon I hope.. you'll have a whole room full of monkeys.. er.. amplifier technicians, to help you out.

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It's been a long time since I've played that, or heard anything about Gary Moore for that matter...quite a few years to tell the truth. I do remember plugging into a DOD FX7 multi effects unit of all things. I used an EQ setting out of it that I couldn't duplicate with anything else I had at the time......was using an open back Fender tube amp and the DOD gave me a close back sound, or more bottom end with out getting boomy. It was a small princeton amp and the sound guy just mic'd it.

 

I don't remember what second amp Moore used back then though. I'll check when I get home, but as TWANG said you'll probably find an answer quicker on the web. I do know he was using one Marshall, can't remember model, and I want to say the other one was a Soldano, but again I can't remember.

 

IMO the grit you get out of the valve jr should be enough as far OD...that is if yours sounds anything like the one I tried a few weeks ago. Add a delay and a EQ pedal to it and you'd be darn right on it.

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Thanks so far. No really fussed on his gear as i'll not own it so will try to get sound out of my epi valve junior. I have std pups in my LP std. Are these high enough output for this style of playing? Im looking to upgrade them.

 

So you reakon only delay? And a touch of reverb maybe?

 

Thanks again will look on net for info on him

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Are your humbuckers in your LP hot enough? I'd say yes for sure..LOL...when I played this I used my Strat.

 

I do know he used a Gold Top LP quite a bit given to him by Peter Green, so if you do want to change pickups I'd start checking there. Personally I wouldn't worry to much about that though. Like I said I'm not that talanted at all and managed to pull it off with single coils...or close enough anyhow......then again I had some folks help with the tweaking too.

 

As far as reverb or delay goes. I prefer delay for stuff that requires some kind of sustain, or a bit of grit, because I get all splattery( not sure if that's a word) and out of control with reverb. A shot of delay with no repeats, quick slap back, just to fatten the sound up works better for me for that. Just a matter of a persons taste.....or abilty which I'm definitely limited. Like Clint Eastwood said..." a man needs to know his limitations"....so use pedals.

 

Being handicaped, and a cluts, with pedals I learned at an early age how to rely on volume and use it....which BTW is the key to sustain IMO and not distortion. Once you couple with the speaker you'll know, and use the guitar volume to control it.

 

IMO I think you have the tools at hand to get you what you want...except for EQ and a bit of verb and/or delay.

 

BTW...I don't use my delay and reverb together to much...if I do I have to turn one or the other way down. Sounds good at home but on stage it gets really washy sounding and doesn't seem to cut through.

 

Also couldn't find anyhting on his amps other than a picture of him in front of a Soldano. I do have a DVD of his, some where around here, where I do remember him using a Marshall half stack also.

 

Anyhow this is my take on this....sorry if not much help. Someone with more talent and knowledge might chime in and point you in the right direction, but I truly belive you're good to go with what you already have...other than some verb or a delay just for fattening. I'd just get close enough, put your finger prints on it and let her rip.

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there's a disconnect sometimes between what people actually used, and the idea that higher output is some key to improvement.

 

Personally, I don't often care for high output pups. they seem to me to lose the tone.. they're just driving the preamp harder..

and somehow, the mojo seems to, if not disappear, shift to voodoo.

IOW they're different but so many of the classic rock and blues guys, even to contemporary, have the usual approx. 8K humbucks.

 

I confess to not having any Gary Moore stuff.. but I've got a ton of blues here..

I have no problem jamming away with my VJ marshall modded.

exact.. nope. some things need sustain added.. but hey, when I'm cranking that VJ up and I don't have enough sustain.. I have a very strong suspicion they either had a way huge amp way cranked up.. or added sustain otherwise.

But tonewise. you ought to get your VJ up to snuff.. and then see if you aren't as happy with what it is as you are with any single sound or tone from anyone.

To me, that's the key. When I can use one little amp and go from zz to ac to jimmy to bb to eric to peter.. etc etc etc..

(sure, switching guitars now and then)..and the only thing 'wrong' is what efx they may have had and the money they got.. I'm

satisfied.

 

TWANG

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I usually hate EMG pups, but in that guitar (can't recall the model, but it was a limited run of early 80's Les Pauls), during that period, he actually did get some pretty nice tones. I believe he was playing into a cranked JCM800.

 

Tough to duplicate that massive wall o' sound with a 5 watt amp, but I suppose that it's possible to get SOMEWHAT in that ballpark...the right speaker/cabinet, the right mods, the right tubes, cranked, pushed with the right pedal, and perhaps with an eq to push up the mids, and you might get in the right ballpark.

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I may be wrong here (and i usually am) but I think his pedal chain starts with a compressor. If you listen to it you can hear that almost "choked" woman tone that Carlos Santana gets. Not saying they sound alike but there is a similar flavor there. Then, I would try a simple overdrive set pretty low, with a touch of reverb and a little delay. I just used a patch on my Zoom G1 and I came pretty close. I think that Gary Moore uses the bridge pickup more, whereas Santana often played from the neck pickup. That makes a heck of a difference right there.

 

As far as your choice of tone mods, I am basically laying out my V3 as per the Baby Vox schematic but I have a Bitmo trio that I am going to add to it as well as a few other things. I like the way that the Bitmo tone control is designed, I felt that it gave me more than a Tweed style did. But thats just me, your mileage may vary. I looked at the Alnicomagnet mods and they seem pretty basic but decided to go with the Bitmo instead. As an aside, Bruce from Bitmo is a great guy, and has been very helpfull. I am afraid that I can't post the specifics of his mod here because that wouldn't be fair to him, intellectual property and such, but I will tell you that he has put a lot of thought into his mods.

 

Oh yeah, and this is my fave clip of Gary Moore:

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I wold disagree with him using the bridge pickup most of the time. In the song i mention he uses the neck pick up for about 90% of it. Have got the live dvd and watched quite a few youtube vids to help.

 

Would you say that Alnicomagnets Basic upgrades package is good and worth the money? I mean would it make my amp better? Would you recomend his bitmo mod too?

 

Thanks

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I haven't seen the video, but as i said, I am usually wrong about that stuff, LOL!!!

 

as far as the Alnico kit and the Bitmo you would have to pick one or the other, they are not compatible with each other.

What I do like about the Bitmo is the way he has set it up with the voicing switch so you can go from clean to mild to wild. Plus, his tone control has a boost feature. For the money, tone wise, the Bitmo is a better choice to me. Now, the Alnico kit addresses more than just tone, adding an extra fuse and a standby switch amongst other things, so it has some pluses as well. I hemmed and hawed for a while myself over them before finally getting the Bitmo.

You need to check out Layboomo's clips on Youtube if you haven't already done so. One of his VJ's is Vox voiced and another is Marshallized. He did a great job on his mods and you may want to pick his brain. You could try picking mine but sadly there isn't much there to pick.:-s

 

It kinds sounds like a Voxy/Marshall hybrid might work, I may have to look into that for my other VJ head in the States.

 

Anyway, here are a few clips that may help you out.

 

Bitmo Trio demo at the NY Amp Show in June.

 

A Grainger (EVJ with a different name on it) with the Alnicomods

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ORt6CY5lVQo

 

And this is Layboomo on Youtube (Hope you don't mind me linking your vids dude!) =D>

 

This is my fave of his, love this tone.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KCN2FtONBfE

 

And I think this may be relevant to your interests

http://albums.phanfare.com/4823592/2133807#imageID=30161762

 

anyway, hope this helps.

Cheers!

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If you are looking for his Still got the blues tone. It's a Marshall JTM45 with the first version Marshall Guv'ner.

I hope you do realise that the original Parisienne Walkways predates 'Still got the blues' by about 10 years? Since then he made numerous changes guitarwise, tho his amps were almost always Marshall. I've understand he owns over a hundred of'm... Pedals are Boss DS1 and/or a variety of Ibanez Tubescreamers.

Lately he seems to favour a Marshall DSL100 and even used some Boss-metalzone type pedal (on the Scars album)

I think the Gary Moore Signature LP was the first guitar that was fitted with Burstbuckers.

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Still Got The Blues is one of my favorites, and not just for the guitar, the lyrics are wonderful!

 

The Bitmo kit I purchased was the Trio, it has the 3-way voicing switch combined with the Bitmo tone control with boost. I Just felt that after modding the board to a baby vox the Bitmo kit would work best for me. As it stands, if I don't like what it does then i can just do something else with it, thats the beauty of the EVJ. I look at it as kinda like the Volkswagen Beetle of the Amplifier world, some people will make it into a Beach Buggy while others will turn it into a Street Rod. The instructions that came with the Trio are simple to follow, just do it one step at a time. There also a number of other mods that you can do to it, and now that sewatt is back online you can go over the FAQs on there. Lots of sound advice (no pun intended) on there.

 

I think that a lot of the more experienced modders would agree though, stay away from TMB tonestacks in the EVJ. A single tone control is all most of them have. Which version EVJ do you have? If you have a V1 or a V2 then you might want to make sure that you have made the basic mods to it first, and then try different tubes in it. If you can wait till I have finished building mine I will post some soundclips, but what i like might not be what you like.

 

Cheers

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DS1 - Harsh, buzzy, fizzy, compressed tone. It is cheap, however, and it can be modded to sound somewhat acceptable, though it's really not worth the effort, imo. Much, much better dirt boxes out there. It's a cheap first stop, before it becomes an expensive door stop.

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DS1 - Harsh' date=' buzzy, fizzy, compressed tone. It is cheap, however, and it can be modded to sound somewhat acceptable, though it's really not worth the effort, imo. Much, much better dirt boxes out there. It's a cheap first stop, before it becomes an expensive door stop. [/quote']

 

Ditto on the DS-1.

 

I belive you'd do better with just an EQ pedal.....can boost the signal and taylor the sound via the EQ sliders. Like I said earlier I belive you pretty much got what you need already as far as grit goes via the jr...or from what I heard on the one I demo recently anyways.

 

BTW....and some might hate this pedal. I know I didn't care for it at first, but if you got your hart set on a new OD pedal I'd give the Bad Monkey a try. I got a used one for 29 bucks and a friend just picked his used one at our local GC for 19 bucks....can't beat them at that price IMO. Great EQ on them too I think. I mostly use an old TS-9, but I like the bottom end boost you can get out of the Bad Monkey that I don't get out of my Tube Screamer. IMO you could forego an EQ pedal with this one. Again not a bad pedal at all IMO at the 20 or so used prices.

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Just saying GM used one...

I bet those are the tunes that I've gone "WTF did he do to his tone?" There are times when I think his tone is just awful, and harsh would be one good word to describe it. I figured it was probably just those damn EMGs and poor eq on the mix or something, but if he was using a ds1, it could very well be that as well.

 

The bad monkey is a tube screamer with active tone controls. For a cheap pedal, it's actually pretty good. Tough to mod, though...SMD stuff.

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DS1 - Harsh' date=' buzzy, fizzy, compressed tone. It is cheap, however, and it can be modded to sound somewhat acceptable, though it's really not worth the effort, imo. Much, much better dirt boxes out there. It's a cheap first stop, before it becomes an expensive door stop. [/quote']

 

 

One big +1 on that. I ditched it a while back.

 

As for the Digitech Bad Monkey being a good Tubescreamer clone....

I give it a +1 also (IMO). Not quite as much saturation as the Tubescreamer, but the low and high tone controls let you get past the midrange hump that all Tubescreamer clones with just 1 tone knob seem to have.

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I bet those are the tunes that I've gone "WTF did he do to his tone?" There are times when I think his tone is just awful' date=' and harsh would be one good word to describe it. I figured it was probably just those damn EMGs and poor eq on the mix or something, but if he was using a ds1, it could very well be that as well.[/quote']

 

I read an article about the recording of "Parisienne Walkways" about how suprisingly restrained the sustain was on the recording compared to the live performances. They commented on how this shows how the inherent sustain of the guitar and the volume of the amp are what's crucial to holding long notes rather than the amont of distortion. Could be he might have been trying to duplicate his live sound in the studio with the help of some aides and not worked out to good....maybe? Then again it don't seem to hinder Santana's sustain on his recordings though....I don't think so anyhow.

 

The bad monkey is a tube screamer with active tone controls. For a cheap pedal' date=' it's actually pretty good. Tough to mod, though...SMD stuff. [/quote']

 

Yes sir you be right, and I do know this about it being a Tube Screamer clone.

 

One thing I find in common with most of the TS-9 or TS-808 clones coming out is that they all do or try to take out the mid range bump that the tube screamers are noted for...or what it appears to me. At low volumes a TS-9 or TS-808 is really nasty sounding I think, but at stage volumes it's where IMO they shine. I find you need that mid range hump to cut through the mix. Some of the clones with out it, or without a good EQ on them, just turn to mush on stage...LOL...or what happens to me anyhow.

 

I normally don't bother at home with effects, but this Bad Monkey is becoming allot of fun to play with. I've only had it for a month, maybe(?), so haven't taken it out yet.....to chiken. However the EQ's on it are pretty responsive where you could use it just about anywhere I think. I still cary old faithfull with me though, but for a 20 or so dollar pedal it's not bad at all so far, even if it don't make it to the show.....Lord knows I got more expensive ones in my Pedal Cemetery.

 

Sorry for going OT here, but I do have to share this with you guys. Anyhow I think I might have made a big mistake yesterday. I played an original vintage '65 Vibrolux Reveb and I think I'm ruined....don't want to know about pedals, other amps, or whatever. Man what an amp, and what a fricking price tag on it too. Still....one incredible sounding amp. I played a Casino through it and a semihollow with humbuckers, and it just sounded amazing....even bad notes sounded good. This is where tubes and SS, amp modeling or whatever part company big time IMO. Should have never played this thing :) .

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The bad monkey is a tube screamer with active tone controls. For a cheap pedal' date=' it's actually pretty good. Tough to mod, though...SMD stuff. [/quote']

Has anyone tried the new Danelectro Coolcat Drive? I got the Drive and Metal1, and have been A/Bing them against my Badmonkey

thru my Special and Junior, and Twin Reverb.

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