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Gibsons sound better with PB Lights


Harmonics101

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Do you ever worry about the greater tension on the neck by using mediums David? I'm not sure if you have any vintage Gibsons in your stable but personally I'm not super keen on the idea Mediums on my vintage guitars. To be honest, I tend to play a half step down even using Lights at home thinking its all going to avoid any future problems...If I'm playing with friends I'll tune up to pitch.

 

Am I crazy?

 

[omg]

 

I would never say you were crazy, but I do think your concern is misplaced. Unless you're dealing with a lightly braced parlor guitar that is a century old (or a guitar built specifically for light-gauge strings) nearly every acoustic guitar you'll come across is built to withstand the tension of medium strings tuned to pitch.

 

In fact, from a technical point of view, the guitars are probably overbuilt. But there is no reason that a properly glued bridge/soundboard joint and neck/neck block joint won't last a long time under full string tension. That's what they were built for. All told, those joints provide a lot of gluing area, and there are plenty of vintage guitars around that have spent their lives strung with medium strings and are in great shape.

 

When you look at relative tensions, mediums aren't hugely different from lights. For example, if you're looking at D'Addario phosphor bronze, the EJ12s, a medium set, are only 36.4 pounds more than the EJ13s, a light set. Go to http://www.daddario.com/DADProductFamily.Page?ActiveID=3768&familyid=9 and click on "Family Tension Chart."

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Just by way of an example, you can get away with lights on a J45 type (name your model) but a J200 needs a medium to get the sound out of it. The long scale BKs and AJs sound huge with Ms, fwiw. Im agnostic on the avians (Birds and Doves).

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I would never say you were crazy, but I do think your concern is misplaced. Unless you're dealing with a lightly braced parlor guitar that is a century old (or a guitar built specifically for light-gauge strings) nearly every acoustic guitar you'll come across is built to withstand the tension of medium strings tuned to pitch.

 

In fact, from a technical point of view, the guitars are probably overbuilt. But there is no reason that a properly glued bridge/soundboard joint and neck/neck block joint won't last a long time under full string tension. That's what they were built for. All told, those joints provide a lot of gluing area, and there are plenty of vintage guitars around that have spent their lives strung with medium strings and are in great shape.

 

When you look at relative tensions, mediums aren't hugely different from lights. For example, if you're looking at D'Addario phosphor bronze, the EJ12s, a medium set, are only 36.4 pounds more than the EJ13s, a light set. Go to http://www.daddario....3768&familyid=9 and click on "Family Tension Chart."

 

Interesting Dave,...thanks for that....

 

[thumbup]

 

I know that new guitars are generally very well built and can handle stresses but my concern is with instruments over 40 years old who have had neck resets and may also have body "movement" which can possibly weakening the overall strength on an instrument. An example would be my '63 CW. Lots of movement around the neck join and drops in the top over the last 49 years and definately at least one re-set....

 

I'm going to check out that link the posted about relative tensions....and maybe I'll wack a set of Mediums in my J-50 (....which looks solid all round and has never had a re-set.) Being as paranoid as I'm am,..I'll probabley still only tune up a half step down.

 

[unsure]

 

 

I a seperate note: Do you detune before putting your guitars in acse for travelling on the road or just storing when you are not playing them?

 

[confused]

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I really liked the sound using PB Martin SP medium (13-56) on my Songwriter but found these hard to play on higher frets and so I found a compromise between light (12-53) and medium and ordered PB Martin SP light-medium (12.5-55) not many brands are offering this gauge..."à suivre"...

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Interesting Dave,...thanks for that....

 

[thumbup]

 

I know that new guitars are generally very well built and can handle stresses but my concern is with instruments over 40 years old who have had neck resets and may also have body "movement" which can possibly weakening the overall strength on an instrument. An example would be my '63 CW. Lots of movement around the neck join and drops in the top over the last 49 years and definately at least one re-set....

 

I'm going to check out that link the posted about relative tensions....and maybe I'll wack a set of Mediums in my J-50 (....which looks solid all round and has never had a re-set.) Being as paranoid as I'm am,..I'll probabley still only tune up a half step down.

 

[unsure]

 

 

I a seperate note: Do you detune before putting your guitars in acse for travelling on the road or just storing when you are not playing them?

 

[confused]

 

Sorry for the delay in getting back to you; just didn't look at the computer over the weekend. As far as detuning the guitar before traveling, no, I don't. It's been ages since I've flown with a guitar and if I were doing that, I probably would loosen the strings. But otherwise, I think constantly loosening and tightening the strings isn't good for the guitar's long-term health.

 

As for neck re-sets, they come with the turf. Some guitars will need them after a few years, and some won't. I've got a kit-built guitar that a guy built for me in '05 and it is currently undergoing its third neck re-set. The problem is he just didn't get the neck angle right in the beginning, and I'm paying for that now, literally and figuratively. If the guitar didn't have killer sound, I wouldn't have bothered and would've stopped throwing good money after bad. But it is a great-sounding instrument and records well (I used it on 10 of the 12 songs on my last record) and it also has a cool vibe to it. I found a guy I trust who was willing to do it for a reasonable sum, so I figured I'd have him fix it.

 

But some guys here own vintage guitars that have never needed a re-set, and some own guitars that could benefit from one after a decade or two. It just depends on the guitar and I'm not sure string gauge, over time, would make any difference.

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Sorry for the delay in getting back to you; just didn't look at the computer over the weekend. As far as detuning the guitar before traveling, no, I don't. It's been ages since I've flown with a guitar and if I were doing that, I probably would loosen the strings. But otherwise, I think constantly loosening and tightening the strings isn't good for the guitar's long-term health.

 

Thanks Dave for your thoughts on this.

 

I personally disagree with you on the "loosening the strings" and long term health. I'm a big believer in this procedure.....I think that it all boils down to simple physics : the more tension over a long period of time = the more strain on the body, joint and belly = more need for re-sets.

 

Saying that, it won't really be an issue for me as I most probabley won't be around for it to be an issue on some of my guitars!!!!

 

[smile]

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Thanks Dave for your thoughts on this.

 

I personally disagree with you on the "loosening the strings" and long term health. I'm a big believer in this procedure.....I think that it all boils down to simple physics : the more tension over a long period of time = the more strain on the body, joint and belly = more need for re-sets.

 

Saying that, it won't really be an issue for me as I most probabley won't be around for it to be an issue on some of my guitars!!!!

 

[smile]

 

Here is Frank Ford's advice for flying with a guitar: http://www.frets.com/FRETSPages/Musician/GenMaint/Packing/packing1.html

 

If you're just traveling by car, though, I think constantly detuning and tuning back up to pitch is unnecessary. You have to keep in mind that the guitar is built to handle string tension. That is one of the fundamental aspects of the whole guitar-construction equation. String tension only becomes "excessive" if some other factor is injected into the equation, such as excessive heat that might loosen the glue on the bridge or on the neck/neck block joint. Absent that, string tension is not a huge problem for a guitar because that is what it is built to deal with. Some bellying is natural (and most acoustics have "loaded" top braces so they already come with a certain degree of bellying) but otherwise, keep in mind your guitar is probably well-built and can handle most of the stuff you throw at it. (Not "throw" literally, mind you.)

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I just put Gibson Masterbuilt Premiums 11-52 PB's on my H-Bird the day before yesterday. They are about to fall into groove and suits the guitar splendidly.

 

Like dhanners says, the result of thinner strings is less of everything and the Bird obviously loses some volume and power. But less of everything also means less of that half-boomy tendency heard from the G-string when fingerpicking, and the overall now 'smaller' sound, is still real good. It's as if the lighter gauge kind of frees the Bird a bit and as that is what I'm after (and the direction the instrument is goin' anyway), I'm fairly happy with the experiment so far. Will definitely go back to lights after this side-road and look forward to the comparison.

 

Do you ever worry about the greater tension on the neck by using mediums David? I'm not sure if you have any vintage Gibsons in your stable but personally I'm not super keen on the idea Mediums on my vintage guitars. To be honest, I tend to play a half step down even using Lights at home thinking its all going to avoid any future problems...If I'm playing with friends I'll tune up to pitch.

 

Am I crazy?

I follow you - I tune half a step down also, but do that as a norm. Doesn't prevent me from goin up in standard if I feel like it though.

My 1963 S.J. is all down in D. Sounds better there, , , and as said, it's common territory for me.

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I won't go the lights route with my AJ, but I think I'm gonna try some PB on it for the first time tonight. Got several free packs of Martin SP lifespans so might as well try one on the AJ even though im not a fan of SPs or lifespans. AJ is amazingly bright for a rosewood guitar so maybe the PB will tame it some. Just hate to pull the Elixers off. There only a month old and still sound brand new [cool]

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