j45nick Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Good Gawd folks! This is an inamminant object (a jewelry chest)....from a long- been- dead animal. What is the political and ethical problem with 're-cycling it' to another purpose? It's already been used. What is the problem with re-using it? What has become of free-thinking America????? Rod, I think you just have to accept that for some people it's not quite that simple. Not saying who's right or wrong. We just look at this same question in different ways, and make our decisions based on our own value systems. I wouldn't be the one to judge either approach. You talk about "free thinking America", and you are absolutely correct. We should feel free to think either way without criticism from those holding different views. What's right for me isn't necessarily what's right for you, and vice-versa. As long as we abide by the law, we should cut each other some slack about what we think or believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retrorod Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Federal laws and their interpretation by non-thinking bureaucrats. Ask Henry. . I am afraid that Federal laws were made by "non-thinking bureaucrats", and that is the whole "crux" of the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JellyWheat Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Rod, I think you just have to accept that for some people it's not quite that simple. Not saying who's right or wrong. We just look at this same question in different ways, and make our decisions based on our own value systems. I wouldn't be the one to judge either approach. You talk about "free thinking America", and you are absolutely correct. We should feel free to think either way without criticism from those holding different views. What's right for me isn't necessarily what's right for you, and vice-versa. As long as we abide by the law, we should cut each other some slack about what we think or believe. +1... A good point, well stated. Thank you. J/W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dchristo Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 if someone handed me ivory pins, nuts and saddle, I would take them, say thank you, and then install them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JellyWheat Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 if someone handed me ivory pins, nuts and saddle, I would take them, say thank you, and then install them My GAWD, man! Why would you want IVORY when you could go out to your back yard and get real... ...GATOR TOOTH! J/W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JellyWheat Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Sorry... duplicate post! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retrorod Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Okay, I GIVE ! Everbody believe what they want to believe...Free to do that. It ain,t that simple. Lets complicate it, then! My point is. I am not arguing against the NEW LAW banning the sale and trade of ivory, Okay? But if the wife inherited a piece of crap ivory jewelry chest from her Great Aunt Martha and it sat in their home on the dresser for 20 years and one day Wifey says "Hey Honey, this jewelry chest is in bad repair and I much prefer the new one that you bought me for Christmas, why don,t you cut it up to make a nut and bridge saddle for that lame-sounding 70's Gibson that you have ?" .... I am talking about a covenant made between a man and woman in their own home over a personal belonging....??? What does 'ethics and law' have to do with that???? P-L-E-A-S-E don,t tell me that I have to accept it and that it is not that simple! That only insults my intelligence and makes you sound LESS intelligent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JellyWheat Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Okay, I GIVE ! Everbody believe what they want to believe...Free to do that. It ain,t that simple. Lets complicate it, then! My point is. I am not arguing against the NEW LAW banning the sale and trade of ivory, Okay? But if the wife inherited a piece of crap ivory jewelry chest from her Great Aunt Martha and it sat in their home on the dresser for 20 years and one day Wifey says "Hey Honey, this jewelry chest is in bad repair and I much prefer the new one that you bought me for Christmas, why don,t you cut it up to make a nut and bridge saddle for that lame-sounding 70's Gibson that you have ?" .... I am talking about a covenant made between a man and woman in their own home over a personal belonging....??? What does 'ethics and law' have to do with that???? P-L-E-A-S-E don,t tell me that I have to accept it and that it is not that simple! That only insults my intelligence and makes you sound LESS intelligent. In my mind, it's not about that of which you speak. There is no harm in that scenario. My question is whether or not we want, by cutting up the jewellery box to make guitar parts, to perpetuate the urban legend that there is NO man-made substance equal to ivory for this purpose (... well, I think it's an urban legend, at any rate). By cutting up the jewellery box made from the bones of a long-defunct animal to use on our instruments, we give credence to a nonsensical, unscientific belief that fuels an illegal trade that costs thousands of noble, intelligent beasts their lives each and every year. Soon there will be no more elephants to slaughter, and we will all HAVE to get used to Tusq, or cut-up space shuttle tiles, or something other than ivory. But it's not about what you and your wife do in the privacy of your own home... Unfortunately, it's bigger than that! And time to realize the truth of this is quickly running out. My $0.02/YMMV J/W [My uncle wasn't allowed to carry a gun on safari, so he had to pack-a-derm! :P ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tman Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 All political correctness aside..... If someone handed you Ivory blanks--nut, saddle and pins for your guitar, would you do it ? Please No political correctness. We all no the gig. Just talkin' story. Yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retrorod Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 In my mind, it's not about that of which you speak. There is no harm in that scenario. My $0.02/YMMV J/W J/W...I can only speak 'my mind' So, apparently, we are of two different minds... :unsure: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
struma6 Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Existing jewelry box? Yes, I would have no problem cuttin' it up for a nut, saddle, pins and a toothpick. I also would have no problem with giving an elephant my pancreas when I die. They can make a cereal bowl outta my skull if they like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JellyWheat Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 In my mind, it's not about that of which you speak. There is no harm in that scenario. My $0.02/YMMV J/W J/W...I can only speak 'my mind' So, apparently, we are of two different minds... :unsure: If you're going to quote me, please don't do it like Fox News would. You can't gut a whole train of thought like that and just respond to what suits you! Besides... I'm not trolling for an arguments, it's just how I feel, for Chrissakes! J/W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j45nick Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 I don't know why this topic keeps coming up. We all know that we don't agree on it, neither side is going to convince the other, and it's just going to end in angry words. Not sure if this falls under religion, politics, or both, but my momma said you don't talk about it at the dinner table when guests are there. So I'm going back to dessert, and I ain't talking any more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JellyWheat Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 I don't know why this topic keeps coming up. We all know that we don't agree on it, neither side is going to convince the other, and it's just going to end in angry words. Not sure if this falls under religion, politics, or both, but my momma said you don't talk about it at the dinner table when guests are there. So I'm going back to dessert, and I ain't talking any more. Now yer talkin'! Save a slice for me! J/W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sboiir Posted January 1, 2012 Author Share Posted January 1, 2012 The use of the material would not deter me. I would be reluctant to hack up a nice jewelry box for that purpose though....RRod PS, perhaps if I could see it, I would say hack it up... The J- box has seen it's day and served it's purpose well. Now it is dinged, nicked, chipped etc. Can turn old well used into new usable. Gonna do it. Thank all of you and Enjoy 2012 !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aster1 Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 Happy New Year Everyone! The J- box has seen it's day and served it's purpose well. Now it is dinged, nicked, chipped etc. Can turn old well used into new usable. Gonna do it. Thank all of you and Enjoy 2012 !! In that event, even if it's prob. unknown origins were questionable, it serves no purpose to the Elephant or Whale that came from to throw away just to be noble. To purchase new, that would have been different in my book. Use it and enjoy it. Honor the beast it came from, just like when we use the meat or fur of a beast to sustain our lives. BTW, I won't wear man made shoes just to save a cow from slaughter. If we were not growing cows for that use, & poaching them, then I wouldn't do it if they were dying out. Then I'd just have to wear Cordoba nylon shoes I guess. Or maybe sheep, goat, cat skin or something plentiful. Aster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JellyWheat Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 Maybe you can get somebody who turns pen barrels and who has a mini lathe to turn the pins for you Happy New Year J/W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retrorod Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 Thats a good idea, J/W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JellyWheat Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 Thats a good idea, J/W I might get one of them puppies this year. I used to do full-scale wood turning years ago, and was pretty good at it. The idea of turning on a smaller scale is sort of appealing, even though I don't know what I could turn out other than a $hitpile of pens! [i just use stock Martin pegs with the large abalone dots (YIKES! Another endangered species!). I can't play anyway, so any difference in tone as compared with ivory don't matter to me! I'm pretty deaf, too!] J/W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j45nick Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 I might get one of them puppies this year. I used to do full-scale wood turning years ago, and was pretty good at it. The idea of turning on a smaller scale is sort of appealing, even though I don't know what I could turn out other than a $hitpile of pens! [i just use stock Martin pegs with the large abalone dots (YIKES! Another endangered species!). I can't play anyway, so any difference in tone as compared with ivory don't matter to me! I'm pretty deaf, too!] J/W It would be interesting to see the setup that people like Bryan England and Bob Colosi use to turn pins. They're so cheap that it's got to be a highly-automated process. I had a guy hand-carve some bone pins for me back in about 1970. It took forever, and the results were mediocre. Still have those puppies in a bag, along with a lot of "not-currently-in-use", experimental, and "retired" parts. I suspect that most folks have the same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aster1 Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 I hadn't thought of that with the lathe. I have a smaller Compact 5 Emco 5" machinist lathe that we use to use to build parts for light fixtures. That would turn wood or brass whatever into bridge pins really nice. I always wished I would have bought the milling unit that was the mate to the lathe. For a mere $1500, back in the 80's I could have added that to the mix. If I get time I may mess with turning something to see how it works. Would have liked to have been able to mill out saddles from bone or other stuff. Snooze & loose I guess. Aster My lathe w/o the mill: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JellyWheat Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 It would be interesting to see the setup that people like Bryan England and Bob Colosi use to turn pins. They're so cheap that it's got to be a highly-automated process. I had a guy hand-carve some bone pins for me back in about 1970. It took forever, and the results were mediocre. Still have those puppies in a bag, along with a lot of "not-currently-in-use", experimental, and "retired" parts. I suspect that most folks have the same thing. If you're handy with a Dremel and calipers, you can make a single 'profiled gouge' tool from a piece of tool steel that you can just apply to the side of the rotating stock until it is scraped down to the proper dimensions and shape. Then all the parts are identical (within reason). J/W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j45nick Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 If you're handy with a Dremel and calipers, you can make a single 'profiled gouge' tool from a piece of tool steel that you can just apply to the side of the rotating stock until it is scraped down to the proper dimensions and shape. Then all the parts are identical (within reason). J/W I did some quick research on miniature benchtop CNC lathes. Looks like a complete setup might cost about $3K. They sure as heck aren't cheap, but they're pretty cool. I suspect there is something that's even smaller and more specialized, and probably cheaper. Not sure I would want to sit there all day turning pins with a profile gouge. I think you'd be cross-eyed after a couple of hours. Then you need to mill out the string slot. And the top of the pins for the dots. Then again, maybe it's just cheaper and simpler to give Bob Colosi a call. (I already have Colosi pins in several of my guitars, so I'm not really tempted to make my own) Makes you appreciate those little puppies you only pay $5-10 apiece for, doesn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sboiir Posted January 2, 2012 Author Share Posted January 2, 2012 So we have pros and cons like all things. For the cons I ask you, “should I throw the J-box in the garbage and add to the landfills ? “ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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