2012 Standard with fret buzz in Detroit

[dDavid]

Hi,

I bought a 2012 Les Paul Standard and I love it. I took it it a respected luthier in the Detroit area for a setup and he did a good job, the only problem is the low E string buzzes. When I picked up the guitar I tested it and pointed out the buzz and he said I was hitting the strings too hard. He did add a little relief in the neck but the low E still buzzes with all but the lightest of touch. It is driving me nuts! The luthier said that since the neck was Plek'd it was straight.

 

I looked at a LP Custom at a local GC and I love the action. It is 4/64 low E and 2/64 high e and does not buzz at all! Mine is a bit over 4/64 low E and 4/64 high e and the low E buzzes.

 

What can I do to get my guitar to stop buzzing? Does anyone know of great luthiers in the Detroit area? Gibson authorized? Do you think having my frets leveled would allow me to get a buzz free 4/64 action? I'm almost considering selling my Standard and buying the Custom...

 

Thanks,

David

[Dg77]

Hi,

I bought a 2012 Les Paul Standard and I love it. I took it it a respected luthier in the Detroit area for a setup and he did a good job, the only problem is the low E string buzzes. When I picked up the guitar I tested it and pointed out the buzz and he said I was hitting the strings too hard. He did add a little relief in the neck but the low E still buzzes with all but the lightest of touch. It is driving me nuts! The luthier said that since the neck was Plek'd it was straight.

 

I looked at a LP Custom at a local GC and I love the action. It is 4/64 low E and 2/64 high e and does not buzz at all! Mine is a bit over 4/64 low E and 4/64 high e and the low E buzzes.

 

What can I do to get my guitar to stop buzzing? Does anyone know of great luthiers in the Detroit area? Gibson authorized? Do you think having my frets leveled would allow me to get a buzz free 4/64 action? I'm almost considering selling my Standard and buying the Custom...

 

Thanks,

David

 

First off, the neck relief probably has very little to do with the fret buzzing in your case. The bridge is probably too low. Secondly, the plek has nothing to do with neck straightness, pleking is for frets and nut cutting.

 

Try raising the bridge a tad. And get a new luthier.

[dDavid]

First off, the neck relief probably has very little to do with the fret buzzing in your case. The bridge is probably too low. Secondly, the plek has nothing to do with neck straightness, pleking is for frets and nut cutting.

 

Try raising the bridge a tad. And get a new luthier.

So that would raise my action? I want my action to stay the same (or lower) but without the buzz. I've seen many with lower buzz-free action. What do I need to do to allow that on my guitar? Perhaps a fret level or polish?

[stein]

Try this:

 

Play every fret up the neck to judge if they all buzz equally, and if at some point it stops when playing a certain one. It it does, you might have a high fret that has possibly popped loose.

 

Raise the action at the bridge a little at a time, doing the same thing. Eventually, you will either find a high fret, or you will start to reach a point where it buzzes more at some places on the neck more than others, or it buzzes equally the same amount up and down the neck.

 

If it tends to buzz more when playing the frets toward the nut, the neck is too straight. If it buzzes more when playing the mid-part of the neck, there is too much relief. If you really want to fine tune the action, getting to a point of equal buzzing at all places (or, your favorite places) and raising just a bit to eliminate the buzzing is the best you can do.

 

Raising and lowering the bridge a bit is also the easiest way I think to find either a bad fret, or how the truss rod adjusment is effecting things.

[dDavid]

It starts buzzing a little at the fifth fret, a little more at the sixth and then buzzes consistently up to the twentieth fret. Ouch! Only on the low E string. The high e string buzzes a tiny bit but it does not bother me.

[CowboyBillyBob1]

I am not a luthier but it sounds like the neck needs a bit more relief. Loosen the truss rod 1/8 a turn and see if it improves. maybe another 1/8 turn may be needed.

[dDavid]

I am not a luthier but it sounds like the neck needs a bit more relief. Loosen the truss rod 1/8 a turn and see if it improves. maybe another 1/8 turn may be needed.

The neck has a little more than .012 inch

[Guest Farnsbarns]

Beware of reputable luthiers who say that a neck that has been plek'd must be straight. It is a nonsense. Also, make sure you aren't perpetuating his undeserved reputation.

 

If it was fine when you took it time him he must now sort it. Actually, if it were me I would point out his faux pas in not understanding the plek process at all and ask that he pays a skilled luthier to sort it.

[Bender 4 Life]

time for a new(tusq or bone) nut

[badbluesplayer]

A good luthier will make the proper adjustments in the correct order. First, he'll get the relief right. Then he'll adjust the action.

 

You said the relief is 0.012". If you're fretting the string at the first and fifteenth frets and measuring that much relief, then you should be o.k. You should be able to see a tiny bit of space between the fretted string and the frets. Like the thickness of a piece of paper or so.

 

Then he'll adjust the action so that the height of the strings is about 5/64" on the bass side to about 3 to 4/64" on the treble side. Measured at the 12th fret while fretting the string at the first fret.

 

Gibson says that if you set up the guitar like this, it shouldn't buzz. Whatever that means.

[dDavid]

It has been a couple of months since my setup so I'm not expecting any settling. The luthier told me I was picking too hard and it wouldn't be heard through an amp. I'm whisper picking before I get it not to buzz and I sometimes hear it through the amp.

 

I just want to find out what needs to change on my guitar to allow buzz free low action. (The custom I was playing has awesome action and doesn't buzz at all.) BTW, I don't think 4/64 buzz free is too low or too much to hope for.

[Eracer_Team]

Take a look at this

http://www.gibson.com/files/_gbme/gbme_guide.pdf

 

Treble 4/64, bass side 6/64's

[dDavid]

Take a look at this

http://www.gibson.com/files/_gbme/gbme_guide.pdf

 

Treble 4/64, bass side 6/64's

I read that but I want mine lower. Many, many Les Pauls have lower action without buzz. I'm not sure what your point was?

 

By the way this page gives different specs, http://www2.gibson.com/Support/Tech-Tips/Basic-Guitar-Setup.aspx

"Gibson electric specifications are:

1st fret- treble side - 1/64"

1st fret- bass side - 2/64"

12th fret- treble side - 3/64"

12th fret- bass side - 5/64"

[nosbig]

Hi,

I bought a 2012 Les Paul Standard and I love it. I took it it a respected luthier in the Detroit area for a setup and he did a good job, the only problem is the low E string buzzes. When I picked up the guitar I tested it and pointed out the buzz and he said I was hitting the strings too hard. He did add a little relief in the neck but the low E still buzzes with all but the lightest of touch. It is driving me nuts! The luthier said that since the neck was Plek'd it was straight.

 

I looked at a LP Custom at a local GC and I love the action. It is 4/64 low E and 2/64 high e and does not buzz at all! Mine is a bit over 4/64 low E and 4/64 high e and the low E buzzes.

 

What can I do to get my guitar to stop buzzing? Does anyone know of great luthiers in the Detroit area? Gibson authorized? Do you think having my frets leveled would allow me to get a buzz free 4/64 action? I'm almost considering selling my Standard and buying the Custom...

 

Thanks,

David

 

 

Im a guitar tech in UK and Ive found that an ideal action for a lester is .070" bottom E and .060" top E.

In my opinion thats low enough for anyone?

 

You strangle the tone with an action that is too low!!

[dDavid]

Im a guitar tech in UK and Ive found that an ideal action for a lester is .070" bottom E and .060" top E.

In my opinion thats low enough for anyone?

 

You strangle the tone with an action that is too low!!

Maybe tone is better but I want it lower for feel. I do not understand why I can't get mine to be 4/64 buzz-free when the Custom mentioned above and many others are lower and do not buzz. I wish I knew someone who could look at my guitar and let me know what is different about mine and what needs to change.

[rct]

Maybe tone is better but I want it lower for feel. I do not understand why I can't get mine to be 4/64 buzz-free when the Custom mentioned above and many others are lower and do not buzz. I wish I knew someone who could look at my guitar and let me know what is different about mine and what needs to change.

 

Your guitar is the norm, the custom in the store, if you measured it, was the exception. It takes exact placement of exactly correct low frets with exactly the correct crown and round over on each and every fret in order for a guitar to fret properly with the strings so low. One or more of your frets just isn't perfect is all, nothing more. While our hosts make some pretty expensive guitars, it is indeed the exception to find the Perfect one, it is after all a mand made thing subject to those small imperfections that make them, in my experience, perfect!

 

I've been playing a very long time, and I don't know how long you have been, but I will offer some advice that either you have heard and not tried, or haven't heard, so here goes:

 

Get yer strings up as high as is comfortable and don't measure them, feel them.

 

If the guitar in the store feels better to you, take yers in and trade for the other one and take the beating and get on with it. It just takes too many things to get any one guitar to some point of "perfect" as far as low strings. If playing yours just doesn't feel right, and the reason is a few 64 thousandths of an inch well, you'd better get the one in yer town that complies with those few 64 thousandths of an inch because I'm telling you there just aren't that many. In my experience.

 

Good luck with it. Guitar playing should be fun, not agonizing over dimensions and measurements.

 

rct

[blueslespaultone]

Just a thought, check if the low E string is touching the back of the bridge as it goes over the saddle into the tail piece.

[dDavid]

Your guitar is the norm, the custom in the store, if you measured it, was the exception. It takes exact placement of exactly correct low frets with exactly the correct crown and round over on each and every fret in order for a guitar to fret properly with the strings so low. One or more of your frets just isn't perfect is all, nothing more. While our hosts make some pretty expensive guitars, it is indeed the exception to find the Perfect one, it is after all a mand made thing subject to those small imperfections that make them, in my experience, perfect!

 

 

rct

Thanks. I measured both guitars with a rule. It just seems to me that it wouldn't be too difficult to fix if I can find someone to isolate the problem.

 

Also, my strings aren't touching the back of the bridge block.

[Dg77]

.012 is more than enough relief...spec is .010

 

Have you checked intonation on the low E string? The position of the saddle could have effect on the tension of the string. It could be too long/loose, causing it to be a bit "sloppy" for lack of a better term. Check the intonation a the 12 fret, if the fretted note is lower than the harmonic, the move the saddle toward the neck until the notes are the same.

 

Also make sure the string is sitting in the saddle properly and the saddle isn't damaged.

[dDavid]

.012 is more than enough relief...spec is .010

 

Have you checked intonation on the low E string? The position of the saddle could have effect on the tension of the string. It could be too long/loose, causing it to be a bit "sloppy" for lack of a better term. Check the intonation a the 12 fret, if the fretted note is lower than the harmonic, the move the saddle toward the neck until the notes are the same.

 

Also make sure the string is sitting in the saddle properly and the saddle isn't damaged.

Intonation is fine and the saddle appears fine as well.

[Dg77]

New strings I suppose? What type of strings? Gauge? Have you tried re-stringing just the low-E?

 

Nut slot depth at the first fret? I doubt that would be the cause though since your buzzing is from the 5th on. I'd also suspect too much relief, but you would have issues with the other strings if that we're the case. Do any of the strings fret out when bending above the 12th fret?

[badbluesplayer]

Here's a thought. Set the action to the factory spec and see if you can live with it. If you want it lower then don't complain about it buzzing.

[Eracer_Team]

If you want it lower then don't complain about it buzzing.

 

Yo Baaad

[stein]

It starts buzzing a little at the fifth fret, a little more at the sixth and then buzzes consistently up to the twentieth fret. Ouch! Only on the low E string. The high e string buzzes a tiny bit but it does not bother me.

If that is the case, it might benifit to have the neck a little straighter.

 

See...it's like this...If playing the nut of first fret, the neck relief is ideal in that a slight bow allows the string a little space to vibrate. (Think football shape).

 

When there is too much relief, it means that the string is HIGHER off the fretboard in the middle where you have that relief. So when you are playing the CENTER of the neck, the "relief" that you have shows itself as the heel being too high....pretty much right where the string played fretted in the middle frets needs the most relief.

 

A little back and forth between truss rod and bridge adjustments can bring you lower than simply going with "standard" adjustments. Keep in mind, when you "straighten" the neck, you are effective lowering the action without moving the bridge, and giving more "bow" raises the action, because "bow" or relief changes hieght of the string.

 

Another thing is the nut. The lower the strings are at the nut, the lower the strings are EVERYWHERE you go to press down. So, say your nut is 1/64th high...that means with the same bridge hieght/fretted note relationship, you have 1/64th EXTRA travel to press the string down initailly anywhere it is played. If you want an idea, put a capo on the first fret: it shouldn't have ANY effect on the buzzing or string hieght of the note you fret playing the rest of the neck, but if the strings are a lot lower because of a high-cut nut, you will see the difference.