mr heroic Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 So i've decided last year to purchase a Gibson Explorer classic white. I ordered it in a guitar shop nearby, they told me i had to wait about 4 months. After 4 months they told me that i had to wait at least another year for the white version but they could offer me a Gibson Explorer in cherry red color. I couldn't wait any longer and i digged the color so i bought that one. The guitar plays very solid but i couldn't help noticing some finish problems that got me irritated. The pickguard appeared to be loose in one corner of the explorer so i tried to get it down with a screwdriver but then i realised that the screw from the pickguard couldn't get any deeper. I'm aware that wood doesn't always look perfect when you paint it but i got some pretty weird wood patterns on the neck. I just got the guitar but i really don't know what to do. I think you should get real quality for that price. I haven't seen other explorers on the internet with the same problems so what should i do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowb5str Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 ...snip... The pickguard appeared to be loose in one corner of the explorer so i tried to get it down with a screwdriver but then i realised that the screw from the pickguard couldn't get any deeper. (first close-up was here) I'm aware that wood doesn't always look perfect when you paint it but i got some pretty weird wood patterns on the neck. ...snip... The first picture was excellent. The pickguard looks warped, and the wrinkle is clear from the side of the guard: look at the little "bump" in the layers as the edge runs away from the onlooker towards the bridge. That SHOULD be a warranty issue if only a short time hsas elapsed since your purchase, but YMMV. Factory QC Support, are you online? In picture 2, you show a fretboard with marvelous grain variations. To many players, that is a plus. Given identical axes with this fretboard or one with monochromatic wood, I'd pick this one every time. Uh, the surface is smooth everywhere, right? This is a cosmetic question you are asking? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stein Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 I agree, that is a nice looking fretboard. That would not really be a finish or quality issue, as they are unfinished, but regardless, it comes down to a matter of taste. Regarding the rest of the finish, good on you for realising that a guitar built by poeple rather than machines may have some minor "imperfections"..what is important is the overall beauty and craftsmanship. Regarding the pickgaurd, something looks way off on it. I am not sure I understand what you mean when you say the screw will not go down any further, but regardless, the gaurd is supposed to be flush all the way down. Pickgaurds will warp over time, but that does not look like the problem here. could be maybe there is something underneath holding it up? Regardless of the reason, the good thing is that it is really an easy fix, and the worst case is a new pickgaurd installed properly. It is still something You should do right away. I would either look into it myself or have the dealer fix it promptly. If the gaurd is already warped from being like that for too long have them either give you a new gard or order another. Aside from that, with so many variations in other things about a guitar, like sound, playability, neck shape, color, ect. that can NOT be altered on a guitar, I would not asses a guitar based on something that CAN be fixed/altered for such little money or effort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr heroic Posted April 25, 2011 Author Share Posted April 25, 2011 Okay i agree it IS a really nice guitar, i'm a big fan of the shape and overall tone. But this one is brand new so i expected it to be finished. I realise these are minor problems, the pickguard can probably be fixed easily. But i'm kind of worried about the neck. How can that difference in color be a plus? the fretboard is smooth but only the patterns seem to be a bit weird. Anyways i appreciate the response, i'm gonna upload some more clear pictures of the fretboard now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr heroic Posted April 25, 2011 Author Share Posted April 25, 2011 Some more pics of the neck, i'm no wood expert that's why it got me worried that it had to do something with the painting process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stein Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 Okay i agree it IS a really nice guitar, i'm a big fan of the shape and overall tone. But this one is brand new so i expected it to be finished. I realise these are minor problems, the pickguard can probably be fixed easily. But i'm kind of worried about the neck. How can that difference in color be a plus? the fretboard is smooth but only the patterns seem to be a bit weird. Anyways i appreciate the response, i'm gonna upload some more clear pictures of the fretboard now. How is it a plus? Truthfully, it is neither a plus or a minus. It depends on who you ask. It is PURELY a cosmetic thing, and NOT an indication of the quality or anything concerning the construction of the guitar. Rosewood or ebony fretbaords are bare, as in unfinished, or as in not paiten or coated. They should be sanded and buffed smooth to the touch. Judging from your pics, it looks like yours is constructed nicely as far as the fretbaord goes. As for the wood streaking that occurs naturally that you have, some like it and some don't, but it seems that MOST seem to prefer it, and it is more uncommon to see it than not. So, many will see it as a plus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxx Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 I once had a wire from the selector switch sandwiched between the body and the pickgaurd, so you might check that first. If the grain on the fretboard bugs you, then don't live with something you hate! Send it back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr heroic Posted April 25, 2011 Author Share Posted April 25, 2011 I once had a wire from the selector switch sandwiched between the body and the pickgaurd, so you might check that first. If the grain on the fretboard bugs you, then don't live with something you hate! Send it back. hmm, is it okay to detach the pickguard by yourself? I think i might go back to the dealer and let them solve it. The switch also feels weird because of the pickguard, it's a bit looser than it's supposed to be. Concerning the fretboard grain, if Stein says it's an uncommon thing that many player appreciate than i'm a bit more assured. I'm very fond of this guitar and i have done a lot to get it so sending it back is not an option, but i was freaking out because i did not know that the grain is purely cosmetic. I don't have much knowledge about guitar woods etc but is it safe to paint the guitar or the fretboard in the future or does it affect the sound or even the color in a bad way? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stein Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 hmm, is it okay to detach the pickguard by yourself? I think i might go back to the dealer and let them solve it. The switch also feels weird because of the pickguard, it's a bit looser than it's supposed to be. Concerning the fretboard grain, if Stein says it's an uncommon thing that many player appreciate than i'm a bit more assured. I'm very fond of this guitar and i have done a lot to get it so sending it back is not an option, but i was freaking out because i did not know that the grain is purely cosmetic. I don't have much knowledge about guitar woods etc but is it safe to paint the guitar or the fretboard in the future or does it affect the sound or even the color in a bad way? You don't want to ever paint the fretboard. You don't even want to use polish on it. They have products to clean it or condition it that are made just for fretboards. As for your question about removing the pickgaurd, that is your call. Nothing says you can't, and nothing says you shouldn't be able to. But, being as it has an issue and if you are not a person who is mechanically inclined, you might be better off having someone with at least some experience do it. Obviously there is an issue with it. Either way, I think you will be ok. Just, don't put it off. It should not have left the store you bought it from like that in the first place. It needs fixin'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottGrove Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 If it's a Gibson, something will be wrong in the finish department. They have the worst finishes in the biz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stein Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 If it's a Gibson, something will be wrong in the finish department. They have the worst finishes in the biz. Strongly disagree. I think you base that on wrong information. Comparing certain $2500 guitars to $6000 guitars is not a comparism, nor is judging the appearance of a nitro finish to a poly finish accurate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottGrove Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 Strongly disagree. I think you base that on wrong information. Comparing certain $2500 guitars to $6000 guitars is not a comparism, nor is judging the appearance of a nitro finish to a poly finish accurate. Nope, I base that on the hundreds of Gibson guitars I've owned over the years. It is what it is. Always has been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stein Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 Nope, I base that on the hundreds of Gibson guitars I've owned over the years. It is what it is. Always has been. Is it fair to say that your guitars have held up better then other nitro finished guitars of similar wear and use? Another thing I think is a criteria when judging the finish of a guitar is the sound, the tone, rather than how "perfect" it is out of the box. How would you rate your Gibsons in that area? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottGrove Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 My Gibson guitars are the consistantly worst nitro finished guitars. Their finish issues have simply been known for decades and folks that have ever cracked a book or checked a forum know about this. How do they hold up? Not great. Very average. Tone? As everybody knows, mostly it's in the fingers. I will still have to say that my absolute favorite Gibson axes are so very easily the Norlin years, bolt on necked, Bill Lawrence laden, single coil axes. It's hard to find any of them with hardly any finish at all on any of them, but they still sound amazing. This thread is about the beat to death issue over Gibson's poor finishes. It's nothing new. I'm not saying anything new that hasn't been said by millions before me. It is what it is, if you don't like it, don't buy it. If you dig it and you know what your guitar will look like in 10 years with regular play, then buy it. Just telling the OP that.....his issues with his Explorer finish is typical. Nothing else. So, he should return it if it's not his thing and don't really expect much of an improvement if he is planning on trading it for a straight across replacement. Nitro is nitro, Gibson is Gibson, the QC is the infamous QC. It simply is. No surprises to a single person reading this. Love it or hate it.....it is Gibson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stein Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 I once restored a 20th anniversary black LP that had been recovered fron the San Fransisco Bay and left in the case for about 8 years with salt water. Every piece of hardware was full of rust, pickup covers peeling from corrosion. STRONG smell of mold and saltwater. Replaces EVERYTHING including the corroded frets. The finish was only polished back up from the oxidation and remained shiny for at least another 8 years after. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr heroic Posted April 26, 2011 Author Share Posted April 26, 2011 As i was reading this i realised i am lucky that these imperfections are just minor problems. But still, i've heard a lot of bad stuff about the finishes on Gibsons nowadays. I'm fully aware that i shouldn't base my opinion on rumors and such, hence why i bought the explorer. I think it's a great guitar and that Gibson has made some great variations of it and other models as well. But the fact that i got it in this state is really sad. They shouldn't have let it get to the store like that. I tried so hard to get it in classic white color but after 4 months of long wait they told me i had to wait for it another year or so. That was really disappointing, so another color was the most obvious and sensible choice for me. And when i finally did receive this beast it still had this pickguard problem. This is frustrating to say at least, even if it's a detail, i'm convinced that Gibson is a great brand but i hope i don't get any more nasty surprises with the explorer finish wise or even tone wise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ne14t? Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 How do you know that the guitar hadn't been on display in the store or possibly been a returned item did they take it out of the box in front of you? People seem to rag on Gibson directly for the quality of there guitars and well its hard to stop crap from happening to them once they go out onto a sales floor, biggest question is...Was there still the plastic protective cover on your pick guard? To me it looks like someone might have been fudging around with it, especially since you said the screw can't go down any further on the tip there. By this do you mean that the screw goes down then just keeps turning in place without tightening up? If so it sounds like the hole is stripped and you might need a slightly larger screw to get a proper bite. The pick guard is extremely easy to take off you just unscrew the ring on the toggle switch and take the eight screws out and she just pops right off, best to do it while the guitar is laying in the hard case so the electronics do get shaken around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr heroic Posted April 26, 2011 Author Share Posted April 26, 2011 How do you know that the guitar hadn't been on display in the store or possibly been a returned item did they take it out of the box in front of you? People seem to rag on Gibson directly for the quality of there guitars and well its hard to stop crap from happening to them once they go out onto a sales floor, biggest question is...Was there still the plastic protective cover on your pick guard? To me it looks like someone might have been fudging around with it, especially since you said the screw can't go down any further on the tip there. By this do you mean that the screw goes down then just keeps turning in place without tightening up? If so it sounds like the hole is stripped and you might need a slightly larger screw to get a proper bite. The pick guard is extremely easy to take off you just unscrew the ring on the toggle switch and take the eight screws out and she just pops right off, best to do it while the guitar is laying in the hard case so the electronics do get shaken around. They haven't sold an explorer model for a while now, they had to order them directly from Gibson. When i came into the store it was on the counter with the case open. There was no plastic cover on my pick guard but when i just got it it felt like there has been one over it and there were signs of torn plastic on some places. And the screw is basicly stuck, i can get it out but i can't get it to go down deeper so that the pickguard will get in place. It doesn't turn back in place but it can't go deeper either. As if the hole is disfigured or something. But why would someone mess around with the guitar? It's a disadvantage for both me and the store if there's something wrong with it.. With all this in mind i have decided that i'm going back to the store with it tomorrow. I am not going to make things worse even if there is no risk at all, they should fix it right away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ne14t? Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 In my opinion I would say yeah take it back something seems really fishy with it (almost like a refurbish or returned item), any reputable shop would understand your feeling towards the situation especially when spending a large sum of money on an instrument. I am sure there is probably nothing wrong with guitar but who wants to take ownership of a guitar that already has problems! Its a shame though because the discoloration in the fingerboard is really nice, not something you see too often. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr heroic Posted April 26, 2011 Author Share Posted April 26, 2011 In my opinion I would say yeah take it back something seems really fishy with it (almost like a refurbish or returned item), any reputable shop would understand your feeling towards the situation especially when spending a large sum of money on an instrument. I am sure there is probably nothing wrong with guitar but who wants to take ownership of a guitar that already has problems! Its a shame though because the discoloration in the fingerboard is really nice, not something you see too often. fully agree, there's something about this guitar. And i'm sure they'll do everything they can to help me, they moved mountains to get me this baby in a manner of speaking. Since it was so hard to get the white one they still could get their hands on one of the 12 cherry reds that were available for Europe and that's hard for a small country as mine. I don't know if that's salesman bs and frankly i don't care but they better not fool me with a returned guitar or something, even after all the trouble i had with the store to get a classic white one. You really think the neck grain is nice? My friend who has like 3 Gibsons said it was fairly uncommon and i should definately keep it. I was kind of freaked out in the beginning when i saw it though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ne14t? Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 Yeah its pretty uncommon to have natural discoloration on a finger board especially with such a difference in color. I will get some pics of the ebony finger board on mine tonight when I get home from work and post them up so you can see the difference, to me it kind of adds a bit of life in an otherwise dull area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr heroic Posted April 26, 2011 Author Share Posted April 26, 2011 Yeah its pretty uncommon to have natural discoloration on a finger board especially with such a difference in color. I will get some pics of the ebony finger board on mine tonight when I get home from work and post them up so you can see the difference, to me it kind of adds a bit of life in an otherwise dull area. okay, but i have one more question. When you get a new Gibson, there is supposed to be a plastic cover on the pick guard? Because i think it's a bit weird the case was wide open on the counter when i came in. Why the heck would they open it by themselves Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rct Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 Yes, there is a static sheet on the pickguard, usually has a sticker on that as well, but I don't remember what it says. Color variations in rosewood fingerboards do happen. Yours, in my experience and opinion, is a bit too much to be natural variation. My first thought when I looked at it was "Bad stain job". Many times these days guitar makers have to settle for whatever it is we are calling "Rosewood" this week. When the get it it may need some staining to even it out. Yours looks to me, and I don't know that it is because I'm not there with it, but it looks like a sorta botched stain job. The pickguard is dumb but inexcusable. If it were me, I'd take it back, tell them that the pain of getting a Gibson wherever it is you are is already great enough, I don't have to settle for these obvious amature moves. Without offending anyone? I'd have to tell them that if I wanted an Epiphone I woulda bought one. Good luck with it. My 2006 'splorer completely restored my faith in Gibson, it is that good. But I've also had my share of their problems over a very long time of guitar playing. Only a GOOD Gibson is good enough, the rest can and do often suck. rct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr heroic Posted April 26, 2011 Author Share Posted April 26, 2011 Yes, there is a static sheet on the pickguard, usually has a sticker on that as well, but I don't remember what it says. Color variations in rosewood fingerboards do happen. Yours, in my experience and opinion, is a bit too much to be natural variation. My first thought when I looked at it was "Bad stain job". Many times these days guitar makers have to settle for whatever it is we are calling "Rosewood" this week. When the get it it may need some staining to even it out. Yours looks to me, and I don't know that it is because I'm not there with it, but it looks like a sorta botched stain job. The pickguard is dumb but inexcusable. If it were me, I'd take it back, tell them that the pain of getting a Gibson wherever it is you are is already great enough, I don't have to settle for these obvious amature moves. Without offending anyone? I'd have to tell them that if I wanted an Epiphone I woulda bought one. Good luck with it. My 2006 'splorer completely restored my faith in Gibson, it is that good. But I've also had my share of their problems over a very long time of guitar playing. Only a GOOD Gibson is good enough, the rest can and do often suck. rct So what do you think they'll do for me? The guitar has been paid, i can't go back now. Stupid of me that i noticed these things after i bought it but we can't reverse time. It just bugs me i have to settle for a good guitar with already small imperfections. Honest? For that money you should get an axe that is 100% worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr heroic Posted April 26, 2011 Author Share Posted April 26, 2011 Here's a pic of the whole guitar by the way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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