simon3142 Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 The intonation on this guitar is about 10 cents sharp at the 22nd fret on the thinnest three strings but OK on the others. I would like to try using the small grub screw at the back of the bridge to alter the bridge angle slightly. I assume this is what the grub screw is for. Does anyone know the tool needed to do this, it looks a bit like a very fine allen key, but it is something else. Here is a picture of the guitar: https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/8G73DDSwigy2yZWHa64iduBfgEm8lfbsJ5IK-W3p8eI?feat=directlink There are small grub screws at the back of the bridge next to the large mounting posts.
pfox14 Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 These early 60s SGs with the slanted bridge provide little to no fine adjustment of the intonation. I seriously doubt you can adjust it any closer than what you describe.
simon3142 Posted February 7, 2012 Author Posted February 7, 2012 These early 60s SGs with the slanted bridge provide little to no fine adjustment of the intonation. I seriously doubt you can adjust it any closer than what you describe. Thanks, but I would like to have a go if I can find the right tool for the grub screws. There is quite a lot of thread showing so it should be possible to reduce the slant of the bridge a bit. I wouldn't mind sacrificing the intonation on the lower strings if I could get it better on the upper strings. It starts to get quite annoying after the 17th fret.
L5Larry Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 There are small grub screws at the back of the bridge next to the large mounting posts. Yes, intonation adjustment is exactly what those set screws are for. They take a Allen head wrench of SAE size (not metric), and get very dirty and somewhat corroded over time. Make sure to clean the socket out with something like a paper clip, or exacto knife blade point, before trying to insert the wrench. The proper size Allen wrench may then even have to be "tapped" into the socket. DO NOT attempt to turn this screw with string tension on the bridge, loosen the strings first. A few notes; If these set screws are (or become) damaged, they are an off-the-shelf item at most any hardware store, in either Allen head, or machine screw type with a screwdriver head. No guitar will ever play perfectly in tune the entire length of the neck. 20 cents off at the 22nd fret may seem like a lot, but I would be most concerned with proper pitch where ever you do the most chording. Generally, the 12th fret is used for setting intonation because it is mathematically the halfway point of the scale length (nut to bridge). A guitar that intonates at the 12th fret but plays out of tune anywhere else on the neck has a fret location problem. When setting the intonation on any guitar, some compromise is usually required, and I'm not sure the 22nd fret is the proper place of priority. There are also adjustable saddle after-market replacements available for these wrap-around large post type bridges. Once the angle is set with the set screws, you would also have individual adjustments for each string. The bridge of this type that I put on my 1964 Firebird III was called a Leo Quan Badass.
simon3142 Posted February 8, 2012 Author Posted February 8, 2012 Yes, intonation adjustment is exactly what those set screws are for. They take a Allen head wrench of SAE size (not metric), and get very dirty and somewhat corroded over time. Make sure to clean the socket out with something like a paper clip, or exacto knife blade point, before trying to insert the wrench. The proper size Allen wrench may then even have to be "tapped" into the socket. DO NOT attempt to turn this screw with string tension on the bridge, loosen the strings first. A few notes; If these set screws are (or become) damaged, they are an off-the-shelf item at most any hardware store, in either Allen head, or machine screw type with a screwdriver head. No guitar will ever play perfectly in tune the entire length of the neck. 20 cents off at the 22nd fret may seem like a lot, but I would be most concerned with proper pitch where ever you do the most chording. Generally, the 12th fret is used for setting intonation because it is mathematically the halfway point of the scale length (nut to bridge). A guitar that intonates at the 12th fret but plays out of tune anywhere else on the neck has a fret location problem. When setting the intonation on any guitar, some compromise is usually required, and I'm not sure the 22nd fret is the proper place of priority. There are also adjustable saddle after-market replacements available for these wrap-around large post type bridges. Once the angle is set with the set screws, you would also have individual adjustments for each string. The bridge of this type that I put on my 1964 Firebird III was called a Leo Quan Badass. Thanks for the detailed information, non metric Allen keys are not so easy to find in the UK but it's good to know that's what I need. It's probably asking a bit much to get the intonation better than it is. There is barely any error at the 15th fret and it goes off quickly after 17. It's frustrating that the intonation is accurate all the way up on the lower three strings. Maybe the Leo Quan Badass bridge would be the way to go. Fitting a tunomatic bridge was suggested to me, but I don't want to modify the guitar in that way.
retrorod Posted February 8, 2012 Posted February 8, 2012 I agree with the above info. Also, the Leo Quan Badass bridge would give you more accurate control over your intonation and is a reversible mod. My '65 SG special came with one. Of course, being the vintage purist that I am, I wasn,t happy til I got the lightning bolt style bridge and the vibrola unit back in place. I never 'looked back' after that.... Rod
simon3142 Posted February 8, 2012 Author Posted February 8, 2012 It's a shame that it looks as though the Leo Quan Badass bridge is hard to come by at the moment. Allparts, the normal supplier doesn't have them. I found a Gold one on ebay which is the wrong colour. Maybe this would be an alternative as I have seen this bridge on SGs from the early 60s. http://www.tubesandmore.com/cemirror/inv/P-GTHLBW.GIF But as it is not adjustable there might not be much improvement over fiddling with the current bridge adjustment.
JellyWheat Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 L5Larry and retrorod are bang on. I have a '61 MM with an uncompensated wrap-around bridge. It intonates and plays just fine... My $0.02/FWIW J/W
retrorod Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 The Allparts bridge is what I refer to as the 'lightning bolt' compensated. It could be an improvement. Notice that the Allparts piece is (modern compensated) for an unwound G....That is slightly different than the '60's version. This got me to thinking You might experiment with some heavier guage strings (G,B,E) to 'dial in' the slight intonation issues with your original bridge....Just a thought! I may put my old LQ Badass up for sale. I'll let you know. Rod (edit) Just found my LeoQ. Interesting, it is stamped on the bottom with a USA patent# and Made in Germany!
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