Anyone else with some ES-345 TD ?

[tsol]

I have just scored this one a few days ago, nearly mint condition. No breaks or repairs. It's an ES-345 TD Walnut. The sticker inside the soundhole says 'Kalamazoo, Michigan' etc.. and the s/n would show the year made 1974-75, (the guitar dater project website). The previous owner replaced the original stop bar by a more modern one allowing some fine tunning, all the rest is stock, wiring and electronics are untouched and the varitone system has never been removed or altered. I got one bummer of a situation here, it's been only a few days since i have it and i yet had no chance to really try it, because i have no amp at the location where i am at. :) so i'm enjoying its banjo-like sound when playing it dry lol Another thing, the one i have here is a 'thin' line, the neck is really thin and feels like some LP 60's.

 

Is there any one else with some ES-345TD, i have heard the walnut's tone would be slightly different to some sunburst or traditionnal cherry 345's, as this one is my first 335/345 ever, im interested hearing your opinions.

 

 

 

 

 

[Ken Rayba]

Hi, well if the wiring hasn't been changed, it is wired in "stereo" and you will need a "Y" chord for both picks up. The main plug going into the guitar will be a stereo plug, w/the "Y" with two mono plugs. Don't know if you were aware of that.

[L5Larry]

Great looking 345. I've got a 2000 built "Historic" 345 (mono) that I love and is my main electric guitar. I've also had a similar era 335 ('75), that was an absolutely fantastic guitar. I think you will be very happy with your new guitar.

 

Here's a photo of my sunburst:

[tsol]

Hi' date=' well if the wiring hasn't been changed, it is wired in "stereo" and you will need a "Y" chord for both picks up. The main plug going into the guitar will be a stereo plug, w/the "Y" with two mono plugs. Don't know if you were aware of that.

 

[/quote']

 

i figured out the jack output on the guitar would be stereo.. but what you say here is weird, what would i need so i can play it just like a normal guitar, hearing both pickups including the varitone feature plugged in to an amp? if i will be using that "Y" connector/split how i can have both pickups on the same amp?

[tsol]

Great looking 345. I've got a 2000 built "Historic" 345 (mono) that I love and is my main electric guitar. I've also had a similar era 335 ('75)' date=' that was an absolutely fantastic guitar. I think you will be very happy with your new guitar.

 

Here's a photo of my sunburst:

[img']http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3260/2338123474_11545056cf_o.jpg[/img]

 

thats one nice looking 345, im sure it plays well

 

how is the neck on it? is it as thin as the one on your LP i see on that avatar group shot?

[Robin Nahum]

Hi Tsol,

 

Congratulations on your new 345.

 

I have had two.

 

This was my first - a 1966 with a very skinny neck and 1 5/8" nut.

 

While it sounded like an L5 when I fitted it with flatwound .012s, I found it hard to play, especially when switching from a Fender American Standard neck.

 

 

I replaced it with a 2002 Memphis Custom Shop Reissue which has a fatter neck and a 1 11/16" nut.

 

 

You can see that Gibson redesigned the output arrangements for this model (Lucille is similar) so that if you use the back socket by itself, it functions as a regular mono output but if you use the second socket, it gives you the output from the bridge pickup and the back socket just gives you the output from the neck pickup.

 

As to the difference between walnut and other timbers used in these models, qui sait? Tone depends on a whole bunch of factors.

 

With regard to playing a traditional stereo 345 like your's through one amp, you should have a look at:

 

http://forums.gibson.com/Default.aspx?g=posts&t=471

http://forums.gibson.com/Default.aspx?g=posts&t=6561

 

RN

[tsol]

hi Robin,

 

thanks for the info. i definitely wished i could have one 345TD with that larger neck, at least something close to the one i have on an ES-175 which is much more suitable for my fingers , the ES-175 and Flying V necks are the ones i play the most easily and comfortably, i can even play some things that i cant play on my LP and strats... anyways, as soon as i get close to an amp with my new 345TD i will check whats going and how i can figure out the connection..

[ES345]

Tsol, I like your new walnut, very nice.

 

 

 

This is a 1962 that i bought new, price was $ 330 dollars, i got a 15 dollar discount. As far as playing the guitar into one amp, you get a Y cord that accepts two single inputs and then joins them into a single output, anywhere from 5 to 10 dollars.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

peace

[Ken Rayba]

What I meant by the "Y" chord, go to your local music store see if a stereo "Y" chord and try the guitar thru two seperate amplifers, and an amplifier w/two seperate channels and see how it sounds. The amp needs two seperate channels, w/seperate inputs, not an amplifer w/one channel and two inputs. I have a Super Reverb, that four spkrs, and two seperate channels. I think a Deluxe may have two inputs, but only one speaker, that doesn't mean it has two seperate channels.

 

There was mention regarding the Super should have the channels out of phase w/each other, but I never did an explanation of what that meant. I feed either channel into each other, using another chord & didn't have a problem.

 

I know we went thru this on another thread that Robin posted. Before you go thru all of that, try the "Y" scenario and see how it sounds. I don't think we ever did resolve it, but it was interesting conversation & quite a bit of information was discussed.

 

I've been told that my guitar must of been re-wired, I know it wasn't I bought it brand new, and it came w/a Gibson "Y" chord. I tried it at the store before buying it, and I know, if it didn't sound good, I sure wouldn't of purchased it. I have a 330 and a 335, and I use by Super, and they don't sound not that much different. They all sound good. If I knew I had to go thru all of that just to make it sound, I would of never of bought it.

 

Seems to me when Gibson made these, they were even advertised that it came w/a Y chord, so you could use two seprate amps, or two channels of the same amp.

 

But give it a try, it can't hurt nothing, this way you can make a decision of what you want to do.

[tsol]

ES345, that's one true relic you got there... and i believe it must be priced with 2500% of inflation nowdays! :)

 

sometimes i wish i was born much more eaerlier.. :) lol

 

anyways, here is what i got today for my ES345 walnut, i think it will do the job:

 

[kaicho8888]

Tsol:

 

Your plugs are electrically the same as what I have done. Using a stereo plug, I just soldered the two leads together to make a mono. However, there is a loss of volume and tone when I select both pickups. The tone becomes very thin without the bass. You will notice the drop in volume if both volume are dialed to 10 on your guitar. If you turn both volume knobs down one at a time, you will notice that the volume will peak and then drop after about 8.5.... very strange indeed.

 

If I use a stereo cable with two separate amps, I get no loss in volume or tone. This is how I've played for years.

 

Howerver, if I use a stereo cable with one amp having two inputs, I get a very thin sound when both pickups are selected (switch in middle position). The amp inputs must be 180 degrees out of phase. I read that some members do not have this probleml So I checked to see if my ES-345 pickups were in phase...they were in phase (I am the original owner).

 

Another member mentioned to use a Bigshot ABY that has a phase switcher on it.

 

http://www.tonebone.com/re-bigshot-aby.htm

 

I'll wait until somebody tries this out and reports back to our forum. This sounds promissing and it is supposedly all passive componets.

[Ken Rayba]

Hi, that is what I posted earlier. You mentioned you plugged you guitar into an amp having two imputs. That is not the same as having an amp w/two seperate channels! If you plug into an amp with only one channel w/two inputs, you get a real thin type sound. You metioned the soldered chord, I have one too, it doesn't work as well.

 

You need an amp w/two seperate, independent channels, that has more than one speaker, like a Super Reverb. If you have an amp that has two seperate channels, two to four inputs, you seperate it. I believe in Fender ads for these, they state "two seperate" channels. You could also plug it into two seperate channels of a PA and should get the true seperation.

[kaicho8888]

Ken, you're right about the two channels requirement.... that the same as having two separate amplifiers.

 

Unfortunately, my Marshalls, Twin, and HotRod Dlx don't have separate independent channel inputs. I don't play that much anymore... just jamming once in awhile at the local watering hole or with my kid at his studio.

[tsol]

dang.. i realize that's one strange piece of guitar i got here,

 

i will be mostly playing it through guitar racks and preamps using a speaker cabinet simulation unit Palmer PGA-04 , because thats how i play and record all my other guitars.. i bet im gonna have lots of fun trying to figure out how i can get the best of the sound from the ES-375... maybe i will end up wiring it as a traditionnal ES-335, ripping off the Varitone too.. but that will be the latest options, i dont want to massacre this guitar.

 

 

i believe this guitar must be sounding incredible using a true 2 channels amp (ie: Fender Pro Reverb 1965.. etc)... i wont be able to use it like that as none of my guitar pre amps and racks has a 2 channels feature.. they are all mono and im using an LA-610SE studio preamp to warm up the signal prior to tracking the guitar, which is mono.. its one bummer of a situation tho.

 

a question:

 

how i can obtain that type of tone?

 

Little Milton - My Dog And Me (live 1995, Jazz Festival - Bern)

 

it sounds a bit dry and clean at the begining when the guy plays it with the volume knob turned down, but it will scream the sweet hell when the solo part comes up.. its incredible. will my walnut sound like that if im using a decent amp, and maybe some vintage Ibanez TubeScreamer pedal? :D

 

and btw, the price i paid my 1974 Walnut is about $2.000 i was lucky to pick it up from some guitarist friend and not some guitar store crooks or speculators.. its 100% stock condition, except the stop bar.. i think that was fair, no? :D i just saw EXACTLY the same guitar (but with a Trapeze tail piece) of the SAME year at the guitar center store manhattan , priced at $3.599, plus it had very visible CRACKS on the body and some scratches.. mine is nearly mint.. :D/

[Robin Nahum]

dang.. i realize that's one strange piece of guitar i got here' date=' [/quote']

 

Does this mean you tried the Y-cable you bought and got a strange sound?

 

... maybe i will end up wiring it as a traditionnal ES-335' date=' ripping off the Varitone too.. but that will be the latest options, i dont want to massacre this guitar. [/quote']

 

No you don't. You'll kick yourself if you do this. There are better ways of managing the stereo output.

 

i believe this guitar must be sounding incredible using a true 2 channels amp (ie: Fender Pro Reverb 1965.. etc)... i wont be able to use it like that as none of my guitar pre amps and racks has a 2 channels feature...

 

If you read the threads mentioned earlier' date=' you will find that a two channel amp like a 65 Pro will not necessarily work as you expect - or then again it might. Like kaicho, my experience with my various two channel Fender amps (including a Pro) from that period has been that the ouput from the two channels is 180 degrees out of phase because the reverb channel has an extra gain stage. However, Ken finds that his 345 sounds fine through his 1980 Super Reverb.

 

You need to experiment.

 

I solved my phasing issues using a Barge Concepts VFB-X which you will also read about in those two threads. Essentially it works as a mixer and also allows the mix to be controlled using an expression pedal.

 

and btw, the price i paid my 1974 Walnut is about $2.000... its 100% stock condition, except the stop bar.. i think that was fair, no? i just saw EXACTLY the same guitar (but with a Trapeze tail piece) of the SAME year at the guitar center store manhattan , priced at $3.599, plus it had very visible CRACKS on the body and some scratches.. mine is nearly mint.. :D/

 

You did well. I suspect that your's would have had a trapeze originally as the stop tailpieces were discontinued on the 345 in the mid-60s.

 

RN

[ES345]

ES345' date=' that's one true relic you got there... and i believe it must be priced with 2500% of inflation nowdays!

 

sometimes i wish i was born much more earlier.. lol

 

anyways, here is what i got today for my ES345 walnut, i think it will do the job:

 

[img']http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/9034/ykiv5.jpg[/img]

 

Does this combine your signal and allow you to get both pickups? I ask this because i think you only want a single (ie tip, not ring and tip on the input going into the amp, at least that is what mine looks like.

 

one input for each into the combining setup, and go into 1 amp, with possibly having to roll back the bridge pup volume to about 8.5 to get max output, not a big deal. I used my 345 for 5 years (62-67)with a Gibson 6A, small tube amp plugging both outputs into separate plug ins in the amp, and always had a great tone. You can also plug your one stereo lead into two different amps, then the bridge pup will come out of one amp and the neck out of the other.

 

I look at is additional opportunities, not a hassle or problem, but i have done all sorts of things, plugged one lead into a chorus, the other into a delay or compressor, there is a lot to discover and experiment with, you got a keeper there, if i found one in as good a condition as yours i would be gigging it all the time. Enjoy, this has been an informative thread for fans of the 345.

 

peace