albertjohn Posted October 26, 2008 Share Posted October 26, 2008 Karen. I really don't understand how this has happened but do the right thing and stick around. Please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLiveSoundGuy Posted October 26, 2008 Share Posted October 26, 2008 I just wanted you to see how far I read something you have written. Have a nice life.I'm lovin it..... But your not helping BC......... If we could find the original post to these quotes, then perhaps one of these two individuals can shed some light as to what is actually going on here. Karen, Your absence from this forum board is punishing all of us, who miss you and truely want you to stay around. Please reconsider. I miss you. Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylor Player Posted October 26, 2008 Share Posted October 26, 2008 I had noticed the missing comments that Ballcorner made regarding Karens absense. Something about turning in her Gibson and getting a "Sissy" Taylor. I was responding to that originally. Since it had made a reference to Ballcorner which according to another forum member was likely not true, I deleted my post so as not to offend him. I still have no idea what happened to Ballcorners posts. Sorry for the confusion. I didn't want to start a witch hunt. I am as much in the dark as most of the rest of you. Some people here seem to have a much better idea who was bothering Karen. I really hope she comes back as I always enjoyed reading her posts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarstrummer Posted October 26, 2008 Share Posted October 26, 2008 This thread has gone on long enough. Karen and I have been friends. I am the one who contacted her directly through a personal e-mail and not through the forum. It was not done “anonymously” as some have suggested and it was not done to cause trouble, bully her off the forum, or intimidate her, as suggested by others. I have not posted anything until now because it was my hope that Karen would edit or remove her post, as the information she posted was somewhat misleading and seemed to be made hastily. I asked her to do so before the forum turned into a lynch mob, which has apparently happened. I really appreciate all of the choice names you’ve assigned to me, drawing your own conclusions before knowing what actually took place. There’s nothing wrong with showing support for a fellow forum member, but many of the comments made were over the line. It’s especially unfair and wrong to suggest that another forum member was responsible when they were not. It was at that point that I decided it was time to make a post and try to put an end to this. Also, my decision to post or not post had nothing to do with my manlihood or lack thereof, as was also suggested. I simply did not feel it was right for me to do so without first giving Karen the opportunity to follow up. If you still question my manlihood, you know how to contact me. Karen and I have been friends for probably four years. As friends, we regularly exchange e-mails, sometimes as often as 10 per day and she has also interacted with other members of my family. She has shared very personal parts of her life and has asked for my advice on numerous occasions. Karen has repeatedly asked me for feedback on her forum posts, ever since her involvement in a situation that took place a long time ago on the old Gibson Forum, in which I was her primary advocate. We have often exchanged e-mails discussing posts. After a recent e-mail exchange, Karen decided to make the post that she made and announce her exit from the forum based on information we discussed in the e-mails. I am not going to disclose the details of our private e-mails, but will say this. Although I told her that some of her posts which she considered to be “idle chit chat” might possibly be misinterpreted by people who didn't know her, I never told her that any of her posts were “inappropriate”, nor did I tell her that other forum members were “upset”. I also didn’t say that anyone was “offended”. Those were conclusions that she made and terms that she selected to use in her post. I also told her that as a friend, I was concerned for her, as were some others who have contacted me in the past. There are obviously more facts than what I have included here, but a public forum is not the correct place to discuss them, out of consideration of all parties involved. I initially told Karen that I would not comment on this matter, however it’s now become obvious that unless someone did, the false conclusions, name calling, and false accusations of people who had nothing to do with this, would continue to the detriment of the forum. I value the forum too much to sit back and watch that continue. I have e-mailed Karen to let her know that I would now be making this post, but as of yet she has not responded. As many of you already know, I have always been at the forefront to support Karen and consider her a valuable member of the forum. At no time did I ever suggest that she leave the forum and in fact, I told her that she should not do so. Now, I’m off to play my Gibsons and I’d like to suggest you all do the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLiveSoundGuy Posted October 26, 2008 Share Posted October 26, 2008 Mike, Thank you for that. Let me start by saying I have nothing but respect for the both of you. While it really is no one's business other than the parties involved, it became obvious that there are many on this forum who feel genuine concern and appreciation for Karen. Many of us just wanted to know know why??, since nothing was making sense. Now that the facts are known, I wish the both of you well. I have no less respect for you, and I still wish Karen would stay. You both are far too valuable here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jannusguy Posted October 26, 2008 Share Posted October 26, 2008 like sands through the hourglass, these are the days of our lives. well, that was interesting. a window into mob psychology, as it were. i stand by my posts although, i realize now, they were off topic. hope you guys can work it out. you're both nice people and i enjoy reading what you have to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nodehopper Posted October 26, 2008 Share Posted October 26, 2008 Guitarstrummer In one of my posts in this regard I ended up comparing the loss of GG to the loss of you to the forum. I hope that you understand that in doing so I was basically stating that you are core to the forum. I still agree with my statement and hope that everything can be worked out and we don't lose anyone due to mis-understandings. Thanks so much for posting ..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onewilyfool Posted October 26, 2008 Share Posted October 26, 2008 Mike, your silence didn't help. You may have said what you think you said, but obviously Karen heard something different. So, like most inter-human relations in life, we have a failure to communicate. Being accountable is saying "this is what I said", being RESPONSIBLE, means making it right with Karen. Both she and you are valuable assets to this forum, and I appreciate what you both have to offer. Based on the responses on this thread, whatever Karen heard from you, was not what the other forum members are feeling. So it seems that whatever advice you offered her was only your own opinion, and does not reflect the opinions of the rest of the forum, based on the overwhelming response from the rest of the forum. So, whatever you said to her, however misconstrued by her, was your own opinion, and clearly you can't speak for the rest of the forum. So please make it right, express your own opinions and apologies if necessary, but make it clear you were only speaking for yourself. I want to see her back and I've really enjoyed my sharings of music, information, and humor with Guitarstrummer, and hope to do so in the future. In the words of Rodney King...."Why can't we all just get along?" (Rodney King 12:18) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWilson Posted October 26, 2008 Share Posted October 26, 2008 I'm still having a hard time trying to figure out how any of Karen's posts could have been misinterpreted by people who didn't know her. That can be said about every person who posts here. I'm also not sure why you should be the person to bring this to her attention. I figured it would have to be someone who was fairly important to her to have said these things to make her want to drop out of the forum. It had to be someone whose words could sting her. Although you posted a long explanation, it doesn't really clear the air for me. She wouldn't have quit if it were just some Joe Schmo criticising her. I want to understand this but the information you provided just doesn't do it for me. Sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballcorner Posted October 26, 2008 Share Posted October 26, 2008 I think Mike has presented a reasonable letter that respects the privacy of his communications with Karen, and he makes an effort to describe the nature of the problem and his role in it. I don't know that we are entitled to know more specific details, or that we should really require them. Obviously, Karen heard from Mike and she was upset by the e-mail. Mike suggests his e-mail might have been misinterpreted and Karen's input on the matter so far is that she feels she should not participate. So we have some facts: The issue is between Mike and Karen. Karen has chosen to involve forum members in the issue by announcing a departure and Mike has now come forward to share his view of the situation and his role in her decision to make her post. I would hope that where they have been friends for a considerable time, Mike and Karen can resolve the issue as people normally do - amongst themselves. I am not certain that the forum has a role in assisting this communication problem other than what we have already done by offering Karen support and encouraging her to participate here and by acknowledging Mike's sincerity in offering his letter to calm the situation. Perhaps it is something Karen and Mike should now work out and we can hope it is resolved in a manner that sees both of them participating in the forum as we all move forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nodehopper Posted October 26, 2008 Share Posted October 26, 2008 I think Mike has presented a reasonable letter that respects the privacy of his communications with Karen' date=' and he makes an effort to describe the nature of the problem and his role in it. I don't know that we are entitled to know more specific details, or that we should really require them. Obviously, Karen heard from Mike and she was upset by the e-mail. Mike suggests his e-mail might have been misinterpreted and Karen's input on the matter so far is that she feels she should not participate. So we have some facts: The issue is between Mike and Karen. Karen has chosen to involve forum members in the issue by announcing a departure and Mike has now come forward to share his view of the situation and his role in her decision to make her post. I would hope that where they have been friends for a considerable time, Mike and Karen can resolve the issue as people normally do - amongst themselves. I am not certain that the forum has a role in assisting this communication problem other than what we have already done by offering Karen support and encouraging her to participate here and by acknowledging Mike's sincerity in offering his letter to calm the situation. Perhaps it is something Karen and Mike should now work out and we can hope it is resolved in a manner that sees both of them participating in the forum as we all move forward. [/quote'] Agree !00% Well said. I don't need to know the details...I just want the issue resolved and the mis-communication resolved. OWF - LOL !!!!! " In the words of Rodney King...."Why can't we all just get along?" (Rodney King 12:18) " That joke always seems to work....like the Stooges fingers in the eyes hand block ...I still laugh every time !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylor Player Posted October 26, 2008 Share Posted October 26, 2008 Mike... Thanks for posting your response. It was the right thing to do to clear the air a bit. Sometimes things sent in written form are not taken as intended. I think that may be what happend here with you and Karen. Hopefully you both work it out and can remain friends. While I agree that I have never seen any post by her that would be considered offensive, again, the written word comes across differently to different people. I am sure that once a little time has passed, things will get back to normal and we can keep discussing the great Gibson's that we all love. Both you and Karen are full of knowledge about guitars and either of you being gone would be a great loss in this community. I fully respect both of you and just hope it ends soon and we can all keep seeing both of your words of wisdom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnt Posted October 26, 2008 Share Posted October 26, 2008 I think Mike has presented a reasonable letter that respects the privacy of his communications with Karen' date=' and he makes an effort to describe the nature of the problem and his role in it. I don't know that we are entitled to know more specific details, or that we should really require them. Obviously, Karen heard from Mike and she was upset by the e-mail. Mike suggests his e-mail might have been misinterpreted and Karen's input on the matter so far is that she feels she should not participate. So we have some facts: The issue is between Mike and Karen. Karen has chosen to involve forum members in the issue by announcing a departure and Mike has now come forward to share his view of the situation and his role in her decision to make her post. I would hope that where they have been friends for a considerable time, Mike and Karen can resolve the issue as people normally do - amongst themselves. I am not certain that the forum has a role in assisting this communication problem other than what we have already done by offering Karen support and encouraging her to participate here and by acknowledging Mike's sincerity in offering his letter to calm the situation. +1 BC but I do have a sympathy with TWilsons view also. It's the problem with "family" (albeit with a small f) there are inevitable fall outs and miscommunications. Have we learnt anything? No of course we haven't! Perhaps it is something Karen and Mike should now work out and we can hope it is resolved in a manner that sees both of them participating in the forum as we all move forward. [/quote'] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnt Posted October 26, 2008 Share Posted October 26, 2008 I concur with Ballcorner and have a sympathy also with both Wily's & TWilson's views. Like jannusguy and others I stand by my comments as everyone elses, they were written in good faith based on information to hand. In a world where folk have died to give freedom of speech that all seems right and proper. If they are now considered ill advised ...........................................well sorry that's tough!. It does all depend upon interpretation. In a "family" (albeit small f) like this forum there will be fall outs and disagreements, will we learn from this? Of course not! I guess that's the end of a sad matter. As Ringo would say Love and Peace Love and Peace Love and Peace Love and Peace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
albertjohn Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 I think Mike has presented a reasonable letter that respects the privacy of his communications with Karen' date=' and he makes an effort to describe the nature of the problem and his role in it. I don't know that we are entitled to know more specific details, or that we should really require them. Obviously, Karen heard from Mike and she was upset by the e-mail. Mike suggests his e-mail might have been misinterpreted and Karen's input on the matter so far is that she feels she should not participate. So we have some facts: The issue is between Mike and Karen. Karen has chosen to involve forum members in the issue by announcing a departure and Mike has now come forward to share his view of the situation and his role in her decision to make her post. I would hope that where they have been friends for a considerable time, Mike and Karen can resolve the issue as people normally do - amongst themselves. I am not certain that the forum has a role in assisting this communication problem other than what we have already done by offering Karen support and encouraging her to participate here and by acknowledging Mike's sincerity in offering his letter to calm the situation. Perhaps it is something Karen and Mike should now work out and we can hope it is resolved in a manner that sees both of them participating in the forum as we all move forward. [/quote'] Absolutely agree. My knowing all the detail is unlikely to make a difference. I really hope Karen and Mike can reach a place where they can both participate in this forum. With all due respect to all of my fellow members, it will be a poorer place if either, or both, choose not to participate any further. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thermionik Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 guitarstrummer's suggestion that we were calling him 'choice names', when we had no idea who it was, at first incensed me. Knowing that incensed postings are a bad idea, I resisted the temptation to respond. I slept on it in GMT. Further - from Gilliangirl's original 'quitting' post, we had to accept her word that she had been told her posts were inappropriate, other forum members were upset, and some people were offended by them. That we as a group responded to support a well liked lady was deemed by at least one responder as mob psychology, personally I think it was more musketeer, one of all and all for one. Now we know it is a personal issue betwen Karen and Mike, that is where we leave it. Their business. As Ringo Star actually said..... "I want to tell you after the 20th of October please do not send fan mail to any address you have. Nothing will be signed after the 20th of October. "If that is the date on the envelope, it's going to be tossed. I'm warning you with peace and love. I have too much to do. So no more fan mail. Thank you, thank you. And no objects to be signed. Nothing. Anyway, peace and love, peace and love." Probably why he didn't ask Karen to stay too..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Pup Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 I've known both GG and Guitarstrummer since the first Homecoming and I cosider them both good friends. I agree with the others that this is more of a personal matter between them and we should respect that and hope they can work it out. Either way there is no need for anyone to leave the forum. GG, Guitarstrummer, you both have my friendship and my full support. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWilson Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 Like Nik, I've slept on this and have come to the conclusion that I don't need to understand this. the fact that I don't doesn't mean I find fault with Mike or Karen. Just because I don't know something doesn't mean it's wrong. (Like Higher Math, for instance!) Anyway, hope we all can move on, I know I am. I'll leave the rest to Mike and Karen and I've said my peace and won't comment on this subject any more. Peace!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mooseguy Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 Karen: We all love you so come on back darlin My Deluxe guest room awaits you Moose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jefleppard Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 Karen: We all love you so come on back darlin My Deluxe guest room awaits you Moose moose -watch out!! this thread is threatening your excellente quest for views! ps...we'd all love karen back! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnt Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 moose -watch out!! this thread is threatening your excellente quest for views! ps...we'd all love karen back! +1 cunkhead! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnt Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 Karen: We all love you so come on back darlin My Deluxe guest room awaits you Moose Hey Moose is that palatial pad up for Lease? Can I pay extra for gas or is that included? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mooseguy Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 Johnt: For you the gas is free but you are required to maintain the ROLLS ROTTEN engine. Regards, Moose P.S.To Fred from Nou Nou: When you no longer need your Viagra-come and visit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TommyK Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 Karen: We all love you so come on back darlin My Deluxe guest room awaits you Moose His and hers? Do my eyes deceive me or is the one on the right mounted to a heavily modified Ford Econoline Van? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLiveSoundGuy Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 I see what you're see too, but I think it might be a Early to mid 70'S F100 RANGER PU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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