FennRx Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 old men who need to be a retirement home anyways.
dem00n Posted February 7, 2012 Author Posted February 7, 2012 old men who need to be a retirement home anyways. You could say the same thing about all the guys you like to.
BigKahune Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 . I heard a report that said he wasn't happy with his contract and told them to FO. Anything can upset this deal. .
ShredAstaire Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 You could say the same thing about all the guys you like to. Dis!
JM2112 Posted February 8, 2012 Posted February 8, 2012 Fired by Yoko osbourne ...oh no's ROTFLMAO!!!!! [biggrin] [biggrin] You beat me to it!!!!!
stein Posted February 8, 2012 Posted February 8, 2012 Without knowing what he didn't like, there is know way to know. Did he get the same contract as the other 3? I'm a little confused as to why it is Sharon who makes the decision though. Who's band is it? I guess no Sabbath. Too bad.
dem00n Posted February 8, 2012 Author Posted February 8, 2012 Without knowing what he didn't like, there is know way to know. Did he get the same contract as the other 3? I'm a little confused as to why it is Sharon who makes the decision though. Who's band is it? I guess no Sabbath. Too bad. He said he was underpaid and etc, something like that. Ive seen this a lot, drummers wanting more and in the end getting fire or just quiting.
stein Posted February 8, 2012 Posted February 8, 2012 He said he was underpaid and etc, something like that. Ive seen this a lot, drummers wanting more and in the end getting fire or just quiting. Yes, but was it the same amount the others were getting, as in 1/4, that he wanted? OR was it that he felt ALL of them should ask for more of the pie and encouraging the others to follow suit? Or was he like, "I'm asking for this, and if you other 3 want to accept less, then go ahead". I guess what I mean to say is that unless it is said what he was asking or didn't like, it is hard to judge if he is being "greedy", or if he is justified. It's NOT my business, or my place to judge. But I do wonder why it is Sharon taking the credit for the firing. It makes me question it.
dem00n Posted February 8, 2012 Author Posted February 8, 2012 Here, i found what he wrote. Dear Sabbath Fans, Fellow Musicians and Interested Parties, At this time, I would love nothing more than to be able to proceed with the Black Sabbath album and tour. However, I am unable to continue unless a "signable" contract is drawn up; a contract that reflects some dignity and respect toward me as an original member of the band. Last year, I worked diligently in good faith with Tony, Ozzy and Geezer. And on 11/11/11, again in good faith, I participated in the L.A. press conference. Several days ago, after nearly a year of trying to negotiate, another "unsignable" contract was handed to me. Let me say that although this has put me in some kind of holding pattern, I am packed and ready to leave the U.S. for England. More importantly, I definitely want to play on the album, and I definitely want to tour with Black Sabbath. Since the news of Tony's illness, and the understanding that the band would move production to the U.K., I've spent every day getting to or living in a place of readiness to leave. That involves something of a task, and as I've tried to find out what's going on with the U.K. sessions, I've realized that I've been getting "the cold shoulder" (and, I might add, not for the first time). Feeling somewhat ostracized, my guess is as of today, I will know nothing of what's happening unless I sign "the unsignable contract." The place I'm in feels lousy and lonely because as much as I want to play and participate, I also have to stand for something and not sign on. If I sign as-is, I stand to lose my rights, dignity and respectability as a rock musician. I believe in freedom and freedom of speech. I grew up in a hard rock/metal band. We stood for something then, and we played from the heart with honesty and sincerity. I am in the spirit of integrity, far from the corporate malady, I am real and honest, fair and compassionate. If I'm replaced, I have to face you, the beloved Sabbath fans. I hope you will not hold me responsible for the failure of an original Black Sabbath lineup as promoted. Without fault finding, I want to assure everyone that my loyalty to Sabbath is intact. So here I am. I lay my truth down before you. I'm good to go IF I get a "signable" contract. I don't want to let anyone down, especially Black Sabbath and all the Sabbath fans. You know I love you. It would be a sad day in Rock if this current situation fell to the desires of a few. My position is not greed-driven. I'm not holding out for a "big piece" of the action (money) like some kind of blackmail deal. I’d like something that recognizes and is reflective of my contributions to the band, including the reunions that started fourteen years ago. After the last tour I vowed to never again sign on to an unreasonable contract. I want a contract that shows some respect to me and my family, a contract that will honor all that I've brought to Black Sabbath since its beginning. That's the story so far. Stay safe and stay strong. I love every single one of you. – Bill Ward
stein Posted February 8, 2012 Posted February 8, 2012 Thanks for posting this. This is what I read. In a way, I think a lot of times it is best not to make accusations, or statements like this to the public. Sometimes it is best to keep it private, preventing the public from the POSSIBILITY of taking sides. (Such as with Priest and KK quitting. No one will EVER know what went on, and it does show a sort of "class" about them as a whole). But on the other hand, if you feel like you have been wronged and the only way to stop it is to go public and let the TRUTH out (as a way of keeping others honest), then I think you need to say whats up.
duane v Posted February 8, 2012 Posted February 8, 2012 I dont see Iommi or Butler coming to Wards rescue on this one ..... As a matter of fact they seem ready to move on without him
cabba2203 Posted February 8, 2012 Posted February 8, 2012 I dont see Iommi or Butler coming to Wards rescue on this one ..... As a matter of fact they seem ready to move on without him They may already be contractually obligated, but yeah.
duane v Posted February 8, 2012 Posted February 8, 2012 They may already be contractually obligated, but yeah. But they are not obligated to not show remorse for Bill..... My feeling is Bill wants too much.... Let's face it, Ozzy and Tony are Black Sabbath, not Bill Ward
dem00n Posted February 8, 2012 Author Posted February 8, 2012 But they are not obligated to not show remorse for Bill..... My feeling is Bill wants too much.... Let's face it, Ozzy and Tony are Black Sabbath, not Bill Ward Excuse me? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZCyOWLrRTE What you say?
duane v Posted February 8, 2012 Posted February 8, 2012 Oh I've listen to War Pigs a million times, and I like it because of the song and not because of Bill Ward. just sign up Vinny Appice and Black Sabbath will rock just fine
stein Posted February 8, 2012 Posted February 8, 2012 But they are not obligated to not show remorse for Bill..... My feeling is Bill wants too much.... Let's face it, Ozzy and Tony are Black Sabbath, not Bill Ward Sorry sir, but gonna have to part ways on the point. Ozzy and Tony are Ozzy and Tony...Sabbath is the 4 of them. Or perhaps, the ORIGINAL Sabbath is. I tend to think that if you are there and have put the same amount of time into the band (rehearsals, recording, helping with materiel) then you deserve the same compensation. And a tour is equal effort regardless. Songwriting, that is it's own contract/compensation. Keep in mind, I know nothing. I don't know what they did for this, who did what, and no idea what the contract is or isn't.
stein Posted February 8, 2012 Posted February 8, 2012 I dont see Iommi or Butler coming to Wards rescue on this one ..... As a matter of fact they seem ready to move on without him But this here...that may say something.
duane v Posted February 8, 2012 Posted February 8, 2012 Sorry sir, but gonna have to part ways on the point. Ozzy and Tony are Ozzy and Tony...Sabbath is the 4 of them. Or perhaps, the ORIGINAL Sabbath is. I tend to think that if you are there and have put the same amount of time into the band (rehearsals, recording, helping with materiel) then you deserve the same compensation. And a tour is equal effort regardless. Songwriting, that is it's own contract/compensation. Keep in mind, I know nothing. I don't know what they did for this, who did what, and no idea what the contract is or isn't. Once upon a time Sabbath moved on just fine without Ozzy..... And Sabbath will move on just fine without Bill Ward.
stein Posted February 8, 2012 Posted February 8, 2012 Once upon a time Sabbath moved on just fine without Ozzy..... And Sabbath will move on just fine without Bill Ward. They FIRED Ozzy. Perhaps the shoe is on the other foot?
duane v Posted February 8, 2012 Posted February 8, 2012 Whatever the case, Sabbath moved on just fine after they gave Ozzy the boot. Bill Ward wasn't fired..... He chose not to sign...... Sabbath moves on...... Seems simple to me
Riffster Posted February 8, 2012 Posted February 8, 2012 Frankly I think this isn't the first time Bill gets shafted, it is unfortunate but a drummer is replaceable, Sucks that he help forged the sound of the band, it wasn't just Tony's guitar or Ozzy's voice. If he does not carry on with them then it is not the original Black Sabbath, Just to clarify, when Ozzy was fired Bill was the one that did not agree as Ozzy was a dear friend to him.
cabba2203 Posted February 8, 2012 Posted February 8, 2012 Let's face it, Ozzy and Tony are Black Sabbath, not Bill Ward Ah - you wound me! I believe they all were needed in order to create that which became the classic sound of Sabbath. Plus Bill's heaviness and hard drumming were instrumental in their sound - his fills were great! Also, Geezer is a monster on bass and without him, you lose a lot of Sabbath's song writing. LOL - Everyone drops the hate on drummers, like Ringo in the Beatles.
EVOL! Posted February 8, 2012 Posted February 8, 2012 But they are not obligated to not show remorse for Bill..... My feeling is Bill wants too much.... Let's face it, Ozzy and Tony are Black Sabbath, not Bill Ward Oh I've listen to War Pigs a million times, and I like it because of the song and not because of Bill Ward. just sign up Vinny Appice and Black Sabbath will rock just fine I disagree with your comments like you would not believe and as a fellow band veteran I am shocked by what you wrote. It's like saying Zeppelin could just go on without Bonham. Could they play those songs with another drummer? Yes. Would they have the same feel? Not even close. A great drummer will take your band farther than you deserve to go and Bill Ward is a great example of that. Sabbath had the songs, but that train barreling down the tracks at 300 mi/hr, threatening to derail, but never does sound was Ward's feel. No offense to any of the Appice brothers, but they just cannot loosie-goosie groove like Ward.
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