Granadillo? Whats Up?

[Zentar]

Bump.

 

 

I've noticed a much lighter red on Rosewood fret boards in newer fret boards in many brands of guitars recently. They are listed as Rosewood but remind my layman eyes of Granadillo.

Are builders passing off Granadillo as Rosewood?

[Aymara]

Are builders passing off Granadillo as Rosewood?

 

Rosewood is a family of trees with several different origins and subspecies, Grenadillo being one of them. Furthermore there is a lot of variation in the color of Grenadillo. The Grenadillo on my Signature T doesn't look different to Brazilian Rosewood, so I got a pretty dark sample.

[Zentar]

ii don't mind them using granadillo as much as them claiming its rosewood

[Aymara]

ii don't mind them using granadillo as much as them claiming its rosewood

 

Above I posted somewhere, that it is also called Cocobolo, which is wrong. It's a Cocobolo substitute. As it seems Granadillo is more often called Macacauba.

Fact is, it's tonal characteristics are similar to rosewood ... I like it after I oiled it ;)

[Guest Farnsbarns]

ii don't mind them using granadillo as much as them claiming its rosewood

 

It is rosewood.

[btoth76]

Hello.

 

It's rosewood, as said.

 

Dalbergia retusa, also known as: Caviuna, Cocobolo, Cocobolo Prieto, Funeram, Granadillo, Jacarandáholz, Nambar, ñamba, Nicaraguan Rosewood, Palisander, Palissandro, Palo Negro, Pau Preto, Rosewood, Urauna - from Wikipedia.

 

Bence.

[pippy]

It Is.

 

Pip.

[kidblast]

Thanks for the links.

 

I have done all that already. I am curious to know what it does to a Les Paul. How it feels and sounds. I wanted ebony(traditional thing).

 

It seems without spending exorbitant sums I get granadillo or obeche or baked maple. Ok,i guess. I have been fender for so long and without A paul for so long that rosewood or maple(non baked) is my norm.

 

I am just disappointed ,mostly with myself for not geting the model of Paul that is supposed to be here tomorrow,sooner. That I am trying to find a reason to keep it.

 

I know play it blah blah blah. My problem is I am very anal and quite the child for a guy who will be 55 in a week.

 

I can't comment on Granadillo cuz I don't have anything with that, but my SG has baked maple, and I think it's great! I wouldn't mind having this on any of my Gibsons. Maple being a a very hardwood most of us seem to think it reminds us more of ebony than anything else.

[Aymara]

... from Wikipedia.

 

That's the source I was relying to so far too, but further research through sites of luthiers and wood dealers show, that this information is presumably wrong, because Granadillo is definitely not Cocobolo, but a substitute for that wood.

It might be worth doing further research about "Macacauba", because many infos in WWW about Granadillo seem to be plain wrong and this seems to be the more common name.

But one thing is for sure ... it's a nice feeling and sounding wood.

 

 

 

[Aymara]

Here's some more info about Macacauba / Granadillo ... more detailled than Wikipedia:

http://www.wood-database.com/lumber-identification/hardwoods/macacauba/

I also found hints, that this wood is also used for "wood block instruments" like the Marimba.

[pippy]

The word 'rosewood' refers to many different types of wood; not just one.

The dictionary definition states simply;

 

"...any of various tropical trees (especially genus Dalbergia)..."

The botanic species name for Granadillo, as Bence has already mentioned, is Dalbergia Retusa and is most assuredly classified as a rosewood.

Philip.

[Aymara]

The botanic species name for Granadillo, as Bence has already mentioned, is Dalbergia Retusa and is most assuredly classified as a rosewood.

 

Dalbergia Retusa is a quote from Wikipedia. Most other ressources like the Wood Database say, that it belongs to the Platymiscium spp. family of trees.

[pippy]

We're going to go round in circles.

 

The problem is just as there is not one type of rosewood neither is there just one type of Granadillo. Look up Brya Ebenus, for instance.

The Platymiscium family which you mention is itself a subspecies of the Dalbergia classification.

 

Pip.

[kidblast]

We're going to go round in circles.

 

 

 

indeed,

 

I will bet 50 bucks that I could hand you two guitars, and without being able to look at the fret board, you could not tell one from another.

 

I have maple, rosewood ebony fretboards,, when I play them all, I still play and sound just like ME playing a guitar...

 

At the end of the day, I'm of the mind that it simply doesn't matter. It seems that often times, people think that looking for alternate woods for the components is always a degradation of quality, when it's probably not really the case at all. (unless your talking Rich-lite, then maybe you're on to something!

 

if the simple fact is Indian rosewood (or what ever) is coming in short supply or a protected resource, guitar makers need to make changes, or they stop making guitars.

 

what would you rather? no more new les pauls? Ever see Bob Taylor's video on Ebony? google it.. it's a bit eye opening.

[Aymara]

The Platymiscium family which you mention is itself a subspecies of the Dalbergia classification.

 

Ok, that is the ultimate answer ;)

[Zentar]

The Granadillo on my new 2014 is listed everywhere in print as Rosewood. I thought it looked very light or reddish compared to all the other many Rosewood fret boards Ive owned. I thought I had a Rosewood fret board on my expensive LP. It's not Rosewood so stop calling it Rosewood in sales brochures!!!

 

I just wanted to find an oil to use once a year that might darken the Granadillo just a tad since I use fret board oil anyhow. Why not use an oil that darkens? I'm not trying to blacken the Granadillo.

[stein]

The Granadillo on my new 2014 is listed everywhere in print as Rosewood. I thought it looked very light or reddish compared to all the other many Rosewood fret boards Ive owned. I thought I had a Rosewood fret board on my expensive LP. It's not Rosewood so stop calling it Rosewood in sales brochures!!!

 

I just wanted to find an oil to use once a year that might darken the Granadillo just a tad since I use fret board oil anyhow. Why not use an oil that darkens? I'm not trying to blacken the Granadillo.

Are you sure it is Granadillo? Could it just be a more reddish slab of Rosewood?

 

As far as I know, Gibson has been pretty good at stating Granadillo for their guitar with it. BUT, also, specs often change or they make runs with whatever, faster than they can get in the catalog, or certain runs made for certain buyers (like GC), where the specs are chosen by the vender and don't show in the Gibson website or catalog.

[Zentar]

It is rosewood.

 

No it isn't Rosewood. Is Grapefruit an Orange? Is Soccer the same as American football? Europeans call soccer "football". Shark is sometimes sold as scallop.

[stein]

No it isn't Rosewood. Is Grapefruit an Orange? Is Soccer the same as American football? Europeans call soccer "football". Shark is sometimes sold as scallop.

Well, Brazilian Rosewood isn't Indian Rosewood, either. By the same standards, not even close.

 

Although, I DO agree it's good to be specific. I would want to know if something is Granadillo or Indian Rosewood as well, although I may not have a preference.

 

Not to be confusing, but I buy or have a guitar based on what it is, and that's what it plays, feels, sounds, and looks like. I would NEVER buy a guitar based on spec. And never judge one that way either.

 

That isn't quite the same thing as wanting to know what it is I got or what I might buy. Knowing doesn't change what it is, but it helps to be able to learn what it is. It's info I would want available IF and when I wanted to know.

[pippy]

...It's not Rosewood so stop calling it Rosewood in sales brochures!!!...

Oh for crying out loud. Have you actually read any of the links in this thread?

 

'Granadillo' is officially classified as a Rosewood.

 

Stop saying it isn't a Rosewood.

It is a Rosewood.

 

End of story.

[Zentar]

Oh for crying out loud. Have you actually read any of the links in this thread?

 

'Granadillo' is officially classified as a Rosewood.

 

Stop saying it isn't a Rosewood.

It is a Rosewood.

 

End of story.

 

 

Flim flam logic. Is an orange a grapefruit in your way of thinking? Both are citrus.

 

Why don't they label Brazilian Rosewood "Granadillo"? Why call it Brazilian Rosewood? Let's call it Granadillo!

[Aymara]

I just wanted to find an oil to use once a year that might darken the Granadillo just a tad since I use fret board oil anyhow. Why not use an oil that darkens? I'm not trying to blacken the Granadillo.

 

I think, this quote is the most important point. It doesn't really matter, what tree species it really is. What really matters is, that many people are not satisfied with the color.

Granadillo sounds like rosewood, it feels like rosewood and some samples even look like rosewood, like on my SigT. But many samples are lighter in color, more orange.

I found out, that Planet Waves Lemon Oil isn't only nice for oiling the fretboard, it also darkens the wood slightly and improves the color saturation. But no oil will make an orange fretboard brown.

In case a color change is wanted, I would contact a wood specialist to find the right wood dye for the wanted color. But be warned, that snow white bindings might turn yellow, if you use anything else than colorless oil, e.g. Duesenberg Fretboard Lotion. On creme colored bindings it seems to be no problem ... at least with fretboard oils.

[Zentar]

I think, this quote is the most important point. It doesn't really matter, what tree species it really is. What really matters is, that many people are not satisfied with the color.

Granadillo sounds like rosewood, it feels like rosewood and some samples even look like rosewood, like on my SigT. But many samples are lighter in color, more orange.

I found out, that Planet Waves Lemon Oil isn't only nice for oiling the fretboard, it also darkens the wood slightly and improves the color saturation. But no oil will make an orange fretboard brown.

In case a color change is wanted, I would contact a wood specialist to find the right wood dye for the wanted color. But be warned, that snow white bindings might turn yellow, if you use anything else than colorless oil, e.g. Duesenberg Fretboard Lotion. On creme colored bindings it seems to be no problem ... at least with fretboard oils.

T

 

The Duesenburg oil sounds like an oil I may try since it may darken the fret board. Im not looking for a big change. Just a slight warming of wood tone will do it.

Iwish I had a cheap granadillo guitar to test first. Gotta keep my eyes open for a cheap project guitar.

[Aymara]

The Duesenburg oil sounds like an oil I may try since it may darken the fret board. Im not looking for a big change. Just a slight warming of wood tone will do it.

 

The Duesenberg oil is of very high quality, but it has a strange smell, which will vanish after a few days. I use it for my Gretsch Panther and my Mayones Regius, which have a snow white binding. When I got the Panther, the rosewood fretboard had a slight grey cast, because it was extremely dry. The Duesenberg oil improved the feel of the wood and improved the color saturation, but didn't darken it. The grey cast was gone after the first oiling ... I oil all my fretboards 2-3 times per year.

This is the oil I would use exclusively on very expensive guitars ... you know, what a Gretsch Pro Line costs? ;)

When trying out wood dye though, yes, it would make sense to test it first, before you use it on an expensive guitar.

PS: The Granadillo of my Signature T showed the same grey cast as my Panther, when I got it. The wood was extremely dry too. After oiling it, it looked and felt much better. And yes, I used the Duesenberg oil.

[pippy]

No it isn't Rosewood. Is Grapefruit an Orange? Is Soccer the same as American football? Europeans call soccer "football". Shark is sometimes sold as scallop.

Flim flam logic. Is an orange a grapefruit in your way of thinking? Both are citrus.

Why don't they label Brazilian Rosewood "Granadillo"? Why call it Brazilian Rosewood? Let's call it Granadillo!

Yes it is a Rosewood.

 

I'll try to explain it in simplistic terms for you.

 

Rosewood is a general term used to describe the timber derived from a large number of species of tree - Granadillo being amongst their number.

 

You have almost explained it to yourself. Taking your own analogies as a starting point;

A grapefruit isn't an orange but, as you yourself wrote, both can be labelled as 'citrus fruits' because they are, in effect, subspecies of that particular 'set' of fruits as distinct from, say, a banana.

Soccer isn't the same as American Football but both can be labelled 'ball games' because they are subspecies of that set of games played with a ball as opposed to, say, fencing.

Granadillo isn't the same as Brazillian Rosewood but they can both be labelled 'Rosewood' because they are both subspecies of that set of trees classified as being 'Rosewood' as opposed to, say, Oak.

 

We can't call Granadillo 'Brazillian Rosewood' for the simple reason that it isn't Brazillian Rosewood - same as a grapefruit isn't an orange and soccer isn't American Football.

 

Pip.