NY mini-humbuckers

[Ricochet]

What is so special about these? Aren't they just mini-buckers in construction? Is NY just a reference to ancient times, or is there a substantial difference in construction and sound compared to regular minis?

[rpach10115]

My alleykat has become my new faviorite player because of the sound of the ny mini.

 

Cranked through a 100 watt marshall, they sound awsome. I like a thinner sound and these do the trick. Not much midrange either.

 

I dunno, I own a room full of guitars and I always seem to gravitate to the allykat for this reason.

[charlie brown]

Hmmm, well...most of what I can find, designates the original NY Mini's as being on early Epiphone "Jazz" guitars...usually

mounted at the end of the neck OR, on the pickguard. From photos, you can see that some have the poll pieces covered,

and others had them visible, but smaller screw heads. The "Firebirds" had the covered versions, too. It doesn't mention

anything about how they might be different (magnets, or windings, etc.) from the current "Mini-humbuckers" without the

NY moniker. There is probably Some difference, but how much, and to what extent that effects the tone, who knows? I

would venture to guess the covered (non-pole piece visible) versions have a bit "thinner" sound. At least, that's been MY

experience, judgeing from the difference in an old "Firebird," that a friend of mine has, and my '76 LP Deluxe. I think too, that the NY moniker is a carry over, from the old days, to describe the Mini's...accurately, or not....

 

Where's "Uncle Al," when you need him?! LOL! He'd no doubt know!

 

CB

[jcwillow777]

I was looking at a guitar a while back with minis in it. I mentioned looking for NY minis and was corrected by Spud and Iconoclast before they got banned.

 

http://forums.epiphone.com/Default.aspx?g=posts&t=1391

[charlie brown]

http://300guitars.com/index.php/articles/gibson-mini-humbucker-vs-gibson-firebird-pickup/

[Nelson]

I was looking at a guitar a while back with minis in it. I mentioned looking for NY minis and was corrected by Spud and Iconoclast before they got banned.

 

http://forums.epiphone.com/Default.aspx?g=posts&t=1391

 

You people is gonna make my head explode!

 

In this world there are three things:

 

1. Epiphone New York pick ups-A SINGLE COIL pickup used by the original Epiphone company IN NEW YORK (not Shanghai or where ever they're made now) and were used on Epiphone guitars made both by Epiphone and Gibson from 1949 until 1961.

They look like this:

 

 

 

2. Gibson Mini Humbuckers (originally called "PAF" Mini Humbuckers upon their introduction c.1961) were developed because when Gibson bought Epiphone in 1957 they got a boat-load of component parts as well in the deal and Gibson decided to make use of these parts' date=' including the "New York" pickups until the supply was exhausted about 1961. Single coil pickups were old technology in 1961 so Gibson developed a smaller humbucker that would fit in the "New York" rout thus eliminating the need to change tooling while maintaining the distinction between Epiphone and Gibson models. These were used exclusively on Epiphones until the Gibson Firebirds of the mid 60's (the ones used on the Firebirds didn't have exposed pole pieces) and then on the Les Paul Deluxe and other models during the Norlin Years (1969-1986). They look like this :

 

[img']http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk108/MrGregzy/IMMHRCH.jpg[/img]

 

3 Some time in the late 1990's a marketing person for Epiphone, while out of his mind and high on Mountain Dew and Ramen noodles (a deadly combination), came up with "New York Mini Humbuckers" for the Asian knock-off pickup Epiphone was using in models like the Riviera...a little too much sodium and caffeine and "voila!..I imagine they thought it gave the pickup some credibility calling it a "New York something or other" pick up and maybe even hoped people would confuse it as being made in the USA...it ain't..they kinda look like the Gibson version (see above) but don't have shielded leads and every one I've ever heard was so microphonic you could sing through them...but someone is certain to tell you differently so we'll just leave it at that.

 

I need to take my meds.

 

Nelson

[snookelputz]

Additional legendary tales say the surround ring was sized to adapt the existing NY pickup into P-90 cutouts of existing guitars.

[Nelson]

Additional legendary tales say the surround ring was sized to adapt the existing NY pickup into P-90 cutouts of existing guitars.

 

I've never heard that but I've seen a few pre-'57 Epiphones that were adapted to use P-90 in some pretty horrific ways. The New York pickup, as pickups go, was pretty thin-sounding and with none of the "meat" of a P-90 so the change out was understandable. The P-90 was also very close in size and was used to replace the Epiphone mid 40's "Tone Spectrum" pickups. In the late 60's/early 70's a lot of people were pulling out the Minis and routing their LP Deluxes to use full sized hummers. The "Les Paul Model" (c.1968) originally came with P-90s and they screwed up the routs on quite a few of them which required a "goof ring" to hide their mess which may be where your "legend" is derived and when the Deluxe was introduced (c.1969) they used the same tooling processes (NORLIN!) as the P-90 to stuff in the Mini Humbuckers that they had left over after they stopped most of the Epiphone domestic production (c.1969-some domestic production continued until August 1970). At the time there were a lot of loose mini humbuckers floating around but nobody wanted them untl they discovered they could very carefully remove the insides and put them sideways in a Telecaster neck pickup can...you can't use a mini humbucker without the cover...they aren't constructed the same way as a full-sized humbucker and are EXTREMELY delicate so don't rip the covers off your mini humbuckers.

 

Nelson

[charlie brown]

Yeah, and the "Mini-humbuckers" are somewhat notorious for going "Mircophonic!"

At least the old ones were. I think the modern ones (Gibson) and Asian, are wax

potted now, so they probably won't. But, I had my old Gibson ones wax potted,

and they're great, now! Before I had that done, they had become totally useless.

Wild feed back, at even moderate volume. Now...nothing! Just great tone!!

 

CB

[Ricochet]

I'm glad there's stil some expertise left...Sorry for my ignorance guys... They generally come fitted on archtops which are not exactly my main interest.

 

What sort of a construction do the original NY-ers have? It's a singlecoil but I noticed all polepieces are at one side?

[GlennW]

What sort of a construction do the original NY-ers have? It's a singlecoil but I noticed all polepieces are at one side?

 

I was looking at that picture and wondering the same thing. I'd guess it's a sidewinder single coil (only smaller) like the first Gibson EB-1 bass pickups with the pole pieces on one side (instead of being in the middle like on the later EB-0s and EB-3s). Check my avatar for the early bass pickup (I'll get a photobucket account one day...).

[Ricochet]

I'd guess it's a sidewinder single coil (only smaller) like the first Gibson EB-1 bass pickups with the pole pieces on one side

 

Interesting. Tnx Glenn!

[lpdeluxe]

This is interesting. My main electric is a '70 Gibson Les Paul Deluxe with minis. When the bridge pickup went dead, I changed over to Seymour Duncan SM-1s, which are very similar in sound to the originals, thank goodness.

 

I had wondered about the difference between LP minis and Firebird minis, and thanks, Charlie Brown, for helping out. Of course, much of the difference in sound you hear from a Deluxe or an FB will come from the differences in materials and construction, but it's useful to know that one won't substitute for the other.

 

To me, the mini sounds much better than the full-size humbucker. I never heard an LP with the larger ones that I liked, but immediately loved the sound of my Deluxe. Sometimes I'm tempted to convert my Sheraton II to minis, but I've got its SD Jazz and JB humbuckers dialed in pretty good now, so maybe I'll leave it alone.

[charlie brown]

Mini's have that nice compromise between single coil "spank," and humbucker smoothness (and noiselessness,

of course). I appreciate that in the neck pickup, especially...more "sparkle," less "Mud!" I'd forgotten (prior to

getting my LP Deluxe's pickups wax potted) how wonderful that guitar sounded. Now, it sounds amazing! My

"USA" Sheraton, and Korean Riviera both have them, as well. Love 'em!

 

CB

[layboomo]

Yup I'm a fan of mini's too have been ever since my first Les Paul deluxe in high school.......those early mini's did have a reputation for going microphonic and alot of guy's swapped em out with Duncan's or full sized humbuckers ....or the best option IMO....these early 70's NOS Lawrence mini's......GREAT pickups too!

[GlennW]

I've read that there were several variations on the early Firebird pickups; some had one magnet, some had two; none had screws for pole pieces. I'd guess the single magnet versions are like a regular HB and have metal plates for the poles and the magnet is positioned between them below the coils; and the two magnet versions have the magnets where the metal plates were in the one magnet type (inside the coils) with a metal plate across the bottoms of the magnets.

 

Variations in those metal plates will alter the sound.