Bradmeister Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 Gentlemen (and Ladies), I am the proud owner of a new R8 VOS. It is sweet! My main amp is a 90s Fender Concert, which has served me well for my other guitars. However, with the LP, it just lacks something. When plugged into a Marshall, it sounds awesome. The other guitarist in my band uses a Peavey amp that it sounds great through, too. Anyway, does anyone have any suggestions for a distortion pedal to get a Marshall-like tone with a Fender amp? The clean channel on the amp is awesome, it's just the dirty side that needs some help. BTW: I'm looking for opinions here, people. Comments like "I can't tell you what you like, try a bunch of stuff out" will not be tolerated. Neocon's gotta have something for me..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichCI Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 Out of all the dirt pedals I've tried, I like the Analogman King Of Tone the best; I use one as a clean boost pedal with my Mesa with my band and another one at home as a straight ahead distortion box with a Fender Champ and it sounds great in both applications. On the web site, it says It was fine tuned with Jim's 1960s Fender Deluxe Reverb amp to duplicate the sound when his amp is singing, but at lower volume settings - to simulate the natural tube amp distortion of preamp and power tubes. Because of that one statement, you'll read lots of fanbois on the web, particularly at Harmony Central, saying "Ooh! It sounds just like a blackface Deluxe!" Bullshit. They read something and parrot it back out. If they were really good a mimicking (and reading comprehension) they would have read the next sentence which says It does the same thing on other amps like Vox, Marshall, etc, making them sing in their own voice which it does but what isn't stated anywhere is that the tone controls on the pedal (mid on top, treble trimmer and gain stage addition/subtraction switches on the inside) make it really flexible. I'm not going to tell you that it'll sound like anything under the sun, but I get a really raging British-style tone out of that little Champ and the pedal. Another one that I've never tried but has really impressive sound clips at the web site is the Fulltone OCD. I know some guys who post here have them and like them a lot. "One of these days" I'm going to have to pick one up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluemoon Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 Love, love, love the Fulltone OCD. Very natural, tube-like overdrive. It has a high peak and low peak switch on it. The HP gives yiou a more marshall like OD sound. The LP gives you ar more Fender like OD sound. I was about to ditch my Valve Junior because I couldn't get the distortion I wanted (i was really muddy and farty). The OCD solved all my problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stymye Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 no doubt the fulltone ocd loves a fender sounding amp! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonebias Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 Speaker Change to something else will help, like maybe a Weber blue dog... then using a Marshall Shredmaster will do the trick. But the best way to get a Marshall tone out of a Fender is to trade the Fender for a Marshall... Never used the OCD, what is the OCD Circuit based on? Anyone know? Can someone open up their OCD and look at the IC and read the numbers out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bradmeister Posted August 27, 2008 Author Share Posted August 27, 2008 Yeah, I know. I just dropped a lot of money on the LP, so probably can't get away with buying a Marshall just yet. I do want to keep the Fender, too. I haven't tried through my Vox AC15, but I'm guessing that will be missing something, too.... Thanks, Brad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hall Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 www.hipkittyproducts.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichCI Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 Can someone open up their OCD and look at the IC and read the numbers out? Here's a review with some technical stuff: http://www.pedalarea.com/ocd.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stymye Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 whats inside the ocd?? ..some kind of magic dust.! I'm not one for following the crowd but at the boutique level it's worth every penny. tube amp +ocd = great tone! if you are an emotional type player that likes to attack the guitar at one moment than slump into a little blues noodeling during a passage , this pedal will follow you around like a slobbering dog. what makes the pedal special is that it's circuit follows the attack on the strings and brings out some rich harmonics regardless of how you play. it may not be some top secret circuitry, but the quality of build and quality of sound makes it worth having, if you like metal and prefer to keep everthing on "11" than your probably wasting your money. there are plenty of pedals that will suit metal. however this pedeal will get pretty damn dirty if you want yet still retain clarity of the individual notes.and will suppliment an already overdriven sound very well! hows that for a impromptu thumbs up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stymye Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 Speaker Change to something else will help' date=' like maybe a Weber blue dog... then using a Marshall Shredmaster will do the trick. But the best way to get a Marshall tone out of a Fender is to trade the Fender for a Marshall... Never used the OCD, what is the OCD Circuit based on? Anyone know? Can someone open up their OCD and look at the IC and read the numbers out?[/quote'] honestly you could order all the parts and housing ect and not be able to build an exact replica for much less than what you can buy one for . it's just not worth it , thats why you wont see any diagrams(that I'm aware of) of this pedal in the pedal forums .. even the do- it- yourselfers won't bother.unless your really hardcore self sufficient most just buy the pedal and are satisfied. and respect the designers circuit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonebias Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 OK, So the OCD pedal has the PRO-CO RAT circuit design which is based on the LM308 chip (which is probably what they are using in the OCD), it's not a RAT but it is close. I've been using a MODED RAT pedal for years for the Marshall tone, I love the chunkyness of the thing. I do understand what they are saying in the article about some of the harmonics being lost on the RAT. Maybe I will build an OCD if I can find the component values and a schematic. I hate buying production pedals they want way WAY too much for them.... Sorry stymye, but I can build a rat pedal for about $20 - $25 in parts (which I already have), the OCD can't be much more than that for a few value changes. Besides, it's always fun to find the production model shortcuts and improve them.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stymye Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 Tonebias , ..man I like talkin effects! your probably right because I'm far from a electronics whizz. and I would be the first to encourage someone to build their own effects, however !!!I can say this I have an original rat pedal that I shelled out for when they first came out and there is a mile of difference between the two. I love my rat btw! it definately has it's own sound also keep in mind that I have version >4<, there has been alot of changes to the ocd due to customer feed back,and other reasons yet the price has remained the same, it's like perfecting your own toothbrush... the ocd has become the ts-9 of the boutique world. some people will stay away from it just for the sake of being different.. mabey I will feel that way too over time when so many people have one .. who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonebias Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 Oh, I have no doubt that the OCD is different from the RAT, there are so many things that make a difference in the tone of a pedal, some are simple component values and some are flat out different designs. For instance the difference between a RAT and a TS-808 is major, but the difference between a TS-808 and a TS-9 are only a few minor value changes and a cheaper IC. It's very easy to change a TS-9 into an original 70's TS-808. The PRO-CO RAT has changed over the years as well, I prefer the early models as well as the very early TS-808's (with tweaks of course). By looking at that OCD link, I can tell you that it's a fairly simple pedal and probably has about 4 different areas for improvement that are cost related to mfg. When I say cost related, I mean about less than a $1-$3 a pedal that would potentially make a difference in tone, quietness and tone choice. But the manufacturer sees it as $50k-$150k when you think about buying everything in bulk just to add that little bit to the pedal. http://www.pedalarea.com/images/ocd_board_v4.jpg I'm far from an electronics wizz too, although I'm currently studying for my BS in electrical engineering... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stymye Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 Oh' date=' I have no doubt that the OCD is different from the RAT, there are so many things that make a difference in the tone of a pedal, some are simple component values and some are flat out different designs. For instance the difference between a RAT and a TS-808 is major, but the difference between a TS-808 and a TS-9 are only a few minor value changes and a cheaper IC. It's very easy to change a TS-9 into an original 70's TS-808. The PRO-CO RAT has changed over the years as well, I prefer the early models as well as the very early TS-808's (with tweaks of course). By looking at that OCD link, I can tell you that it's a fairly simple pedal and probably has about 4 different areas for improvement that are cost related to mfg. When I say cost related, I mean about less than a $1-$3 a pedal that would potentially make a difference in tone, quietness and tone choice. But the manufacturer sees it as $50k-$150k when you think about buying everything in bulk just to add that little bit to the pedal. http://www.pedalarea.com/images/ocd_board_v4.jpg I'm far from an electronics wizz too, although I'm currently studying for my BS in electrical engineering...[/quote'] Tonebias,when you get a killer pedal together , please let me be in the loop. just pm me now and I'll give you my contact info, I'm good for beta testing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonebias Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 I just ordered the OCD pedal (you can be sure it will be on ebay after I finish investigating). I'll be looking into making a clone of it and upgrading some of it's components. May take some time with all the school work I have on the way this fall. I just gotta hear this pedal that everyone's talking about... Looks like I can sell it on ebay for pretty much what I paid for it.... so no loss there... stymye: PM'd you... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluemoon Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 Good luck with the project. And let us know what you think of the pedal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuitarJunkie Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 Love' date=' love, love the Fulltone OCD. Very natural, tube-like overdrive. It has a high peak and low peak switch on it. The HP gives yiou a more marshall like OD sound. The LP gives you ar more Fender like OD sound. I was about to ditch my Valve Junior because I couldn't get the distortion I wanted (i was really muddy and farty). The OCD solved all my problems.[/quote'] I'm using a Fulltone Fat Boost. Sounds great for dirtying up my clean channel (amp is a Traynor YCV-40) or as a lead boost for my semi-dirty rhythm sound. It has bass and treble trim pots that are neutral in the 12 o'clock position. These come in handy to get rid of that flabby bottom end you sometimes get with boost pedals. These guys have some great video reviews... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmpOwOUlZo0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thundergod Posted August 28, 2008 Share Posted August 28, 2008 cheap-*** pedal that gets the job done (only if you are using a tube amp with a nice, not to chymey clean tone): marshall the guv'nor plus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mety Posted August 28, 2008 Share Posted August 28, 2008 I'd recommend the original Marshall Guv'nor, if you can find one. They crop up on eBay from time to time. A lot of Fender amp users really like the MI Audio Crunch box, they all say it really is a Marshall-in-a-box: http://www.mieffects.com/cbindepth.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichCI Posted August 28, 2008 Share Posted August 28, 2008 OK' date=' So the OCD pedal has the PRO-CO RAT circuit design which is based on the LM308 chip (which is probably what they are using in the OCD), it's not a RAT but it is close. I've been using a MODED RAT pedal for years for the Marshall tone, I love the chunkyness of the thing. I do understand what they are saying in the article about some of the harmonics being lost on the RAT. Maybe I will build an OCD if I can find the component values and a schematic. I hate buying production pedals they want way WAY too much for them....[/quote'] I think you'll want to read that article a little more closely. Here is the part that mentions a RAT: The overdrive/distortion portion of the circuitry is based on a simple opamp gain stage with negative feedback and with a pair of crosscoupled clipping diodes at the output to clip the signal and thus create the distortion. A similar circuit topology is used in many other distortion pedals as well (e.g. the Proco Rat), but Fulltone uses a very clever modification that significantly separates this unit from most others. First off, instead of traditional diodes Fulltone uses NMOS transistors in diode configuration (gate and drain short-circuited), which already accredites for a great difference in tone. But the biggest difference is this: In the Proco Rat the two crosscoupled clipping diodes are directly connected to ground, meaning that as soon as the signal exceeds the threshold voltage Vth of the diodes (usually 0.7V), the signal gets clipped resulting in an output signal with a peak voltage of +/-Vth independent of the input signal amplitude. This naturally creates the wanted distortion, but also loses the dynamics of the signal. In the OCD, instead of connecting the diodes to ground potential, Fulltone uses a floating bias point which is connected to the input of the opamp stage. This creates a clipping threshold proportional to the input signal amplitude, resulting in a strong dependancy of the amount of distortion created to the input signal. This is the core idea of the enormous dynamics of the OCD. The writer states that "a similar circuit topology is used in many other distortion pedals as well (e.g. the Proco Rat)" and then goes on to compare the OCD to a RAT but I didn't get the impression that the same chip was used. I own a 1986 RAT with the LM308 chip as well and it doesn't sound much like the sound clips on the Fulltone web site. Granted, that's comparing direct experience with recordings on a web site that used gear I don't have, but to my ears the RAT has a fuzzier, more compressed sound to it than the OCD, which sounds more open. The RAT is a cool pedal that does that compressed 80's metal thing really well, but the OCD sounds more natural, like an amp, from what I'm hearing. If you're going to build your own OCD, I think you're going to need to either get your hands on one or find a schematic but I definitely wouldn't assume the chip and the rest of the circuit are closely related to the RAT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rybass Posted August 28, 2008 Share Posted August 28, 2008 Anyway' date=' does anyone have any suggestions for a distortion pedal to get a Marshall-like tone with a Fender amp? The clean channel on the amp is awesome, it's just the dirty side that needs some help. BTW: I'm looking for [b']opinions[/b] here, people. Comments like "I can't tell you what you like, try a bunch of stuff out" will not be tolerated. Neocon's gotta have something for me..... Buy a Marshall. HA! just joshin! I modded a Boss DS-1 to keeleys seeing eye and it's pretty darn close through my valve jr but you kinda have to go balls to the wall distortion with it b/c it doesn't sound all that good with the gain turned down. OLC makes the Thundercheif and the Thor which are very Marshall like. I plan on buying the Thor when i finish the 5 other pedal kits on my bench now. You can buy the kit or the completed pedal here: http://olcircuits.com/index.html Tonbias- there are a number of schematics on the web for the ocd and mods too. I think the real circuit is covered in epoxy so it maybe hard to mod but google it and you can find plenty of info on it. Not my bag, sounds like a tubescreamer with an extra gain section and a booster. A lot of people swear by them though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thundergod Posted August 28, 2008 Share Posted August 28, 2008 I'd recommend the original Marshall Guv'nor' date=' if you can find one. They crop up on eBay from time to time.A lot of Fender amp users really like the MI Audio Crunch box, they all say it really is a Marshall-in-a-box: http://www.mieffects.com/cbindepth.htm[/quote'] +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALIEN8 Posted August 28, 2008 Share Posted August 28, 2008 Fulltone OCD does it well, and can act as a clean boost which is nice... I personally love it. I'm running a Traynor YCV40 - 6L6 based tube amp and it sounds great on the clean channel of that amp. The full range is there and it's extremely dynamic like a tube amp. It has the high frequency gain that I like about marshalls, without that one annoying frequency that makes every pedal sound like a pedal. I use it to drive the dirt channel as well, and it's a great pedal for cascading gain stages. Another pedal no one has mentioned yet is the HAO Rust Driver. Very simple in design and functionality, and a great Marshall tone. It's not my thing, but it does do it well. It's cannot get as driven as the Fulltone, and the overall sound is different, more like a tube screamer style EQ tone, but I'm sure you could push it into more drive with a boost pedal in front of it. OR If you have an FX loop in your amp, try an EQ on the gain channel... They really do make all the difference since you already have tube distortion, it just needs a different voice... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VA_siCkBoy Posted August 28, 2008 Share Posted August 28, 2008 The Fulltone OCD sounds awesome with a Fender amp. I have version 1 and I absolutely love it with my Hot Rod Deluxe. I really think you'll enjoy it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonebias Posted August 28, 2008 Share Posted August 28, 2008 a similar circuit topology is used in many other distortion pedals as well (e.g. the Proco Rat) Hey Rich, This is all I need to know, it may or may not use the 308 chip but there are other common IC that would work in its place that could change the tone considerably from the 308. Like I said in an earlier post there's only a handful of circuits out there and most of them are copies of something with changes in values and types of components. I ordered one of the OCD pedals and will be doing some investigation. I have already seen the inside of one and it is a very simple looking design, nothing that they would have to store at Area 51 or anything. I've heard the OCD on youtube from about 10 different videos. It's hard to make any distinction with all the differences of guitars, amps and settings but after hearing it and seeing the circuit board layout and components it really does give me the impression that it's nothing but a moded RAT. I will investigate some more when I get the pedal. Ya, Ya... there's people who are going to scream "I have a RAT and it sounds nothing like the OCD"... Fine.. Your right...You win, Don't want to argue with you. Its not the sound so much as it is the circuit.... The guy who designed the actual printed circuit board for the OCD did a fantastic job I must say, I love the way the pots are soldered through the board.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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