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neck holes on epiphone sg special


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My past experience with replacing tuners on my Epis has

shown them to be 10mm (assuming you DO mean "neck holes"

for the tuners). Of course, the only SURE way is to remove ONE

from the git and measure the hole, meaning you'll have to have a

"sacrificial string" to be replaced, or find a creative way to re-string

with same string...


Height of post will vary depending on which brand you get, sonething to be

seriously considered when replacing tuners. I've found that the Grovers from

my epi upgrades are too short post-wise to fit in other guitars due to difference

in headstock thickness. Pic is of "typical" "D" tip Grovers...



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Since its a Special' date=' probably with non-die cast tuners, I'm going to guess its the 8mm variety. But I'm basing that on my experience with a couple of Squires, so....

The die-cast tuners were 10mm and the non-cast were 8mm.[/quote']


Robin's post made me think - I'm working on a STAGG SG copy,

has "non-diecast" tuners with PRESS IN bushings on top, and is

completely stripped down. I measured the hole and the bushing OD,

8mm... Hmmmm. Looks like you'll have to measure the hole. Post

pix of the Top and Back of the tuners if you can...

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Don't think its a good idea, substituting tuners. The guitar's tuners are screwed on an axis that runs diagonally. Most of the new tuners I found, even though much much more attactive than the chinese ones, have a hole for the screw on an axis that runs vertically through the middle of each tuner, leaving the previous hole exposed. I wouldn't want to have open holes on the back of my headstock. I found a set of tuners, that are one body, that is 3, on each side, which means they would hide the holes. Unfortunatelly they're gold. I' ll keep on looking...

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I don't think it's a good idea, substituting tuners

Hey Forum Folks, want to add anything?



Fret not!!! (No, wait - you HAVE to fret to play...).

I've had to fill in the "old" holes on 90%+ of any guitar

I've replaced the tuners on... Shoot, I've taken 8mm holes,

drilled 'em out to 10mm, then installed upgrade tuners.

Some folks on the forum prefer "reamers" to enlarge the holes,

but I had access to a drill press and a SHARP bit. I DID do

several "dry runs" to check the accuracy of my bit alignment

before proceeding, though. Results were holes as clean as

a whistle (unless you slobber a lot...).


Take a Wooden Toothpick, remove part of the pointy tip

then test fit to ensure it doesn't completely bottom out.

Then break toothpick in half so the other end is "flat".


(It's easier to do this next step with all tuners removed)

Add a dab of WOOD GLUE to semi-pointy tip of toothpick,

then insert into "old" hole and gently tap with hammer or

similar object until toothpick stops. Then use razor blade to

carefully cut thru toothpick sticking above headstock until flush,

wipe off any excess glue with damp cloth, let dry overnight.


Now either dab paint or correct color of NAILPOLISH on

toothpick "dots", let dry.


Install your NEW tuners, carefully drill new mounting holes for

screws (drill bit smaller than screw diameter), install, DONE!


Piece of cake. After doing it the first time, you'll realize just

how easy it is/was. The Diagonal axis is just the way the

screw holes were placed on that particular tuner style. If

tuner installed correctly (Threaded nut or press-in bushing),

the mounting screw simply provides an anchor to prevent

movement when used....

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Are you a luthier?

Ok tooth pick is a good idea.

I wouldn't use a razor to get rid off the "extra" tooth pick, cause it's kind of dangerous for the paint. I'd use a wire cutter, which is flat.

For the paint I would ask a friend who paints, if you don't yourself, to carefully mix acrylic-that dries fast and is artist's quality, and then add on a 1mm brush stroke on top of the woodie tooth pick. Let it dry for a night. Then polish on top with good quality varnish. I wouldn't use glue cause it would affect the headstock, even macro-wise-that is in a number of years. Plus wood glue is always cheap quality which means it contains accids that would add to the harm being done to the wood.

Any way you do it, my way or your way, there would be, at least a slight mark on the surface of the back side of the head stock.

It wouldn't be perfect 100%.

Perhaps the best way to go about it is to substitute with diagonal axis tuners that fit exactly into the previous holes.

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Well, I use a flat razor blade all the time to remove excess

paint and/or nailpolish (acrylic and shiny) from "drop fills" to

damaged areas, and for toothpick "levelling" - just hold

completely flat, then gently work side to side until cut thru

toothpick is made. If you're careful, you won't mar the paint.


The idea of replacing with exact hole match is good, but SO MANY

OF US have replaced tuners and had to fill old holes and drill new ones.

How the wood glue to hold a toothpick in a screw hole will damage the

headstock wood is beyond me at this point - we use wood glue to repair

broken necks, snapped-off headstocks... But, if you can post a link to something

that TRULY indicates this, I'd like to read it.



Guys and Gals, chime in on this one, please. Is the toothpick idea CRAZY?


We DO have luthiers on this forum.



individual out with his tuners!

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animalfarm' date='


your the best luthier in west texas oilfields

=D>:-k :)




Do I detect "sarcasm"? (heh, heh). Sorry to beat my own drum, but I just

want GEAMAKRIDIS to know I'm not TOTALLY crazy! (I think...) Are too -AM NOT...

Hey, it IS hard to work on guitars with 36" pipe wrenches and chain hoists...


Well, Paruwi? Toothpick? Tuners? Input, Bitte!

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Nobody said you're crazy. As for sarcasm, it would be the person's who mentioned it problem, not mine. Now, if you feel you're part of a team, it is again a notion coming from you and only, and again it doesn't really have to do with anyone else, other than you, since you're the one who thought about it, and spoke about it. Now lets surpass all the irrelevancies, and get to the point.


Now the "painting job" seems to be ok, texture-wise, that is material-wise. But this is all it is. I spelled "acid" with two "c", which is wrong, it is spelled with one "c". Well, have you ever heard of acids? They speed up the decay process into things. This is why according to museum quality standarts, all drawings, are framed using acid-free material. This goes so deep, that even cardboard boxes, made by museum people, to store three dimenssional art-work, are glued with "acid-free" glues, and made of acid free card boards. It grows even more complex: even though such museum quality boxes are made with high standards, using only acid-free materials, the glue used should always be kept hidden so that even it is considered acid-free, it does never come into direct contact with the art piece. If however, such a high quality glue is noticable through, let's say, a crack, then the box is thrown away, and a new box, that would ensure absolute no contact withthe dried glue, because acidity changes duting the passage of time. Have you seen how old paper becomes yellowish? This is a good and evident example of acidity taking over.


Second, wood is a material that shrinks and dilates. So is the wood of the toothpick. And so would glue. So the more factors you bring in, the more shrinking and dilating takes place. and the more difficult to predict it gets. So it is your choise. Do you want just the wood of the headstock shrinking and dilating, or do you want all three materials to do that, at the same time?

Then you might say that the amount of shrikage and dilating is so small that it is egnorable. But then again some one might add that how ever small tha chances of having a significant effect on the headstock might be, he would prefer to exclude any risk factors once and for all, than having to deal with it in the future.


Factor one: acidity.

Factor two: weather condition.

Factor three: sensibility.

No need to be rude about anything. We're just talking.

I appreciate your ability to improve things. It's just that everyone changes things their own way, according to their background, and interests. That's all i want to say. Keep it polite.

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everything said is usefull. it doesn't mean that everything you read, you agree with, or you do the same. It may be usefull to learn aboyt things you are not intending to do in the near future. It helps you understand what the other has to say. Who knows, maybe in the future things change and you might find usuful to remeber something you didn't think you were going to use in the past, but may use in the future. This is what people are doing: they learn all the time, the world is bigger than you think it is. Others know things you don't know, and unless said or read, you wouldn't get the chance of knowing them unless it was for people sharing knowledge. It doesn't mean that everything you hear is true, nor that you have to agree with everything said, but it is always about what's being said, and not who says it. Learning is what it is all about, any way it comes or goes, it is what we are all after.

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good lord all this for an sg special???.... the toothpicks idea is a great one i have used it many times. works well.... on my 1996 lespaul std. i had to drill out my holes to replace the klusens with gibson grovers. that scared me a little but it all turned out great. there are a couple extra holes in the back of the headstock from the klusen mounts but nothing i cant live with.

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Guys and Gals' date=' chime in on this one, please. Is the toothpick idea CRAZY?


No, and from everything I've read about filling screw holes, it seems to be a pretty common practice. I think that YOU might be a little crazy though. But that comes with the creative territory, so just embrace it, buddy.




A couple points about this rapidly deteriorating subject:

1. Replacing tuners with non-matching screw holes happens all the time.

2. A wood drill is potentially more harmful than wood glue.

3. Your hands have acid in them. Its called sweat.

4. Its an SG Special...


If you want to spend 2/3 of the cost of your guitar just to have the tuners professionally replaced, that is entirely your choice. But most of us here use BOTL guitars for experimentation.

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Animalfarm is F@CKING NUTS! Don't let him fool you, he's kinda funny like that...inhalin' all that damn paint he uses don't help either, and we won't EVEN get nto the glue thing. Just kidding, but the toothpick approach was used on a Telecaster I had modified, with quite pleasing results, it truly IS the way to go.

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I got news for you:

just became a vegiterian.


why don't you use a toothbrush instead!




Look, man, do you want the advice or not? So far all of your responses have been long-winded, borderline pretentious psychobabble. I was under the impression that this thread was about swapping tuners on an SG Special. Its a farking 1/2 hour process, for cripes sake! Just change them and be done with it.

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I got news for you:

just became a vegiterian.


why don't you use a toothbrush instead!


Oooooh, this is a "good 'un"! I haven't seen this level of

deliberate provocation or this level of skilled wordsmanship

(you ARE well spoken) since the days of former member(s)

Marx Bros. and ... (Rats! Name currently escapes me!).

Bravo to your command of the language,

Thumbs down to your tossing around insults like confetti!


Matiac, I have some extra toothbrushes - how's your stock

of veggies?

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Oooooh' date=' this is a "good 'un"! I haven't seen this level of

deliberate provocation or this level of skilled wordsmanship

(you ARE well spoken) s[b']ince the days of former member(s)

Marx Bros. and[/b] ... (Rats! Name currently escapes me!).

Nelson ???
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You're way out of line. You should get out if you talk like this. You are not able to project your bad manner on to anyone' date=' certainly not on me or anyone else on this. You are out![/quote']


Out of what? Patience? Indubitably. As well, I'm always out of line. You'll get used to it. The fact is that it is a cheap guitar with cheap parts made from cheap wood...if it is even "wood" at all. Its not a million dollar ancient space-wood guitar. Its the cheapest SG you can buy from Epiphone. New tuners will improve the guitar's playability & value with or without the extra holes. Your making a bigger deal out of this than need be. I have a feeling that you should be more concerned with learning to play your guitar than with superficial aesthetics. Function over form.


I haven't seen this level of

deliberate provocation or this level of skilled wordsmanship

(you ARE well spoken) since the days of former member(s)

Marx Bros. and ... (Rats! Name currently escapes me!).



Its better that way...


Anyway, he's from Greece, so I'll give him a pass on the English language.

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It's one thing to listen, and another to agree or dissagree, listening doesn't mean you have to agree with someone. So you give the chance to say what he wants and remeber he doesn't have to agree with you. You said I should be playing the guitar rather than being concerned with aesthetics. I am not like you. I am not going to tell you, or anyone else what to do. Suggesting is one thing. Telling others what to do, like you are, means you 're so used to, first being told what to do, and then telling others what to do. This seems to be the only way you know how to react to this. And if someone doesn't do what you say then you become a beast! You're continuing the circle. Stop telling others what to do and, life will be easier. Trust me on that one. People have their good side you know too. Just discover yours. And stop judging people, otherwise you'll be involved in a neverending cycle of boring stuff that will keep you feeling bad. This perhaps will enrich your music perception too. Improvisation in music does not mean to repeat your self. It means to hear the other musician what he plays and then you answer back, giving your self the freedom to invent something you've never played before. But first you've got to give people the freedom to be who they are, with out them being who you want them to be. Cheers.

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