4epiphones Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 Looking for a Epi ZW Buzzsaw, and I found this on Ebay: But as I see on the pics, there are some difference from those other Epi LP's I have. I have both Bullseye and Camo, and the Ace Frehley model. As you can see on the headstock the white stripe is much wider than on my other two ZW and Ace model. And the rosewood is a little bit brighter one this Ebay-Buzzsaw. And those two screws that keep the tunomatic is different.. Is there anyone out there who can help me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duane v Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 headstock inlays look weird, and the volume pot positioning is consistent with counterfeit guitars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobinTheHood Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 Wow! That headstock is WHACK! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4epiphones Posted May 20, 2009 Author Share Posted May 20, 2009 Don't like this Is there a big problem out there in the world with fake Epi's? Why fake a guitar that's cheap in the first place :( Anyone else who has an opinion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Summerisle Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 Don't like this Is there a big problem out there in the world with fake Epi's? Why fake a guitar that's cheap in the first place :( Anyone else who has an opinion? This question has been asked endlessly at this forum... I guess the best answer is this: Would you order a $2000+ Gibson off e-bay from an unknown seller without seeing the guitar firsthand? Does your answer differ for a $500 Epiphone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axe2Grind123 Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 Also, which finish is easier and cheaper to fake? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4epiphones Posted May 20, 2009 Author Share Posted May 20, 2009 This question has been asked endlessly at this forum... I guess the best answer is this: Would you order a $2000+ Gibson off e-bay from an unknown seller without seeing the guitar firsthand? Does your answer differ for a $500 Epiphone? YES!!! I have bought several guitars from Ebay, and I never had any kind of problems what so ever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Summerisle Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 YES!!! I have bought several guitars from Ebay' date=' and I never had any kind of problems what so ever [/quote'] Oh well, lucky you... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockstar232007 Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 The main thing that caught my eye was, the contour of the top (the bevel/belly is WAY too small), oh, and, not too mention the cutaway looks like SHlT! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockstar232007 Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 When will people learn? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobinTheHood Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4epiphones Posted May 20, 2009 Author Share Posted May 20, 2009 Thank you. I'm f.....!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
z-clay Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 Yes, Fake Epiphones are popping up on sites like IOffer and Ebay. I've seen a Spiderman and a few Zak's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4epiphones Posted May 20, 2009 Author Share Posted May 20, 2009 Yes' date=' Fake Epiphones are popping up on sites like IOffer and Ebay. I've seen a Spiderman and a few Zak's. [/quote'] Report them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vic Flick Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 Don't like this Is there a big problem out there in the world with fake Epi's? Why fake a guitar that's cheap in the first place :( Anyone else who has an opinion? It's not a matter of opinion' date=' fake Epiphones exist. Epiphone President Jim Rosenberg addressed this issue several years ago: [i'] Monday, June 07, 2004 Regarding Epiphone Les Paul Custom Tops Dear Epiphone Customers, As you may have seen, there have recently been some Internet forum postings about a supposed "Epiphone" LP Custom guitar with a "particle-board" or "pressboard" top. PLEASE UNDERSTAND, the image or images of this guitar in these threads is NOT an Epiphone guitar. While it might have "Epiphone" on the headstock, it is a COUNTERFEIT. Just last week we were notified that Korean police (as they have done in the past) raided the infamous Nakwon Arcade in Seoul, Korea. This musical instrument mall is notorious for purchasing and selling counterfeit as well as OFF-QUALITY or REJECTED guitars produced by factories in Korea. Because they cannot export them into the USA, Europe, Japan, etc., these factories sell them "out the back-door" within Korea and ultimately, to unsuspecting customers. Epiphone was and is NOT the only brand being illegally made and sold in Korea. There were other famous guitar brand names ceased by the police and facing the same counterfeiting problems. As a result of this inherent market problem, Epiphone does not currently have nor have we had in the past, an active authorized Korean distributor. We have verified that we have NO RECORD of that guitar with that serial number being sold by our company. Epiphone does NOT use nor have we EVER used particle board or any other similar materials in our guitars. With 131 years of quality and integrity on the line, there is NO WAY we would put that at risk by using inferior materials. On several occasions in the past, we have worked closely with the Korean police to locate and identify counterfeiters in Korea. This has led to many guitars being confiscated and in many cases, arrests. While we wish this was not the case and we are doing all we can to stop it, this type of illegal activity is hard to eliminate completely. Therefore, if you do travel to or live in Korea, please understand there is a big risk when purchasing a brand-name guitar or other musical instrument. If you are purchasing a new Epiphone from an authorized dealer in the USA, Canada, Europe, Japan or other "export" country, rest assured that these are high-quality instruments worthy of the name Epiphone - carrying our limited Lifetime Warranty and backed by the Gibson Musical Instruments. Thank you and if you have any questions or concerns, please feel free to contact our Customer Service Department at 1-800-444-2766 or email us at support@Gibson.com. Best Regards, Jim "Epi" Rosenberg President - Epiphone[/i] Every time this matter comes up, someone asks why would anyone fake a cheap guitar. They're not counterfeiting Specials, they're faking Les Paul Customs and Zak Wyldes. Those are relatively expensive guitars, in the $600 + range. The reason Epiphones Les Pauls cost more than other imports (even though they might be manufactured by the same factory) is due to name recognition, advertising, reputation, resale values... The buyer is paying for all those intangibles. That's why you pay 50% more for a Samick made Epiphone than you do a comparable Samick. So when the counterfeiter knock off an Epiphoney, the are actually stealing the brand, along with all those intangibles I mentioned. Gibson is paying their marketing expenses!!! Now why not just plop Gibson on the headstock??? Well, they do, but they're a lot more successful passing off Epiphone clones. First of all, Gibsons are Gibsons, you buy a Gibby that has a neck with a scarf joint and you know it's a fake right away. OTH, Epiphones are made in many different factories with minor differences (sometimes even major). So it's easier to explain away slight differences between real and fakes as variances between factories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mgrmatt Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 Yes' date=' Fake Epiphones are popping up on sites like IOffer and Ebay. I've seen a Spiderman and a few Zak's. [/quote'] The IOffer site is a joke, I never new about it until someone posted about it on this board.When I checked it out ( a couple of months ago ) the majority of guitars were fakes, postings for Gibson Slash LP Goldtops for $399.00. With that said we all know that fakes are out there, if you are going to buy a new Epiphone buy from an authorized dealer and save yourself the grief. mgm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobinTheHood Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 Oh man, Jerrymac, where was this info a few weeks ago when one of our longtime members was trying to convince a noob that Epi fakes dont exist? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueLesPaul2006 Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 Report them Yes reporting them is much faster than tracking them down at home and punching them in the face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottsgh Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 the zakk wilde axe your looking at was made in usung, korea in august 2007. it's real. that diamond part on the headstock, and the vol. knob, and the cutaway sure do make it look like a fake, but i checked the serial #. unless they lifted the number? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockstar232007 Posted May 21, 2009 Share Posted May 21, 2009 the zakk wilde axe your looking at was made in usung' date=' korea in august 2007. it's real. that diamond part on the headstock, and the vol. knob, and the cutaway sure do make it look like a fake, but i checked the serial #. unless they lifted the number?[/quote']The neck is real, but the body isn't. Just look at the contour of the top, it's WAY too thin. The edge the "belly" (bevel) should be about an inch and a half from the binding, but it's more like four inches, plus the cutaway isn't the right shape. Real Fake (from the OP's ebay link) Here is why the fake, is a fake/3rd (unauthorised Epi). - Compare the cutaway with the REAL ZW LP in the top pic - Look at the overal body shape - Location of the hardware (bridge/tailpiece) - The color of the paint, and the thickness/location of the black lines lines It's really not that hard to tell the difference, if you do your homework first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vic Flick Posted May 21, 2009 Share Posted May 21, 2009 the zakk wilde axe your looking at was made in usung' date=' korea in august 2007. it's real. that diamond part on the headstock, and the vol. knob, and the cutaway sure do make it look like a fake, but i checked the serial #. unless they lifted the number?[/quote'] The guitar dater is not a database of serial #s, it just recognizes a pattern. The forgers know the pattern, they could easily come up with serial # that will appear legit. I'm going to make one up right now: EE05021234 EE means the Epiphone plant in QingDao China. 05 is 2005 02 is the second month February 1234 is the production run Check it out, I bet you it will tell you it was the 1234 guitar made at the QingDao China plant in February 2005. Now try this one EE68021234 I'll bet you it will tell you it was made in China February 1968. Never mind, I'll do it for you: Guitar Info Your guitar was made at the Qingdao Plant (Epiphone), China February 1968 Production Number: 1234 Gibson: Qingdao The Gibson Qingdao Plant was opened in October 2002, Qingdao, China. It is the only plant run by Epiphone in Asia.Both acoustic and electric guitars are made here. The factory is dedicated to making Epiphone and only Epiphone guitars with the aim of producing higher quality guitars. Wow, I didn't know Epiphones were made in China in 1968!!! Pretty amazing since the factory was only opened in 2002!!! So just because the number comes up in the Guitar dater project doesn't mean it's legit. Anyone interested in Gibson serial #s??? Let's make one up 70129234. Here's the guitar dater data: Guitar Info Your guitar was made at the Kalamazoo Plant, USA January 12nd, 1979 Production Number: 234 How did they come up with January 12, 1979??? The first and 4th number is the year 70129234. The three digits inbetween 70129234 is the day if the year it was made, in this case the 12th day or January 12. So 83597234 was made on the 359th day of the year, December 25th 1987. Wait a minute, they work on Christmas??? Your guitar was made at the Kalamazoo Plant, USA December 25th, 1987 Production Number: 234 Of course, the last production of Gibson guitars at the Kalamazoo plant was June 1984. The bottom line is that the Epiphone guitar dater is a useful tool, but you just can't punch in a number and declare that the guitar's legit. All it will tell you that the serial number fits a pattern. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Lister Posted May 21, 2009 Share Posted May 21, 2009 Oh man' date=' Jerrymac, where was this info a few weeks ago when one of our longtime members was trying to convince a noob that Epi fakes dont exist?[/quote']I'm here robin -- and had already spoken to the Rosenberg letter but here are the points once again. They are not fakes --- they're not authorized by Epiphone for sale --- but they are not "fakes" made entirely by counterfeiters either --- they are just super-low quality Epiphone 3rds. As in finished/sold by some 3rd party. 99% chance it was made in the same factory where Epiphones roll off the line everyday. Some are QC rejects sold by Epiphone to recyclers to recover some of their investment in materials/labor -- but the recyclers don't strip/destroy them like they are supposed to do. Instead, they outfit them (cheapo electronics), cover over any major visible flaws and sell them (ebay, etc.). Others are back-door/midnight walk-aways. Jim Rosenberg’s letter is nothing new and nothing more than posturing. Gibson (his boss) stands to lose a lot of money to counterfeiters of Gibson models. He has to say Epiphone is also being faked and is against fakers to make it appear that Gibson/Epi are united against these threats to their brand. He’s not permitted to tell us what he knows about Epiphone 3rds. Not only does Epi benefit from 3rds sales to recyclers, Epi also benefits from being able to lower QC standards (labor costs) even more in a marketplace already flooded with super-low quality Epi 3rds. We on the forum cannot reach consensus on authentic Epi-s anymore b/c of this -- especially on those diamond inlaid headstocks that are all irregular. [NOTE - photos can be sooo deceiving..., ask any photographer. Angles, lighting, resolution, etc. wreak havoc on these forum "comparisons" attempts. No one in his/her right mind should rely on a photo to buy a guitar -- for example, a photo of a genuine guitar can always be used, meanwhile the buyer receives a 3rd or a fake -- and attempts to "authenticate" product or to declare one bogus via photos is really just a crap shoot. Hands-on is the only way to know for sure.] Do these Epi 3rds change the buying equation? I say no. It does not matter to the buyer if the guitar is a 3rd or a is truly one of the rare fakes out there. They are both sub-par quality and should be avoided. Hit every BLUE NOTE baaaby..., I'm going to play on:-" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Lister Posted May 21, 2009 Share Posted May 21, 2009 The guitar dater is not a database of serial #s' date=' it just recognizes a pattern. The forgers know the pattern, they could easily come up with serial # that will appear legit. So just because the number comes up in the Guitar dater project doesn't mean it's legit. **** The bottom line is that the Epiphone guitar dater is a useful tool, but you just can't punch in a number and declare that the guitar's legit. All it will tell you that the serial number fits a pattern.[/quote'] Very true jerry, and a good point to make to new potential buyers out there. And it seems obvious that some 3rds may already have serial #s when they leave the Epi factory. Others are easy enough to pull out of thin air and stamp on a 3rd for anyone "in the business." Hit every BLUE NOTE baaaby..., I'm going to play on:-" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4epiphones Posted May 21, 2009 Author Share Posted May 21, 2009 Thanks everbody. Now I'm set back some hundred $, and I'm left with a fake Buzzsaw!!!! F***!!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RotcanX Posted May 21, 2009 Share Posted May 21, 2009 Let me send you the 10-foot pole that I wouldn't touch this thing with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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