spooki Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 What might be the pros and cons with a mini compared to a full size. I have noticed that there is not a lot of choices out there for a replacement mini. I haven't done any real digging and measuring yet, but it looks like replacing my mini with a full size would be easy enough. I want to put a Tone Zone in the bridge and the compatible Norton in the neck where the mini is. Also, why was the mini created to start with? Thanks for any help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazerface Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 Minis were created to put in a P90 body rout. If you want to swap minis for fulls, you're gonna have to do some routing. Id say just swap out the bridge mini for a P90 and call it a day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spooki Posted August 11, 2012 Author Share Posted August 11, 2012 Minis were created to put in a P90 body rout. If you want to swap minis for fulls, you're gonna have to do some routing. Id say just swap out the bridge mini for a P90 and call it a day I didn't realize a P90 would fit. I figured it also would require some routing. It's the neck mini instead of the bridge, but that should matter none as far as installation goes. Thanks for the input. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eor Posted August 12, 2012 Share Posted August 12, 2012 the pros of a mini humbucker is that they are awesome and sound amazing. the cons, as you found out, are that there aren't many replacements in the normal range. you either have super low end, sub $50 (gfs) or super high end, $130ish and up models (duncan, gibson, lollar, rio grande, skatterbrane, zhangbucker, tom short and other smaller builders) cut that list into less than have if you want a gold covered version. which guitar and what are you trying to do with it? i think the minis are underrated, but that's just me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spooki Posted August 12, 2012 Author Share Posted August 12, 2012 the pros of a mini humbucker is that they are awesome and sound amazing. the cons, as you found out, are that there aren't many replacements in the normal range. you either have super low end, sub $50 (gfs) or super high end, $130ish and up models (duncan, gibson, lollar, rio grande, skatterbrane, zhangbucker, tom short and other smaller builders) cut that list into less than have if you want a gold covered version. which guitar and what are you trying to do with it? i think the minis are underrated, but that's just me. It's an Epi Nighthawk. It all started out with the want to change out the bridge only for now. All the research and reviews had me going towards the DiMarzio Tone Zone. They also were pushing the Norton as it's perfect neck mate. So that's how the first question came about on possibly making the conversion from mini to regular. An email friend has the DiMarzio DP-241 mini in his NH but I haven't heard it. He does seem to like it. This can get as difficult as I choose to make it I guess. I should just pick one pup at a time and worry about a mate after I decide if I like my swap. Thanks for your reply, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stein Posted August 12, 2012 Share Posted August 12, 2012 I should just pick one pup at a time and worry about a mate after I decide if I like my swap. Thanks for your reply, That's wise. On the subject on mini's: there are basically two "types"- the Gibson/Epi mini-humbucker and the firebird pup. they are different sizes, as well as different construction. The mini that was used in the LP Deluxe were made by Epiphone. Gibson decided to make them fit into a P-90 route to both prevent re-tooling for regular humbuckers, and to use up stocks of the Epi pups they had when they bought the Epi company. The mounting rings were made by taking a P-90 cover and cutting a hole in it to fit the pups. When the stocks of the Epi pups ran out, they made more and eventually made rings for them. Directly intechangeable with P-90 routes. The Epi/Gibson type of Mini's have a very cruchy, mid-rangy tone that sounds less bassy than "standard" humbucks, with a more "meaner" sound. They are constructed very similar to a standard humbucker. The firebird Mini's have a different construction entirely, and real ones have been of two slightly different sizes in the past, AND there have been at least two types of construction: the 'origonal' type has blade magnets with the coils wrapped directly aroung the magnets, and another type with a single blade "pole" to read the strings with sideways coils coming off the magnet. Needless to say, there is a lot of myth and confusion as to what a REAL Firebird pup is- both in sound and size...mainly because they are rare and haven't been offered for sale. There are also differences in the "reissue" pups Gibson has made for the Firebird guitars. Most (including me) don't actually know WHAT they really sound like, but generally they are bright, trebly and powerful, and not at all like a standard humbucker OR a standard mini-humbucker. Said all that to say that besides all that, after-market makers of most "mini's" don't follow the same construction for either type, AND sometimes build them to be intercgangeable with each other. Or, make them with one type of construction while trying to make them sound like one with the other type of construction. And some of them (including real ones) can't have the covers swapped without the pup falling apart. So, you have to confirm the size as well, which may include getting a new mounting ring for it. I know this doesn't really help much, but I too am one of those guys who is attracted to the sound of mini's and firebird pups and have looked for them in various forms. But not much info is out there, and few have tried a lot of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spooki Posted August 12, 2012 Author Share Posted August 12, 2012 That's wise. On the subject on mini's: there are basically two "types"- the Gibson/Epi mini-humbucker and the firebird pup. they are different sizes, as well as different construction. The mini that was used in the LP Deluxe were made by Epiphone. Gibson decided to make them fit into a P-90 route to both prevent re-tooling for regular humbuckers, and to use up stocks of the Epi pups they had when they bought the Epi company. The mounting rings were made by taking a P-90 cover and cutting a hole in it to fit the pups. When the stocks of the Epi pups ran out, they made more and eventually made rings for them. Directly intechangeable with P-90 routes. The Epi/Gibson type of Mini's have a very cruchy, mid-rangy tone that sounds less bassy than "standard" humbucks, with a more "meaner" sound. They are constructed very similar to a standard humbucker. The firebird Mini's have a different construction entirely, and real ones have been of two slightly different sizes in the past, AND there have been at least two types of construction: the 'origonal' type has blade magnets with the coils wrapped directly aroung the magnets, and another type with a single blade "pole" to read the strings with sideways coils coming off the magnet. Needless to say, there is a lot of myth and confusion as to what a REAL Firebird pup is- both in sound and size...mainly because they are rare and haven't been offered for sale. There are also differences in the "reissue" pups Gibson has made for the Firebird guitars. Most (including me) don't actually know WHAT they really sound like, but generally they are bright, trebly and powerful, and not at all like a standard humbucker OR a standard mini-humbucker. Said all that to say that besides all that, after-market makers of most "mini's" don't follow the same construction for either type, AND sometimes build them to be intercgangeable with each other. Or, make them with one type of construction while trying to make them sound like one with the other type of construction. And some of them (including real ones) can't have the covers swapped without the pup falling apart. So, you have to confirm the size as well, which may include getting a new mounting ring for it. I know this doesn't really help much, but I too am one of those guys who is attracted to the sound of mini's and firebird pups and have looked for them in various forms. But not much info is out there, and few have tried a lot of them. Thanks again to all. You've been very helpful. My biggest problem is the closest music store is 125 miles away with only a small selection of guitars in stock. The big Guitar Centers etc... where you have a huge lot to play and get an ear of what you are looking for is 275 miles away. I'm also fairly new too the tone game and am limited to my choices of reading, asking, etc only. I would like to get more bass and depth out of the bridge on my Epi Nighthawk, and from my readings only. The DiMarzio Tone Zone seems to catch my eye the most. I did lower the pickup on the bass side but it didn't help much. I'm very interested in the P-90's also for maybe later in the neck position. But have never even heard one let alone played one. All my hype and knowledge comes from reading only. A dangerous game to be playing on limited funds. I'm just a small town boy and this is one of the few times I wish I lived in, or close to the city. Thanks again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazerface Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 I know dimarzio will let you exchange a pickup if you decide you dont like it, im sure the other big pickup makers would do the same Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eor Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 the nighthawk has a firebird styled mini, does it not? the kind without the pole pieces? you can find aftermarket replacements for those, the seymour duncan versions being the most common. i suppose the gibson style minis (with pole pieces) will fit as well. paw through the list and go with something that sounds good in your preferred price range. i think duncan is the only maker who specifically makes a replacement humbucker for the nighthawk. that is to say, they make a slanted version. i don't think a regular old non slanted version would fit, but i could be wrong. never played that guitar. nighthawk pup Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spooki Posted August 13, 2012 Author Share Posted August 13, 2012 the nighthawk has a firebird styled mini, does it not? the kind without the pole pieces? you can find aftermarket replacements for those, the seymour duncan versions being the most common. i suppose the gibson style minis (with pole pieces) will fit as well. paw through the list and go with something that sounds good in your preferred price range. i think duncan is the only maker who specifically makes a replacement humbucker for the nighthawk. that is to say, they make a slanted version. i don't think a regular old non slanted version would fit, but i could be wrong. never played that guitar. nighthawk pup You are right about Seymour Duncan being the only one so far to make a replacement. But I'm understanding though a member here that it's a very simple task to switch out the mounting plate. The pups should have the F spacing though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hanshotfirst Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 Hi guys, this may sound like a bit of a daft question but I'm fairly new to modifying so please bear with me. I have an epiphone les paul with the worlds worst finish on it (got it when I was young and thought finishes like that were cool). I'm looking to start using it again instead of having it stuck in the attic. I'm planning on sanding it down and re-painting it and was looking to get rid of the factory pickups and put new ones in... thinking of using mini humbuckers. Is it even possible? Like to replace normal size humbuckers with minis? (Kinda the opposite of the original question on the thread). Or am I missing the glaringly obvious fact that they won't fit in cutouts made in the body for standard size humbuckers? Anyway, appreciate any advice. Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIX Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 Hi guys, this may sound like a bit of a daft question but I'm fairly new to modifying so please bear with me. I have an epiphone les paul with the worlds worst finish on it (got it when I was young and thought finishes like that were cool). I'm looking to start using it again instead of having it stuck in the attic. I'm planning on sanding it down and re-painting it and was looking to get rid of the factory pickups and put new ones in... thinking of using mini humbuckers. Is it even possible? Like to replace normal size humbuckers with minis? (Kinda the opposite of the original question on the thread). Or am I missing the glaringly obvious fact that they won't fit in cutouts made in the body for standard size humbuckers? Anyway, appreciate any advice. Cheers! You can buy adapter mounting rings for the mini-humbuckers that will fit the normal size humbucker routed holes. Just make sure you get those that will match arch top of your guitar. Here is a link to an example. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Humbucker-to-mini-humbucker-adapter-pickup-ring-fits-Firebird-LP-mini-pickups-/250911015978?pt=Guitar_Accessories&hash=item3a6b76442a Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hanshotfirst Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 You can buy adapter mounting rings for the mini-humbuckers that will fit the normal size humbucker routed holes. Just make sure you get those that will match arch top of your guitar. Here is a link to an example. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Humbucker-to-mini-humbucker-adapter-pickup-ring-fits-Firebird-LP-mini-pickups-/250911015978?pt=Guitar_Accessories&hash=item3a6b76442a Excellent! Thanks for that Rix, exactly what I was looking for : ) Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Versatile Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 A bit of personal experience to offer... I have an Epi Nighthawk...which would appear to be a good basis for modding Considered a full P/U upgrade for more character...including a Firebird mini from SD Nothing done as yet as my Firebird takes care of those special tones I can vouch for the SD Firebird P/U's though...either 'vintage correct' or beefed up versions... I have a Tokai Firebird with a single Duncan SM-2...very nice indeed... So it may be worth considering the many options available... V Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Semi Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 Another option you may not have considered is a humbucker sized P90 such as the Gibson P94 http://www.musiciansfriend.com/accessories/gibson-p94t-humbucker-sized-p90-bridge-pickup or the Seymour Duncan Phat Cat. http://www.seymourduncan.com/products/electric/specialized/specialized-instruments/sph901_phat_cat/ I've only used the P94's as they are stock in my Epiphone Valensi Riviera. The Duncans may be great too and there are likely other pups in this fashion but you may find they drop right in with little to no modification required. These big P90's really do sound great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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