looking acoustic live sounds in early 50's Epi Century archtops

[shapenote]

I've been experimenting trying to find my best live sound. I want something that gets as close to an acoustic sound for alt/folk style strumming and finger picking, but also loud enough to hold up with drum ect. I have an old Vox hollowbody guitar super lynx II.... the ones that were made in Italy around the late 50's early 60's I think. Well that has worked out alright, but I'm considering something like a 1954 Epiphone Century because of the larger body styles. I really don't want things to be extremely twangy. Looking for that acoustic definition though in finger picking and strum. I have an old noname classical guitar I often play at home and really do love the mellow sound of nylon, but still having that punch in the notes and really defined notation in finger picking. Just wondering if you guys would have an opinion for me... wondering if I'm searching in the wrong direction. I've even considered experimenting with the boss ac-3 simulator, but I really want to try to stay clear of any artificial sounds and also be able to play a loud clean live volumes.

 

thanks looking forward to any replies

[jonnyg]

Hi

 

First I'm going to assume that we're talking about an amplified guitar here arn't we?

I only remember the Epiphone Century as a thin line, non-cutaway model with either a P90 type pickup or a small NY style pickup. I wouldn't think you'd have any more chance of a (plugged in) acoustic sound from one of those than you'd get from a Casino and you're certainly not going to finger-pick acoustically against a drummer and still be heard on one of those.

There is the Epiphone Chet Atkins SSL which is a thin line acoustic shaped guitar with hollowed out chambers and a piezo pickup but, as I own one of those, I can tell you that the "acoustic" sound when plugged into an amp is not, to my ears, in any way convincing.

A couple of guitars I've tried which have been pretty good are the Crafter SA Series Acoustic/Electrics and the Peavey Generation EXP ACM Piezo, which for a solid body is surprisingly good. In a band situation they sound pretty convincing although heard in isolation they're not going to fool anybody. If you can afford it the Line 6 700 modeling acoustic is the best I've heard while the cheaper 300 model is as good but with less choice of simulations.

Note that none of the above really come close to a real, good quality acoustic guitar, but in a live situation they're fine. One of the most important factors is the amp you use. For a convincing sound you really need either a dedicated acoustic amp, and there are many to choose from, or to go straight through a decent PA. A regular guitar amp is not going to be good enough because there'll be too much coloration.

Personally, I don't think much of the Boss ac-3, or the older models, but I'm sure Boss sell millions of them so what do I know? Try it and see.

Live acoustic sound without actually using an acoustic is like the search for the holy grail, if you find it please share it here.

 

JG

[shapenote]

Yeah I would be playing with drums, but usually a bit more percussive based. Really though my thought process was the fact that I dont terribly mind my semi hollowbodied guitar....so wouldn't the right larger hollowbody guitar give me more of an acoustic sound. I've had the chance to play a couple. I even tried one of those new Godin 5th ave kingpins which wasn't terrible or great just affordable ha. I actually saw one of those chet atkins on ebay, and it caught my interest. I can understand that in a higher volume situation acoustic sound is near impossible, but getting a bit closer is my goal. What are some of the things you like about your Chet Atkins SSL? Is that style only made as his signature series?

 

To me it seems pick ups also come into play. Trying different types out I think more lo fi pickups end up sounding better. You end up with almost half the volume out of your amplifier, but they seem to pick up more of the tones I'm looking for. Plugging in something with hotter pickups just instantly sound way more electric to me. Do you have an ideas as far as pickups go? Really do appreciate your time! Thanks for the response it definitely helps.

[jonnyg]

Hi

 

It depends really on what kind of acoustic sound you're wanting to hear. An Ovation style electro acoustic is probably a better bet for high volume live work than a mic'd up Martin D45 but for a purely acoustic sound I'd go with the Martin everytime.

The thing with the Epiphone Century that you mentioned originally is that, although the body is relatively wide, it is a thin line so there's not much depth to the body and it certainly couldn't be considered an acoustic by acoustic guitar standards. As an electric, as I said earlier, it's probably on a par with a Casino, albeit with only a front P90 pickup, but a magnetic pickup is not going to give you an acoustic sound that's why acoustics are fitted with under saddle piezo's and more recently a combination of piezo in the bridge and mic's in the soundhole.

As far as body size (depth) goes I also have an old 70's Antoria (same as Ibanez) ES175 fitted with with two humbuckers but plugged in it still sounds like an electric to me, despite being 16 inches wide with a 3.5 inch body depth.

 

Actually I'm not sure that my Chet Atkins is an "SSL" model. It's the same shape and the same idea but mine is older than the SSL (see pic below) with a slighly different pre amp and control system (plus it's a natural finish rather than black).

What do I like about it? It's a nice looking guitar, it plays like an electric, I love the neck, it's got a good sound. However, it doesn't sound like an acoustic although you can get as close as many other piezo equipped guitars by using a decent graphic EQ and some reverb.

 

You're right about pickups. For years I used a Telecaster with the switch set to both pickups on and that was actually pretty good. To my ears single coil pickups seem to work best for what you're trying to achieve. Although a P90 pickup is a single coil they can be pretty raunchy compared to say a Strat or a Tele pickup.

 

I don't know how much (if anything) you're looking to spend but I would definitely recommend you to try the Crafter SA. It's a thinline electro-acoustic with a piezo in the bridge and a Danelectro style magnetic pickup in the neck position. There's a "Blend" control so you can dial up as much or as little of either pickup as you want. I'm actually saving for the 12 string model at the moment as it was really impressive.

 

Good luck

 

JG

 

My Chet Atkins