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XweAponX

Need help ID-ing an Epiphone G-400(?) SG

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SG1.jpg

SG2.jpg

SG3.jpg

SG4.jpg

 

NO Serial Number - I Believe, when these were made, the serial number was on an ADHESIVE STRIP on the back of the neck (I've seen these at Guitar Center over 15 years ago). As you can see there, it says "Gibson" on the neck adjuster cover.

 

other than that, the HEADSTOCK, Gibson-shaped,

The BODY: SOLID Mahogany, The Tuners, GHOSTS.

Note, NO break in the neck, not a bolt-on.

 

And the Pickups, came just like that - No Covers, just black.

 

If this is a fake, it's a well-made fake.

 

Anyone got any idea what year this was made? I remember a time when you could buy "Epiphones with American Made Bodies" - I think that was in the late 80s? Early 90s? They were all over Guitar Center, priced frmo 300-400 bucks.

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You don't say who, or where you got if from. Could you please tell us?

As far as I know, Epiphone has never made a G400 with that headstock.

And I've never seen one without a "crown" logo, or something between the TRC and the Epi logo. There's nothing on your's. It's just blank.

I have an Epi '97 SG JR. that has the Gibson truss rod cover, and so does my '97 LP in my avatar. They made plenty of these until 2004 (I think that was the year). Both have the Serial # marked directly on the headstock.

 

But I've never seen an Epiphone G400 like that.

 

Oh, and BTW, what are GHOSTS tuners? Never heard of them. Did a google search and found nothing on them.

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Ah! Well, I don't know exactly where it came from, I got it as partial payment for a bunch of work I did on a studio back in 1998. The first time I saw this guitar, was 1994, it was being used in a recording session. I noticed the headstock RIGHT AWAY, and that is was way different then the epis that were being sold in 94. It was the closest thing I'd seen to a Real Gibson SG. But notice, it says "Gibson" on the neck adjuster plate, not "SG" - Which is what it says on both Gibson and Epi SG's. (And I note that you have said that they used "Gibson" on that plate up until 2004, but I bought a new LP Junior in 2001, and the SGs of that year all said SG). The other thing, is the construction, the BODY just feels like a regular Gibson SG, this is mahogany, and it is heavy. On the other hand, a Gibson Les Paul or SG from the 70's will have a metal framework inside of the electronics area, and the POTS will be mounted in the frame- All Gibsons were like this back then, at least the 1976 Les Paul Custom I had was... don't know if they are like this now - but I had an Epiphone Genesis back in 1979, which was very like a Les Paul, but it did not have any metal framework in there, and the jack was on top of the guitar - And it just broke one day, caved in the whole pot compartment. But this, although it has no metal framework in there, it is not in danger of caving in, like several Bolt-On Epi's I've seen.

 

When I say "Ghost" tuning keys, "Ghosts" were actually a brand made in the 80's - I had a a Kramer with a Ghost Floyd Rose whammy bar - It said "Licenced by Floyd Rose" on it. Ghosts were a hardware company, mostly made Tuning keys for Japanese and Asian guitars, they usually had a "G" in the round area on the back of the key. They are very like the tuning keys on new Fenders and Jacksons- I believe those are Ghosts, or what the company "Ghost" became later. They are simply medium quality Tuning Keys. Regarding finding references to these things on Google - Well I just tried to look up "Alesis Studio 24" ADAT system, which is not really that old... Mid 90's - And I found NOTHING, and when I typed in "Epiphone SG with Serial Number on Adhesive Strip" - I found an equal amount of nothing.

 

The reason I was searching that, is that I vaguely remember these being sold for a short time, in the mid to late 80s - I remember seeing them at Guitar center. And that's where I SAW, with my own two eyes, that there was NO serial number actually STAMPED into the wood, just a Lame piece of adhesive, kind of a metallic piece, GLUED onto the wood! With the number printed on it. Now, I have found a couple of references to Epiphones with adhesive Strip.

 

So, this question would go out to folks who did a lot of trading and buying in the Mid 80's - Because that is where I saw a guitar like this - I saw Les Pauls, and SGs - The Les Pauls for 600 dollars, the SGs for about 300. The question is, did I imagine that, or am I remembering wrong?

 

No, there is Nothing on that headstock but the Name Epiphone. If somebody made this guitar, I don't know why they would put a real abalone Mother of Peal Epiphone inlay on the headstock.

 

I looked carefully on the back of the headstock - There are two areas which are kind of rough, so it may be that somebody sanded the serial number off and refinished the neck, but if so, they did a very good job!

 

So, the question remains, what IS this! It sounds pretty much like an SG, I'll eventually change out the cheap Ghost tuners for real Gibson tuners- Those are the worst feature of this guitar. Everything else, the pickups, electronics, are just fine.

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The paper serial number is not their old way of doing it - the paper indicates a factory second.

 

And I am not sure that is a G-400 as they usually have trapezoid inlays. They didn't always have them so, depending on when yours was made, it might be one of the pre-trapezoid models. But I think it is more likely a G-310 or something like that. The uncovered pickups also make me think it is a G-310.

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The paper serial number is not their old way of doing it - the paper indicates a factory second.

 

THANK YOU! That might explain why there is no embedded serial number, and also WHY there were so inexpensive. But if this is a G-310, thats a new area of search. What about the Gibson-Style Headstock? I Do remember in the Mid 80s seeing them like this, although they were using the design they use now, for other guitars.

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I looked carefully on the back of the headstock - There are two areas which are kind of rough' date=' so it may be that somebody sanded the serial number off and refinished the neck, but if so, they did a very good job!

 

[/quote']

 

 

Some Ebony Gibson SGs are like that. I am buying a Heritage Cherry Gibson SG Standard later this month and was looking at them a day or two ago. As I did so, I also picked up a couple of Ebony ones and was joking with the sales guy that their serial numbers were almost non-existent. One was bad and the other you could barely distinguish at all - you could only read it if you held it so that the light hit it at a certain angle. Both the sales guy and I were joking that Gibson was now making them so that they are only visible under black light as a way to fool the counterfeiters. This place is a legit Gibson dealer (the largest in Canada) so there is no way these were fakes, Gibson just did a crappy job on the serial number.

 

Yours could be an example of the same thing but it is far more likely that your guitar is a factory second as those always come with the serial number on a piece of paper.

 

You might want to head over the the forums at mylespaul.com and post this there. If you include better photos someone there will definitely know which model you've got.

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THANK YOU! That might explain why there is no embedded serial number' date=' and also WHY there were so inexpensive. But if this is a G-310, thats a new area of search. What about the Gibson-Style Headstock? I Do remember in the Mid 80s seeing them like this, although they were using the design they use now, for other guitars.

[/quote']

 

 

I am not familiar enough with the headstocks to be able to help you. As I said in my other post, head over to mylespaul and they will be able to help. Post your questions in the 'Other Gibsons' subforum and the experts will chime in in no time.

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Well, I did a Little research just now: THIS is a 1996 G-310:

 

junior.jpg

 

Or at least the person is SAYING it is, maybe the body is.

 

I found this: 70's Epi's were like this: Like ARIEL or ARIA guitars:

 

ea250.jpg

 

I also found this late 70's headstock:

 

epiphone%20coronet%20sbDSCN9091.jpg

 

That last one is a crestwood.

 

So I think Mine is a Mid-80s... The headstock they use now, is based on the "Scroll" headstock - Genesis had them.

 

Heh, even as a factory Second, this guitar is superior to even brand new Gibsons! I had to pay an additional 120 bucks (Paid 800 for the guitar!) for my LP Jr in 2001, it was a copy of those "bridgless" LP Jr's with the PAFs - Thing was a junk o hunk! I traded it straight across for a 1994 Flying V!

 

Thanx I'll go over to that other place tomorrow, I used my Cell phone to take those, and I was indoors, I have to bring my guitar outdoors to get better pics, so I'll do that tomorrow! Thanx again, I feel like I'm gettin somewhere now!

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I looked carefully on the back of the headstock - There are two areas which are kind of rough' date=' so it may be that somebody sanded the serial number off and refinished the neck, but if so, they did a very good job!

 

So, the question remains, what IS this! It sounds pretty much like an SG, I'll eventually change out the cheap Ghost tuners for real Gibson tuners- Those are the worst feature of this guitar. Everything else, the pickups, electronics, are just fine.[/quote']

 

There may be a clue in the two areas of possible "sanding/refinishing" you mention. I once had (and foolishly sold) what was a Japan Limited Lacquer Line les Paul. That model is apparently sold in Japan only and is allowed to feature the Gibson "open book" headstock. Mine had a serial number and "Made in Japan" embossed into the back of the headstock.

 

It may be that your SG is one of these which would mean that the quality is very high and almost as good as the US Gibbys. If so you have a very fine instrument. I still kick myself about once a week for selling mine!!

 

Stewart B

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Ah! Well' date=' I don't know exactly where it came from, I got it as partial payment for a bunch of work I did on a studio back in 1998. The first time I saw this guitar, was 1994, it was being used in a recording session. I noticed the headstock RIGHT AWAY, and that is was way different then the epis that were being sold in 94. It was the closest thing I'd seen to a Real Gibson SG. But notice, it says "Gibson" on the neck adjuster plate, not "SG" - Which is what it says on both Gibson and Epi SG's. (And I note that you have said that they used "Gibson" on that plate up until 2004, but I bought a new LP Junior in 2001, and the SGs of that year all said SG). The other thing, is the construction, the BODY just feels like a regular Gibson SG, this is mahogany, and it is heavy. On the other hand, a Gibson Les Paul or SG from the 70's will have a metal framework inside of the electronics area, and the POTS will be mounted in the frame- All Gibsons were like this back then, at least the 1976 Les Paul Custom I had was... don't know if they are like this now - but I had an Epiphone Genesis back in 1979, which was very like a Les Paul, but it did not have any metal framework in there, and the jack was on top of the guitar - And it just broke one day, caved in the whole pot compartment. But this, although it has no metal framework in there, it is not in danger of caving in, like several Bolt-On Epi's I've seen.

 

When I say "Ghost" tuning keys, "Ghosts" were actually a brand made in the 80's - I had a a Kramer with a Ghost Floyd Rose whammy bar - It said "Licenced by Floyd Rose" on it. Ghosts were a hardware company, mostly made Tuning keys for Japanese and Asian guitars, they usually had a "G" in the round area on the back of the key. They are very like the tuning keys on new Fenders and Jacksons- I believe those are Ghosts, or what the company "Ghost" became later. They are simply medium quality Tuning Keys. Regarding finding references to these things on Google - Well I just tried to look up "Alesis Studio 24" ADAT system, which is not really that old... Mid 90's - And I found NOTHING, and when I typed in "Epiphone SG with Serial Number on Adhesive Strip" - I found an equal amount of nothing.

 

The reason I was searching that, is that I vaguely remember these being sold for a short time, in the mid to late 80s - I remember seeing them at Guitar center. And that's where I SAW, with my own two eyes, that there was NO serial number actually STAMPED into the wood, just a Lame piece of adhesive, kind of a metallic piece, GLUED onto the wood! With the number printed on it. Now, I have found a couple of references to Epiphones with adhesive Strip.

 

So, this question would go out to folks who did a lot of trading and buying in the Mid 80's - Because that is where I saw a guitar like this - I saw Les Pauls, and SGs - The Les Pauls for 600 dollars, the SGs for about 300. The question is, did I imagine that, or am I remembering wrong?

 

No, there is Nothing on that headstock but the Name Epiphone. If somebody made this guitar, I don't know why they would put a real abalone Mother of Peal Epiphone inlay on the headstock.

 

I looked carefully on the back of the headstock - There are two areas which are kind of rough, so it may be that somebody sanded the serial number off and refinished the neck, but if so, they did a very good job!

 

So, the question remains, what IS this! It sounds pretty much like an SG, I'll eventually change out the cheap Ghost tuners for real Gibson tuners- Those are the worst feature of this guitar. Everything else, the pickups, electronics, are just fine.[/quote']

 

Epiphone started making G-400s around 1988. The earliest models (made by Samick in Korea) would have had dot inlays, 3 screw truss rod cover with GIBSON on it, and they used little white stickers for the serial #s until the early '90s. Early Samicks did have a more Gibson-like headstock than later models, like this Les Paul from the late '80s:

 

neanderpaul-albums-my-6-string-things-picture15460-old-headstock-needs-cleanin.jpg

 

The Orvilles and Epiphone Japan model that were made for the Japanese market do have a Gibson-like headstock, but they would have a two screw truss rod cover like Gibsons. Also, they would have a crown inlay and trapezoid fret markers and an engraved serial #.

 

Pretty sure it's an early Korean G-400 for the reasons stated above.

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Ah! Yah, that "Epiphone" on the headstock looks like mine - Kinda chopped off at the top.

 

I can make out what looks like the number "2" on the back of the headstock, in certain lights. - Or a letter "Z" - It is part of a raised section, very hard to see- In between the top two tuning keys.

 

There is also, by the tuning key corresponding to the "A" string - either a 5-point star, or something like an "Anarchy" symbol, kind of like an "A" with a line through it. I'll try to take pics of it tomorrow.

 

OK I looked at it again, it is like an Upside Down "Yen" symbol, it's a five point star, where the top 3 points are at 90 degrees to each other, but the bottom two form like the bottom half of the letter A, and they all join in the middle.

 

Those are the only markings on the back.

 

The NUT - The NUT on mine is Black. There is NO binding on the side of the neck, so it does not have Gibson-style frets, which are cut to fit the binding, these are hammered into the neck like a Strat.Even LP Standards, have frets that are cut to fit the length of each fret perfectly.

 

The Bridge! It is NOT a real tuno-matic Bridge made in Germany, the posts are too thick and missing the thumbscrew. My Flying V has a real tunomatic bridge, this one is close, but the holes are too thick, have screw slots in them.

 

The Pickups, I had them out when I was working on it - NO markings on the bottom, real humbuckers, have the Henrys marked on the bottom, usually one coil is 3 Henrys and the other is 1, for Bridge pickups, least it was for my Les Paul. Someone had put "hotrod" pickups in this thing, I took them OUT! Stuck the originals back in, sounds better - Actually, sounds like modern Epi SGs sound.

 

I'll take better picks of the hardware, again, tomorrow.

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Ok - Thanks for all your input, I think I have positively ID'd this:

 

http://forums.epiphone.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=11804

 

I remember seeing THESE at guitar center:

 

89G400HS.jpg

 

That's as close to mine as two peas!

 

89G400serconfSerial.jpg

 

The TUNING KEYS = Exactly like mine!

 

89G400.jpg

 

As he says: PUPs, Bigsby, Knobs NOT Stock, but That is the same Colour as mine - My pics look darker, no flash n my camera.

 

Here is the catalogue page for it:

 

g-400.jpg

 

I THINK thats IT.

 

Thanx all!

 

Well, last q: Is this a decent guitar? I mean when I play it, it just FEELS like an SG. I'm hoping to get real Gibson humbuckers, and real Gibson tuning keys. They say the BODY is some kind of hardwood - Not mahogany.

 

But when I look at the GRAIN on the body.... Looks like Mahogany to me, did they coat it with veneer?

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I can make out what looks like the number "2" on the back of the headstock...

 

Indicates it was a factory 2nd' date=' usually a minor flaw.

 

The NUT - The NUT on mine is Black...

 

Samick often used black nuts

 

The Bridge! It is NOT a real tuno-matic Bridge made in Germany' date=' the posts are too thick and missing the thumbscrew. My Flying V has a real tunomatic bridge, this one is close, but the holes are too thick, have screw slots in them.[/quote']

 

Japanese Epiphones generally use bridges with the smaller posts like Gibsons, and usually say JAPAN on the underside. The thicker posts are pretty much standard on most Korean and other Asian imports, if you look on the underside it might say B-1 or B-2 depending on the model, those were pretty common on the older Epis.

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Here is the catalogue page for it:

 

g-400.jpg

 

I THINK thats IT.

 

Thanx all!

 

Well' date=' last q: Is this a decent guitar? I mean when I play it, it just FEELS like an SG. I'm hoping to get real Gibson humbuckers, and real Gibson tuning keys. They say the BODY is some kind of hardwood - Not mahogany.

 

But when I look at the GRAIN on the body.... Looks like Mahogany to me, did they coat it with veneer?[/quote']

 

Yep, you found it. You have the G-400 which has a solid mahogany according to the catalog page. The G-310 is the cheapo with the hardwood body. (G-310s have bolt-on necks).

 

The early Samick made Korean Epis are very good guitars.

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You might want to head over the the forums at mylespaul.com and post this there. If you include better photos someone there will definitely know which model you've got.

 

I am not familiar enough with the headstocks to be able to help you. As I said in my other post' date=' head over to mylespaul and they will be able to help. Post your questions in the 'Other Gibsons' subforum and the experts will chime in in no time.

 

Post these photos over at MyLesPaul.com and the experts over there will be able to tell you if it is a fake or not.

 

Post about this at My Les Paul. I'm a member there and trust me, you will get definitive answers over there.[/quote']

 

Quotes from the last 3 weeks.......

 

Why ?

 

Maybe he has a point, there is a lot of misinformation on the Epiphone forum. Like the guy who told XweAponX that his SG was a G-310.

 

Oh wait, he's the guy who said that!!!

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Quotes from the last 3 weeks.......

 

Why ?

 

 

Because, in my experience, getting an answer there only takes a couple of minutes. What's the big deal?

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Maybe he has a point' date=' there is a lot of misinformation on the Epiphone forum. Like the guy who told XweAponX that his SG was a G-310.

 

Oh wait, he's the guy who said that!!![/quote']

 

 

I never said it was a 310. What I said was "And I am not sure that is a G-400 as they usually have trapezoid inlays. They didn't always have them so, depending on when yours was made, it might be one of the pre-trapezoid models. But I think it is more likely a G-310 or something like that. The uncovered pickups also make me think it is a G-310."

 

I never claimed to be right, I just said that was what I thought. Nothing wrong with either that or with pointing the OP to a place where he could get a definitive answer very quickly. Is there a reason your shorts are in a twist over that?

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Hahaha Hey u guys I don't care if the guy quoted from 3 weeks ago or 1 day ago, or pointed me to MyLesPaul or My Tiesco! I investigated everything that was said, and even though mine was not a G-310 I found out what IS one....

 

Honestly, I thought SG's were SGs never knew they had a number. And Now I'm about 99.9 % shure what My guitar is, so theres no beef from me about any of the responses I got! And I did get plenty of info from the other forum as well, I would have gone there today, but I don't need to right away.

 

Maybe I'll go there and ask about my pickups, cos I think someone took out the original Epi pickups and put some shite pickups in there..

 

Ya know I usedta have an Ibanez Iceman, Bolt on Neck, from the Mid 80's - And it had a LOT of the same hardware... I still got the bridge for that, but the pickups were pretty much the same was what's in my SG.

 

Well, maybe I'll go to the "Sell" forum and see how much this is worth.

 

Thanx all

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I never said it was a 310. What I said was "And I am not sure that is a G-400 as they usually have trapezoid inlays. They didn't always have them so' date=' [b']depending on when yours was made, it might be one of the pre-trapezoid models[/b]. But I think it is more likely a G-310 or something like that. The uncovered pickups also make me think it is a G-310."

 

I never claimed to be right, I just said that was what I thought. Nothing wrong with either that or with pointing the OP to a place where he could get a definitive answer very quickly. Is there a reason your shorts are in a twist over that?

 

Anyone with a modicum of knowledge would have immediately ruled out a G-310. It doesn't help to dispense wrong information based on wild guesses. You sent him on a wild goose chase looking up G-310s.

 

G-310s have bolt-on necks!!!

 

It's also bad form to come here and shill for another forum. And frankly, with info like it's "...likely a G-310...", you're not the best spokesperson for that forum.

 

Also, you're totally wrong about 2nds having paper serial #s. 2nds are new guitars with minor cosmetic flaws and enjoy full factory warranty. The factory serial # is in tact & valid. It's guitars marked USED that often have stickers with serial #s. These guitars are factory rejects that are often sold to jobbers who fix them up (often with after market parts) and resell them, hence the term USED. The factory will scratch out the original serial # since there is no factory warranty and a new number is assigned. But you will still see remnants of the original serial #, it doesn't disappear.

 

You can buy 2nds from major retailers like Musician's Friend (often called Blemished), USED ones show up a lot on eBay. You can get a good deal on a 2nd, you might not even see the blemish, but you have to be careful with USED guitars. They could have repaired necks, non original parts, playability issues...

 

The early Samick made Epiphones in the '80s did not engrave the serial #s, they used little white stickers. Most have been removed by now. They started engraving the serial #s in the early '90s, and around 1993 initiated the numbering system beginning with a letter to indicate the factory. Prior to that, there really wasn't a need since Samick made nearly all the Korean Epiphones.

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