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What kind of SG special is it?


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Hi guys,

looks like I'm going to become part of the gibson club...

but first I would want an advice from you,

this is what I'm going to try:

My link

 

ok,it's an SG special but there's something that I don't take,

apparently it has a glossy look,so it's not a faded

but the knobs are that of a faded...

or am I wrong?

I looked at some pictures and all the SG special had the aluminum top knobs

what model can it be with that knobs?

is it a fake?(to my non expert eyes no,but...)

Thank you very much guys

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My best guess would be someone changed the knobs.

It is an SG special though I believe.

I've seen tons of SG fadeds with the chrome top knobs though so that knob isn't necessarily a faded knob

It don't appear to me to be a fake, just changed knobs (it may be an older version)

Well this guitar has a particular history,

it was not played too much,it was exposed for years and the actual owner does not even have

an amplifier,so I don't think anybody changed the knobs

Perhaps it's an older version,had older versions these knobs?

interesting....from which years?

 

thanks guys,you are very helpful

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Well, I agree fully with what LUDNUTS stated about the knobs, they don't tell anything about the guitar being a faded model or a Special with a Gloss finish.

 

What I might say though, is that on my computer, I can't say for sure it is a gloss finish. The pics are not good enough to determine that.

 

Usually, with some wear, and also some polishing, a faded finish can get some gloss to it. It will never look like what a gloss finish does, but they can appear glossy at times, and also in pics might look glossy.

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Well, I agree fully with what LUDNUTS stated about the knobs, they don't tell anything about the guitar being a faded model or a Special with a Gloss finish.

 

What I might say though, is that on my computer, I can't say for sure it is a gloss finish. The pics are not good enough to determine that.

 

Usually, with some wear, and also some polishing, a faded finish can get some gloss to it. It will never look like what a gloss finish does, but they can appear glossy at times, and also in pics might look glossy.

 

Yes you are right,the photos are out of focus,but in some you can see

the light reflected like a glossy finish,

the owner claims that this is "one of the first models of sg"

that I don't know what it means but for sure this guitar has more than 10 years,

What was the date in which gibson started to produce the special faded?

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Hi guys,

looks like I'm going to become part of the gibson club...

but first I would want an advice from you,

this is what I'm going to try:

My link

 

ok,it's an SG special but there's something that I don't take,

apparently it has a glossy look,so it's not a faded

but the knobs are that of a faded...

or am I wrong?

I looked at some pictures and all the SG special had the aluminum top knobs

what model can it be with that knobs?

is it a fake?(to my non expert eyes no,but...)

Thank you very much guys

 

Try obtaining the serial number and calling/contacting Gibson. They should be able to tell you if yours was a valid variation.

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hey,thanks guys,looks like we are at a dead point....

 

I found this on everythinsg:

everythinsg

 

look at the first sg special on the left,

looks like it is that one,glossy and

with black pots....could it be?

 

I'm going to see the guitar so how can I see if it is a special or a faded?

I think that touching the faded you can feel the wood,is that true?

 

I think that the special feels smooth,so you can't feel the wood

 

I did never see a faded so I need your help to distinguish the two

 

thanks

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I'm going to see the guitar so how can I see if it is a special or a faded?

I think that touching the faded you can feel the wood,is that true?

 

I think that the special feels smooth,so you can't feel the wood

 

 

 

That's about right. Try to look at plenty of photos of both types of SG on google images. The regular (like an SG standard) will have a thick, shiny coat whereas the faded will have an open grained, woody look to it.

 

If you're worried I'd say that the EUR 500 asking price is about right for an SG Special faded that is in good condition. As such, you might be better concentrating on other aspects by asking yourself:-

 

-Do all all the switches and knobs work? (take a battery/headphone amp if he doesn't have an amp)

-Are there any signs of a break/cracks or repair job in the headstock/neck area? (if in doubt, walk away)

-Play all the frets. Are there dead spots/is there bad buzzing? (This might just be due to a poor set up but, if you do get this, the following two points are even more important to check)

-Is the neck warped or twisted, even slightly? (look down the whole length of the fretboard from behind the headstock)

-Are the frets worn? (may need dressing (EUR50-70) or, if badly worn, re-fretting (EUR 150))

-Do the tuners all work well?

-Does the truss rod work? (Unscrew the cover on the headstock and use an allen wrench to check that it will move a 1/4 turn in each direction (turn no more than 1/4 if you know nothing else about truss rod adjustments)

-What is the general condition like? (dings, scratches, knocks etc.- might not make any difference to you other than a potential reduction in the price you offer)

 

 

NB. I think its a faded and that it's a genuine Gibson, BTW.

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Thank you very much AlanH!

you really helped me

 

however I don't think that 500 euro would be a fair price for a faded,

they cost 564 euro new in many online stores!

 

 

Yes, maybe I got my £ to EUR exchange rate slightly wrong. However, I reckon a good condition SG faded should fetch around £400 in the UK. Thomann are usually pretty much the cheapest around online and they're currently selling Faded SGs on there for EUR 598 (£502.41). In the UK, many people won't ship from continental Europe unless they've done it before. In that case the cheapest big online stores sell them for about £570-£600.

 

If you can get them cheaper still you should quote that price to the seller so you can knock him down a bit. Keep us informed.

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Yes, maybe I got my £ to EUR exchange rate slightly wrong. However, I reckon a good condition SG faded should fetch around £400 in the UK. Thomann are usually pretty much the cheapest around online and they're currently selling Faded SGs on there for EUR 598 (£502.41). In the UK, many people won't ship from continental Europe unless they've done it before. In that case the cheapest big online stores sell them for about £570-£600.

 

If you can get them cheaper still you should quote that price to the seller so you can knock him down a bit. Keep us informed.

 

Here you can get it at 563€:sg faded

 

that is probably the cheapest I had seen,I will quote this price...

thanks for your advices AlanH

I will keep you informed

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Hi guys I have some good and bad news and I need your advice:

 

good news is the guitar is not a faded,it's a special and probably a ferrari red

and it has a fat but precise sound,that's what I was looking for!

 

Bad news are:

 

1)The upper part of the fingerboard after the 12th fret buzz very badly.

 

2)Playing the 12th fret harmonics and the 12th fret I can here that the tone is higher but only on the 3 upper strings is bad,on the others is passable

what does it mean?Is it only a problem of the set up?

The neck is not warped or twisted apparently...

 

3)Some of the frets are worn but not badly

 

4)Two of the 4 pots emit a rustle when you turn them(this is easily resolved with deoxit)

 

5)The finish on the neck has some very tiny cracks,you can only see them,you can

not feel them with the hand.

 

So what do you think?Can the badly buzz originate from a bad set up?,

the action is not too low on the first frets...

Is there a more precise way to check if the neck is warped ?

I feel like I can't see very well only with my eyes

 

Thank you very much yo AlanH and every other guy who will help me

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Sounds like you did good-all the problems you describe would be the result of set-up.

 

At worst, I think it may be time for a fret dress. Maybe you weren't counting on it, but if it needed it, when you got it back it would truly be PERFECT.

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Hi guys I have some good and bad news and I need your advice:

 

good news is the guitar is not a faded,it's a special and probably a ferrari red

and it has a fat but precise sound,that's what I was looking for!

 

Bad news are:

 

1)The upper part of the fingerboard after the 12th fret buzz very badly.

 

2)Playing the 12th fret harmonics and the 12th fret I can here that the tone is higher but only on the 3 upper strings is bad,on the others is passable

what does it mean?Is it only a problem of the set up?

The neck is not warped or twisted apparently...

 

3)Some of the frets are worn but not badly

 

4)Two of the 4 pots emit a rustle when you turn them(this is easily resolved with deoxit)

 

5)The finish on the neck has some very tiny cracks,you can only see them,you can

not feel them with the hand.

 

So what do you think?Can the badly buzz originate from a bad set up?,

the action is not too low on the first frets...

Is there a more precise way to check if the neck is warped ?

I feel like I can't see very well only with my eyes

 

Thank you very much yo AlanH and every other guy who will help me

 

Hi again!

 

This is a tricky one. When you say the upper part of the fingerboard, do you mean the lower notes (nearer to the nut) or the higher notes (nearer to the pickups?)

 

The strings vibrate in an eliptical pattern between the two fulcrum points- nut (or finger) and bridge saddle. This means that when a string is plucked it resonates most at a point exactly half way between the two fulcrum points. The harder you pluck, the greater the vibration, the more chance of buzz as the string vibrates at the point of its biggest arc over a fret. If you pluck hard enough you will always cause fret buzz, even in a guitar with a reasonably low action and level (with each other) frets.

 

The truss rod acts to counter the pull of the strings on the headtock in order to keep the neck from bowing badly upwards. Ideally the neck should be either completely straight or have just a slight bit of upwards bow (known as relief.) Over-tightening the truss rod will always cause a backwards bow between nut and the middle of the fretboard. Adding 'relief' by loosening the truss rod slightly takes a bit of the straightness out of the neck (or cures the backward bow). This has the effect of raising the nut end fulcrum point up to about the area of the 10th fret. This will obviously reduce buzzing beyond this point because the fulcrum at the nut (or finger) in the lower note registers is raised. The other way to reduce buzz higher up the neck is to raise the other fulcrum point at the bridge saddle i.e. raise the action. Too high an action can make fretting more difficult in the higher and middle note registers and too much relief can make fretting feel a bit 'spongy' in the middle to low note registers.

 

There are two ways to reduce the amount of relief or raised action you need to introduce:-

-plucking the strings more gently or, more desirably

-having the frets professionally levelled, recrowned to shape and then polished since frets that are worn will obviously cause string buzz over the frets that are less worn higher up the neck.

 

So, if the lower notes (nut to 12th fret) are buzzing this could be due to:-

1. Backwards bow of the neck caused by an over-tightened truss rod (it could even be broken and stuck that way)

2. Fret wear in the first few (lower note) frets if the owner played mostly open chords and not a lot of higher note solos

3. Nut slots cut too low or nut itself filed down too low at its base

 

If the higher notes (12th to 22nd fret) are buzzing this could be due to:-

1. Action unrealistically low at the bridge

2. Generally more fret wear between nut and 10th-12th frets than higher up and/or...

3. Neck too straight- a little relief at the nut will, at least, reduce buzzing in the middle to upper registers but not necessarily the highest note frets.

4.Note you can also commonly get buzzing in the 15th-22nd frets on the G, B and high E strings if the owner plays a lot of solo work with string bending in the 12th to 15th fret pentatonic I and IV position box patterns (Keys of E or A respectively.)

 

Hopefully the above information will allow you to diagnose the source of the fret buzz. Provided the truss rod is not broken and the frets are not worn too low (necessitating a re-fret) your problems 1-4 can be easily fixed by a good tech who will do a fret dress (if necessary) as part of an overall set up (my local store charges £60 for this service.) Armed with this information you should be able to knock the price down further.

 

The cracking on the neck is more of a potential worry, especially if its around the back of nut area as it could be due to a break in the wood underneath that paint. Hopefully it is surface cracking of the paintwork but I think we need more information about what the cracks look like and where they are (preferably some good quality photos.) Have you tapped the area with a knuckle to see what it sounded like?

 

 

All of the above information pointys to a bit of a risk if you're not sure what exactly to look for. Can you take somebody who does know more about guitar set up and maintenance with you?

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Hi again!

 

This is a tricky one. When you say the upper part of the fingerboard, do you mean the lower notes (nearer to the nut) or the higher notes (nearer to the pickups?)

 

The strings vibrate in an eliptical pattern between the two fulcrum points- nut (or finger) and bridge saddle. This means that when a string is plucked it resonates most at a point exactly half way between the two fulcrum points. The harder you pluck, the greater the vibration, the more chance of buzz as the string vibrates at the point of its biggest arc over a fret. If you pluck hard enough you will always cause fret buzz, even in a guitar with a reasonably low action and level (with each other) frets.

 

The truss rod acts to counter the pull of the strings on the headtock in order to keep the neck from bowing badly upwards. Ideally the neck should be either completely straight or have just a slight bit of upwards bow (known as relief.) Over-tightening the truss rod will always cause a backwards bow between nut and the middle of the fretboard. Adding 'relief' by loosening the truss rod slightly takes a bit of the straightness out of the neck (or cures the backward bow). This has the effect of raising the nut end fulcrum point up to about the area of the 10th fret. This will obviously reduce buzzing beyond this point because the fulcrum at the nut (or finger) in the lower note registers is raised. The other way to reduce buzz higher up the neck is to raise the other fulcrum point at the bridge saddle i.e. raise the action. Too high an action can make fretting more difficult in the higher and middle note registers and too much relief can make fretting feel a bit 'spongy' in the middle to low note registers.

 

There are two ways to reduce the amount of relief or raised action you need to introduce:-

-plucking the strings more gently or, more desirably

-having the frets professionally levelled, recrowned to shape and then polished since frets that are worn will obviously cause string buzz over the frets that are less worn higher up the neck.

 

So, if the lower notes (nut to 12th fret) are buzzing this could be due to:-

1. Backwards bow of the neck caused by an over-tightened truss rod (it could even be broken and stuck that way)

2. Fret wear in the first few (lower note) frets if the owner played mostly open chords and not a lot of higher note solos

3. Nut slots cut too low or nut itself filed down too low at its base

 

If the higher notes (12th to 22nd fret) are buzzing this could be due to:-

1. Action unrealistically low at the bridge

2. Generally more fret wear between nut and 10th-12th frets than higher up and/or...

3. Neck too straight- a little relief at the nut will, at least, reduce buzzing in the middle to upper registers but not necessarily the highest note frets.

4.Note you can also commonly get buzzing in the 15th-22nd frets on the G, B and high E strings if the owner plays a lot of solo work with string bending in the 12th to 15th fret pentatonic I and IV position box patterns (Keys of E or A respectively.)

 

Hopefully the above information will allow you to diagnose the source of the fret buzz. Provided the truss rod is not broken and the frets are not worn too low (necessitating a re-fret) your problems 1-4 can be easily fixed by a good tech who will do a fret dress (if necessary) as part of an overall set up (my local store charges £60 for this service.) Armed with this information you should be able to knock the price down further.

 

The cracking on the neck is more of a potential worry, especially if its around the back of nut area as it could be due to a break in the wood underneath that paint. Hopefully it is surface cracking of the paintwork but I think we need more information about what the cracks look like and where they are (preferably some good quality photos.) Have you tapped the area with a knuckle to see what it sounded like?

 

 

All of the above information pointys to a bit of a risk if you're not sure what exactly to look for. Can you take somebody who does know more about guitar set up and maintenance with you?

 

Again thank you very much for your clear explanations!

 

When I said the upper part of the fingerboard I meant the higher notes after the 12th fret,Sorry if I was not clear.

 

My impression was that there was not release in the neck,probably not the main cause

though ,I will look better at the fret wear.

 

The cracking of the neck does not look bad,they are very superficial and there are not any cracks around the nut area,

I have not any photos however the cracks are longitudinal to the neck,

my impression from both the tiny cracks and the rustling from the pots is that

the guitar was placed in a humid place for sometime(it was humid when he gave me it!)

so the wood swelled and created these tiny cracks and the pots oxidized,

Is it a plausible hypotheses?

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  • 1 month later...

There are different levels of SG Specials...the higher end have glossy finishes, like the SG Standards. They are a lot more expensive than the Faded/Worn versions.

I recently bought a 1999 SG Special with a glossy finish and it has the metal top knobs as factory original.

The new versions of these guitars are about $1000 compared with the Faded/Worn versions which are a lot less.

The original SG Specials were glossy-the faded/Worn versions are relatively recent lower cost options.

 

mark

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picked up my special faded used, it had some shiny spots from use / wear that the previous owner put on it

I pulled it all down and buffed her out to a semi gloss by hand(only took two days).

Now it looks awesome, like it has been kicking around for lot longer than '07.

some of the natural wear points came through along the top of the body as well.

I personally love the look of a well played guitar. as time goes on it should wear quickly since the faded series seems to have a slightly thinner finish.

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