Dave Posted February 27, 2009 Posted February 27, 2009 This article is interesting from a standpoint of real world and theoretical examination of tube amps vs SS amps. Opinions? http://www.trueaudio.com/at_eetjlm.htm I was in Birmingham, AL on business this week and had nothing to do one day after work. I stopped into a large local music store (Bailey Bros Music) and walked around for a while. They had the new Peavey Vypyr series in stock. I've had my eye on the Vypyr tube 60 model, but hadn't seen one in person yet. I hooked up and jammed for a while. It's a nice open back 1x12 amp with 2 6L6's and a 12ax7 with a modeling front end. It sounds nice, but I'd have to compare my Vox AD50VT side by side with it to be able to compare the differences. I played tube amps early on in my guitar career, but found the Peavey solid state amps to be great sounding, reliable, and rugged amps once I changed over. Since then I've had several SS amps, including the Peavey Musician 4x12, Peavey Classic30, Peavey Special 130, Roland Cube 60 (stil have) and now the Vox AD50VT. I have never liked the open back combos because I prefer some bottom end in an amp. Closed back cabs seem to sound fuller to me. Now, I'm looking at the Fender Hot Rod and the PEavey Vypyr Tube 60. I'm leaning toward the Peavey because of the modeling and effects built in, plus the foot control of the effects. The tech specs seem to suggest that you can program a combination of effects to the foot switches, something you can't do with the Vox. Anyone used a Peavey tube 60 and can you tell me if effects can be assigned to the foot switches? http://www.trueaudio.com/at_eetjlm.htm
cGil Posted February 27, 2009 Posted February 27, 2009 Tech21 knows that secret. Try one of their pedals like the TriAC, sometime. For best results, try the whole pedal > power engine deal. Stuff like that takes an uncolored amp to get closest to the intended tones, but they still ain't too shabby through a VJr. Still, to my ear, even the best emulations still can't quite hold a candle up next to the real thing. I recently gave up a Digitech GSP1101 that was pretty amazing sounding, and it replaced a well aged Lexicon MPX G2 I'd had since those first hit the market. I'm glad it's all gone. An all analog signal path just sounds 'most' right, and good tube distortions are what gives me the shivers. That's something the digital stuff never did. Scopes and meters can only show so much, and perfectly good audio/electronics theory goes right out the window when it comes to guitar amps. Besides, nobody ever thinks about how the electrons might feel about it. I mean, maybe they just enjoy getting all hot and bothered and then diving off the cathode. Gil...
cGil Posted February 27, 2009 Posted February 27, 2009 If you're intent on a modeler though, may I suggest * (your fav here)* modeler into a Peavey Classic 50/50 stereo rack power amp pushing a couple of EV 12L's. You can snag the Peavey off the 'bay for around $400. This is what I used with my Digitech modeler, and oddly, I liked 95% of the patches. But I only liked maybe 5% with other rigs like my Jr's and Vintage 30's. How weird is that? Used the Peavey/EV's with a Mesa Formula Preamp and the Lex before that. The Digitech was actually better than the Lex, but there were still too many bugs. Gil... oh yeah. Stay away from the high end Digitech stuff. The cheep stuff is what gets the programmer support for firmware fixes. Their flagships only get excuses. Also, that Peavey Classic 50/50 is really more of a keyboard amp (doesn't get dirty till it's way way way loud). Works great as a home stereo, too cuz it's full bandwidth and very musical. But it's also very uncolored for a tube amp! Very loud, and very clean. That's why it works so well with modelers. I bought mine used over 12 years ago, and it's still got the same tubes. It's a great amp, and I can't seem to part with it. Gil...
rafaelh Posted February 27, 2009 Posted February 27, 2009 This article is interesting from a standpoint of real world and theoretical examination of tube amps vs SS amps. Opinions? http://www.trueaudio.com/at_eetjlm.htm To me the differnce between tubes and SS is not the sound or clipping or what they look like trhough a scope. It's more about the bounce or vibe, and response through my guitar controls that I get from a tube amp that I have not been able to get through SS amps yet....and a big emphasis on the yet. I don't really know anybody that can tell the difference between a SS amp and a tube amp just by sound. I can differentiate between a good and bad sounding amp just like everybody else, but whether it's a tube amp or SS amp just by sound...nah. I could care less which I'd play through, SS or tube, but the tube has like I said a bounce type feeling that I don't experience through a SS amp...LOL, probably not making any sense. What's never made much sense to me is those folks that spend 2 or 3 thousand dollar on an tube amp and then plug a 300 or so dollar modeler in them. Why spend that kind of dough on an amp then...for that matter why bother using an amp, run straight to the board.......sorry, getting off topic. Just venting...LOL.
Dave Posted February 27, 2009 Author Posted February 27, 2009 Rafael said: What's never made much sense to me is those folks that spend 2 or 3 thousand dollar on an tube amp and then plug a 300 or so dollar modeler in them. Why spend that kind of dough on an amp then...for that matter why bother using an amp, run straight to the board.......sorry, getting off topic. Just venting...LOL. ---------------------------------------- Yeah, like the artist in the article who had stacks of speaker cabs on stage and played through a SS amp with a tube screamer in front. A string of effects damps some of the response of the tube preamp, imho. And, everyoner will agree that the best tube sound comes from cranking the tubes. Duane Allman and Dickie Betts played through 50 watt Marshalls cranked to 10 early in their career. Jimi Hendrix did that also. In fact, there's an interview somewhere with his tech where the guy modified the pots (inline resistor) so that they limited at around 8 or 9 or so because he was blowing so many heads.
m-theory Posted February 27, 2009 Posted February 27, 2009 "What's never made much sense to me is those folks that spend 2 or 3 thousand dollar on an tube amp and then plug a 300 or so dollar modeler in them. " Yeah, that wouldn't make a whole lot of sense, but then, whoever said that people with money always had an abundance of commond sense and rational thought processing abilities? Nobody that knew what they were doing would likely do something like this. In fact, there's an interview somewhere with his tech where the guy modified the pots (inline resistor) so that they limited at around 8 or 9 or so because he was blowing so many heads. I'd like to read that. I don't know why any tech worth his salt would consider the "cure" for amps "blowing up" at full throttle would be to put a governor on them. If the amps were smoking under full load, it's got something to do with a specific weak point in the amp that should be addressed, not in the fact that the volume control goes to "10." I think I'd find a new tech if mine suggested something like this as a "cure."
Dave Posted February 28, 2009 Author Posted February 28, 2009 I'd like to read that. I don't know why any tech worth his salt would consider the "cure" for amps "blowing up" at full throttle would be to put a governor on them. If the amps were smoking under full load' date=' it's got something to do with a specific weak point in the amp that should be addressed, not in the fact that the volume control goes to "10." I think I'd find a new tech if mine suggested something like this as a "cure." [/quote'] I don't remember where I read the article. I did some Google searching and didn't come up with it. It could have been in a magazine article. The same article talked about how Jimi used to lean on his Wah Wah and rock back and forth. They guy talked about how he beefed up the mechanical components so that they didn't wear and come apart so much. You have to remember that this happened in the 60's when there were no DC fans available and technology was pretty low. I think that if I were his tech and he was blowing tubes with all the feedback, I'd re-bias and drill a 4" hole in the side and install a dryer duct connected to an AC exhaust blower to keep the cool air flowing through the amp...
strangedogs Posted February 28, 2009 Posted February 28, 2009 Actually in the early 70's I played with a Marshall 100-watt Superlead (with no back) and actually had 2 fans in back of it on stage blowing hard. We used to use Teeny-Boppers to "fan" our heads
fenrirlupus Posted March 1, 2009 Posted March 1, 2009 well... what do you want me to say about that? solid state is fine and all... but i think i'd still prefer tube amplifiers... i like to try popping different things in where they don't belong to see if something will work, and i can't do that with solid state... sure, he says that his circut can emulate tube tone... but what tubes? not all 12ax7's sound the same distorted, 12au7's don't sound like 12ax7's, and 6L6 power tubes don't sound like EL84's... besides, the carvin SX series costs more than the valve junior... is it worth having a reliable amp, or do you want to experiment? i have a solid state amp already, so i don't need another... i just need some electro harmonix pedals... the harmonic octave generator, the black finger tube compressor, and "hot tubes" distortion... that is, if i want to use a reliable amplifier.... or for a lower price... valve junior and some mods... but i still want that harmonic octave generator thing... that's gotta sound really awesome.
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.