Are musicians masters of time?

[D-poland]

I'd say that reading how to not do something is interesting; truly learning how not to do something is something else.

 

Yes, you can make a case that after having done something so often that it's functionally a reflex action, it's then easier and perhaps more likely to become distracted.

 

OTOH, that's because the "you" is not part of the whole.

 

BTW, practice does not make perfect; it makes habit. That may or may not be the ideal or the purpose itself.

 

m

Milod while as you say practice does'nt make perfect! I do have to say that without it where would we be ! still struggling with the basics so while practice in ITSELF without further exploration will probably make you real good at say playin scales or whatever your single FOCUS may be ! need to advance an practice more as we advance ! also I will have to say that a similar experience in my mind is when you get engrossed in say some other venture/work that is enjoyable too, time has a way of flying by!

[milod]

The problem with practice, as I'd wager most of us have learned the hard way, is that as I said, it doesn't make perfect but it does create habit.

 

For example, fingerings either left or right hand may or may not be the most appropriate or efficient for some material. Practicing to the point of habit may actually create a "bad habit" in terms of slowing one's progress on guitar or, by extension, in other endeavors.

 

Yes, it does create that mind of no mind regardless, but in terms of technique, certain practices may be counterproductive.

 

For one example, I thought I had pretty well figured the zen of medium range handgun shooting until I got into cowboy action shooting and had to double my speed at minimum. It turns out I discovered certain of my well-practiced physical and mental behaviors were counterproductive when put under time pressure. So... I practiced to un-learn them and did, indeed, cut my times in half while increasing accuracy. That was after some 40 years of shooting and feeling quite capable with what I was doing up until...

 

m

[freddyfingers]

You guys are ruining it for me. After reading the very first post, I was in agreement, at least in the way he described the quickness one changes chords with, and at the speed at which this decisions are made, its almost like your not thinking of it. It made me feel mystical, just for a short bit. After reading the rest of the posts, I came back to earth, now I am back to a human that has been brainwashed to respond, like pavlovs dogs, Dinner bell anyone?

[milod]

Freddy...

 

It's not Pavlovian. That would be far too simplistic.

 

In music, it's a matter of hearing (or "reading")and anticipating change, knowing what is coming rather than waiting until it's there ... in martial arts it's exactly the same, a matter of recognizing possibilities of movement visually and responding as though one had at minimum double the time available for response compared to the lesser "schooled."

 

The mind of no mind is...

 

Actually the "flow like water" is one mode of explaining things, but one should note that water wears away that which is in its way - we must respond to the flow before the abrasion through anticipation. But to anticipate we must recognize the flow. Recognizing and responding without consciousness is what gives us the additional "time" to adjust without thought and the appearance of mastery.

 

m

[zigzag]

I think the secret is having an intuitive feel for every note at your disposal and then getting into the flow and where you want to be in that flow. Maybe that's saying the same thing. I get an intuitive feel for where the notes are on the fretboard from playing scales. When I'm in a zone, I'm not paying scales. Miles Davis said "I'll play it, then explain it later." Bird said, "...you practice, practice, practice. And then, when you finally get up there on the bandstand, forget all that and just wail."

[canon_mutant]

I know when I am playing I completely lose track of time. Amazes me sometimes. And, playing, like meditation, absolutely puts me in a state of calm no matter how badly my day has $ucked. Probably the only exception is when I am trying to get a new lick down and am having a particularly sucky attempt at it, then I notice time and frustration ensues.

 

So, yeah, in a way when I am in the zone, I think it does somewhat transcend time.

[milod]

Actually I lost track of time also when I was checkering gunstocks, teaching myself a bit of computer programming back in the 8-bit CPU days... or writing on some sorts of stuff.

 

It's a matter of doing as opposed to thinking of doing that brings the apparent suspension of time. Again, it's not magic because the mind is in a place in which there is no comparison with the rest of what's going on.

 

You can call it a mastery over time, but one might take the opposite side of the argument and suggest that one has learned to ride time as one might ride a river ... moving at the speed of the current but without the sensation of moving against the flow itself or measuring the flow against the passing landscape.

 

<grin>

 

m

[Rabs]

You guys are ruining it for me. After reading the very first post, I was in agreement, at least in the way he described the quickness one changes chords with, and at the speed at which this decisions are made, its almost like your not thinking of it. It made me feel mystical, just for a short bit. After reading the rest of the posts, I came back to earth, now I am back to a human that has been brainwashed to respond, like pavlovs dogs, Dinner bell anyone?

 

Dont be dissheartened. The whole point of this and what is being said is that when we feel like this it is internal. So anyone around you wont see the same thing. BUT we define our world internaly.

 

So to you and all of the other musicians at least it is a real thing. Can one call that magic, sure you can. The whole point is we transend our surroundings at the time we do this, we become more (or less maybe :)) than we were. Emptying ones mind so that all there is, is you, your guitar and the music, to you nothing else exists and therefore it is real even if only for those short moments, but thats what we live for as musicians and guitartist isnt it? that moment in time.. Thats why people like gigging so much

 

And I think one of the whole points of being a performer is that you have to believe it before your audience will.