Andy R Posted January 21, 2011 Author Share Posted January 21, 2011 Just so you guys know I'm not coming up with all of this out of the blue. I am applying a lot of what this guy did in a new build to my rebuild. Just want to give credit where credit is due. Now the screw ups and fixes are all mine!!! http://www.mylespaul.com/forums/luthiers-corner/70871-template-advice-needed.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy R Posted January 21, 2011 Author Share Posted January 21, 2011 As I mentioned earlier my plan is to make this a "Custom" Custom and somewhat of a Randy Rhoads tribute Guitar. For the head stock I plan on using the 70's custom multi-layer bound head stock with Real MOP Gibson Logo Inlay and a Rolls Royce RR where the triangle would be. I am trying to decide between logos. I like the pre-war OLD logo as you don't see these on much but I thought I would get some opinions here. I could also go with with a 50's style without the dotted I. Or I could make it a Gibsum ! Blah ha ha Pre-War Logo on top... The RR I plan on using in white MOP Thoughts and opinions.? How bout a vintage creme top with a black and white polka dot back and sides ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brundaddy Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 Well since you asked... I like the polka dot concept the best (black dots on an off-white background sounds mighty, mighty fine). Definitely a bizarro RR/Randy Rhoads custom!! How perfect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silenced Fred Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 I'd go pre war logo and your idea for the creme top and polka dot back seems really cool. Go for it man! I can't wait to see pics Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damian Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 Andy, I like the middle logo, and the R/R idea.......Just a thought....and.........perhaps sugared coffee would 'muck' the process up.....Perhaps expresso would work better.......(?).....awesome thread........... What about a wooden pickguard with the OLD pre-war logo inlaid into it ???? [thumbup] ............... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duane v Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 the middle logo with no dot over the i. No polka dots Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 I would choose the pre-war logo. Somehow I feel it would make the 'Custom' Custom that bit more 'Custom'... Great work. I love the muck-ups...reminds us that we are all able to fail! P. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freak show Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 IMO you should use one of the lower 2 logos. The "RR" is sort of strict in an Art Deco way, and to me that doesn't fit with the flowery, ornate look of the top logo. Whatever you decide, I'm really looking forward to seeing the end result! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitargreg1993 Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 IMO you should use one of the lower 2 logos. The "RR" is sort of strict in an Art Deco way, and to me that doesn't fit with the flowery, ornate look of the top logo. Whatever you decide, I'm really looking forward to seeing the end result! thats a good point... I really do like the script look of the pre-war logo, but i do think the "RR" inlay would work better with the middle logo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy R Posted January 21, 2011 Author Share Posted January 21, 2011 IMO you should use one of the lower 2 logos. The "RR" is sort of strict in an Art Deco way, and to me that doesn't fit with the flowery, ornate look of the top logo. Whatever you decide, I'm really looking forward to seeing the end result! Very good point.The pre-war is cool but I think maybe distracting as I want the RR to Catch the Eye ( that is if I can cut one that looks halfway decent ) I think with this in mind I will use the lower Logo as it is a bit less curvy and I like the open cut out in the B and the O. I was joking about the Polka dots. I might have done this in the 80's but is little "Too Much" tribute. Although a Black and White Polka Dot Pick Guard might be an easy and non committed idea. I am thinking about a vintage creme top with black neck, back and sides. That way if i ever want to make it a black beauty I can just paint the top. I think I am going to use a 3 ply neck binding too. Thick white on the outside and thin black middle and thin white inside edge to the freeboard. I think i am going to also do a partial fret overlay ( fret end extension) onto the thin black and white binding and then NIB the thick white. Thanks for everyones input and opinions. Other ideas are welcome! Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy R Posted January 21, 2011 Author Share Posted January 21, 2011 Ok here is my fix for yesterdays screw up. Luckily most all of this will be hidden. I left plenty of extra this time and won't do the final shape until I have the neck prepped and ready. So about 90 % of this "Add on will be gone once I get the neck correct. Here's the pics: By the way the little nick in the top of the top is where the tenon will be routed so no biggie there. I will later add a Danger! Will Robinson photo of lines not to sand or cut on the top and back if someone else does this. In the future. Next Post.... Making some home made tools... Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sinner 13 Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 I think the Mods here should Pin this post up top where it belongs...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy R Posted January 22, 2011 Author Share Posted January 22, 2011 Here are a couple of tools I built. One is a fret Bender for pre-radiusing your frets before install. Got the plans for this here: Fretbender It's made from a cutting board and about 10.00 in parts at Home Depot. Pic: ( Fret bender on the left ) The other tool is a binding clamp for making multi-ply binding. I got the idea from a stool Stew Mac tool that I simplified even more... Stew Macs: Mine: More cutting board material some rubber Bands, dry wall screws and a bolt! Works like a charm! Next post .... Making multi-ply binding and binding my fretboard... Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy R Posted January 22, 2011 Author Share Posted January 22, 2011 Ok let's see if I can get through this without my mac crashing! So I decided to do a 3 layer binding with the fret ends overlapping the inner two bindings and the outside will be the Nib. So here are some pics of making the binding. Gluing it on, screwing up, and fixing screwup. 2 layers rung into the clamp... One side done... Screw-up... Doh But since this will be in the middle I ca cut it out at the fret slots and the fret will cover the line... Both sides done! What it will look like with the three layers... On to fretting !!!! Stay tuned Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andre S Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sinner 13 Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 You Sir, are an Animal. Can't wait to see the finished product. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy R Posted January 23, 2011 Author Share Posted January 23, 2011 Ok I got the board all fretted today and have a bunch of pics, and tips. I ended up re-binding the 2 thin layers I put on yesterday because the weld on Glue that Stew Mac recommends doesn't work very well. So since new binding is made from pvc plastic instead of celluloid I decided to get out the ol' plumbing supplies and give it a whirl. I found that the pvc cleaner works great for melting the binding together and for gluing it to the fret board. it set-up very quickly and held very well. Ok on to fretting. If you're reading this I might be in the middle of editing as and saving as I have a problem with this crashing in the middle of posts. Also due to the photo attachment limit I will have to break this into multiple posts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy R Posted January 23, 2011 Author Share Posted January 23, 2011 Well crashed already so I'm gonna dump some pictures and will comment later. Ok it's later and I'm gonna add some comments to the photos so they might make more sense. They are a bit out of order so I apologize. This is just a pic of getting ready. By the way 3/4 " 2' x 4' Melamine makes a great cheap flat work surface for about $8.00. So here you see the fret board and some pre-radiused fret wire. The fret boards are 12" inch radius so I radius the fret just a bit more to 13" to help keep the frets ends down. I decided to do a 3 layer binding on the neck and have the fret end over hang to the end of the first two layers. Just something I wanted to try. So here is the board with 2 layer binding installed. The Stew Mac fretboards come with 24 fret slots so the last 2 will be cut of sio I use these to get a feel for how the frets is going to react. These are also my ancient flush cut cutters for fret ends and removing frets. So here is a fret rough cut to size just using the flat cutters pictured above. The problem with cutting a fret like this is that it tends to distort the fret tang as you can see at the bottom of the fret. This is no good for install because it ca make your fret not seat flat and it looks like crap.... So I mark the fret so I get the tang to fit between the area I want. In the case of a bound neck you have to do this to keep the fret tang from pushing out or cutting rebinding, If I was worried about the fret ends not cuts throughout the binding this is what the fret would be cut like Just a hair short of the inside of the bindings with plenty of flat fret top to hang over the top of the binding. This is just a picture of the 12 " radius press insert you can get as a replacement from Stew Mac for their press tool. It's about 8 bucks and I just use it as a fret set with a hammer. I push in the fret with my fingers so it stay put and the use the the caul and a hammer and knock the fret in working side to side and the setting the middle. After some test fitting in my 2 spare test slots I realized that the fret slots were a bit thin for the extra large wire I was using. You shouldn't have to beat a fret in like a red headed step child to get it seat firmly and flatly. So you have w options. Trim the fret tang barb or widen the slot. They make a tool for both but I decided just to widen the slot and found that a hack saw blade worked great in this case. Sine there will be another layer of binding I went ahead and cut the slot through the thin binding. One tip if you do this Start your cuts on the outsides of each slot and pul the blade in toward the middle of the fret. That way you don't catch the binding and push it out and away from the fret board. If you do by accident loosen a piece of binding just open it up a little with a razor blade and drop some thin liquid super glue in the crack and then hold it down for a minute and you're good to go... continued.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy R Posted January 23, 2011 Author Share Posted January 23, 2011 Fretting continued.. Just marking a rough length for the fret. Using the Stew McD fret tang nipper in the area I want to cut. This way when I cut the fret with my flat clips I don't twist the fret tang or the fret truing to cuts through the fret and the tang too... Here you can see the result of the tang clipper... Very cool tool! While the tang nipper does a good job it still leaves a nub of he tang sticking out as you can see on the right side bottom of the fret. This needs to be removed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy R Posted January 23, 2011 Author Share Posted January 23, 2011 Fretting continued.... No this isn't blood I just colored the bottom of the fret so it is easier to see what I am going to need to remove with a small file. Just running the file lightly over the bottom to make the ledge that needs to be removed more obvious. Now you can really see the little bit of left of fret tang that needs to be filed out. After flattening with a file. Just be careful to only remove the bit of tang or your fret ends wool look funky. Just eyeballing the fit in the slot. My goal was to keep the tang just ins the black binding so in case there is any fretboard shrinkage it wont poke the binding out... I do this with unbound necks too! I add a few drops of super glue to the slot and both ends of the fret end bottom that were filed down. continued.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schnarz25 Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 Andy, Andy, he's our man. If he can't do it, no one can. great thread by the way. awesome info in here and its really nice of you to take the time to show all of us what you're doing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy R Posted January 23, 2011 Author Share Posted January 23, 2011 So here's a pick of my bloody thumb holding the fret caul in place where I will proceed to whack each side with a hammer working back and forth from side to side and then start whacking it towards the middle of the fret to seat the middle ( remember ends first and then the middle or you will have problems with your fret ends popping up and "Floating" This is actually a Kreg tool locking vice grip style locking clamp. It had a pretty good size base so I used it to clamp the fret ends/middle down while I was flush filing the end of the frets. The I would switch ends. Just a little insurance that the fret stays seated well. Using my flush cutters to cut as cloe a s I can to the finger board so I's don't have to file so much! Remaining fret sticking out... Flushing it up using a flat file.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy R Posted January 23, 2011 Author Share Posted January 23, 2011 One more fret done many more to go. Testing to see if the fret is flush with the binding for the outer layer. Too short and you get a gap. Too long and you get a hump and the binding won't glue up right. This should actually be way back at prepping the fret slots. I use a fine triangle file to bevel or ( chamfer ) each side of he fret slot just little so that the fret goes in easier, straighter and reduces chipping. Afte the bevel. It doesn't need to be much... After a few hours of work I'm all done!!! Just seeing what the 3 layers will look like. That's it for now. Sorry no explanations but the crashing is preventing me from getting much done here.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kimbabig Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 Andy it looks like your fingers are getting lots of ouchies, I hope you can play the guitar when you're fininshed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy R Posted January 23, 2011 Author Share Posted January 23, 2011 Andy it looks like your fingers are getting lots of ouchies, I hope you can play the guitar when you're fininshed. Yes they have been taking a beating for sure! Can't make me sound any worse than I already do.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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