The End of Microsoft is Imminent?

[milod]

Apple makes proprietary stuff that's cute and has a cult following and some neat "stick in your pocket or are light in your briefcase" hardware.

 

MS makes software and messes occasionally with hardware.

 

The crux of it comes about when one considers the logic of a Mac or a Windows OS software. In that sense, it's a matter of whether you like the logic of a Nikon camera or a Canon camera.

 

Both can do quality work - you just pay more for cute and "this is today" hardware that probably lacks the ability to do stuff that you can do on a desktop of either variety.

 

The question is currently, IMHO, not so much MS or Mac, but rather whether you want a cute little piece of something that you can kinda work with, but not really, and that keeps you hooked to the web, or if you want a machine that will actually do real work with. The smartphones keep you in touch, but even with email ain't really very good for written response or taking notes or whatever. The pad lets you see stuff and enter little bits of info but that's about it.

 

Both smartphones and pads are, IMHO, kinda a fad where a lotta folks have them whether they necessarily need them for daily life at work or at home. A bigger laptop or a home machine lets you do far more, and I think that's where a lotta MS has been aiming to maintain market share by offering whole solutions to home entertainment and management - stuff we talked about 30 years ago but never really caught on.

 

m

[Riffster]

Well, you are way ahead of me....still figuring out windows 95 :)

 

The difference is that I am being serious. I bought a HP laptop with Windows Vista like 5 years ago that turned out turd-astic.

[dbreslauer]

The pad lets you see stuff and enter little bits of info but that's about it.

 

Not entirely true. For example, I have an app on my iPad called lpTouch that is a full featured control surface for Logic Pro.

 

 

And because it works over wifi, I can sit at my drums or anywhere else away from the computer desk, and control the transport, channel strip, EQ, etc. wire free. The app was $5: try finding a wireless control surface even close to that in price (including the iPad). :)

 

Cheers,

Don

[milod]

Don...

 

That's a lotta crud in different pieces to haul - and it ain't as "sexy" as the Ipad per se. So there's not much sales. My netbook at the bedside table is less likely to get messed with. You have a special potential "need." But then, I figure with a little messing with the programming, I can do about anything with the laptops, bluetooth and wifi. I just don't see that much need in the sense of saving time or effort or doing anything better.

 

-0-0

 

Vista had lotza problems. For a number of reasons. Luckily relatively few moved there from XP. In a sense you might make a case that it was kinda along the lines of the move from Mac OS 9.x to OSX.x in that you pretty much hadda get a whole new machine and peripherals, even software, to have a working computer. That worked for the Mac religion, but not for the non-computer-religious PC buyer once the secret was out.

 

I still have an unopened box of Vista. Somewhere. It was a gift.

 

I've personally generally tried to keep up with technology, but within parameters of usefulness.

 

My "old" smartphone gets me quick photos back and forth, looks at my emails and rapid responses, checks on the weather, maps, etc - IF I put on my reading glasses. Mine is a generation old, but given what I use, it's far more than enough.

 

A "pad" is about as useful to me 99 percent of the time as an extra 15 inches and 50 pounds of buttocks. You almost need a briefcase of some sort to haul it the way my life runs, and then you may be far better off with a lightweight laptop 'stedda a pad and Bluetooth keyboard that can't do that much but various communication chores. Batches of backup HD drives and large flash drives are in use daily on my desktops and laptops. Etc.

 

The think with a lotta Apple stuff is that I think some of it is fad like the Hula Hoop - and some of it is how out culture is feeling out appropriate real usefulness of what's possible.

 

I'm still convinced that until we get a smartphone-size device with the visual on a pair of glasses and probably the keyboard and other "controls" run with virtual reality gloves, there's a lot of gamesmanship to come. But hey, imagine practicing guitar just with your smartphone, fancy eyeglasses and some sort of VR glove... And a near-true artificial intelligence offering creative interface options.

 

m

[EVOL!]

Apple has NOTHING in the datacenter...

 

True.

[rocketman]

I have both. Although Windows is OK, Macs just are better for too many reasons to count (unix is a big reason). In my college days my professor bought us a Sun Sparc station which ran unix. We had the machine on for 4 straight fours and it never once crashed on us...and this was in the early 90's. Then when I went to NASA I was forced to use a PC. Talk about a let down!

 

My wife got hooked on Macs. One time she turned it off by mistake and called me because she forgot the password. I told her that PCs are better in the password sense because they crash often enough that you don't forget your password!

 

Smartphones are a different story though. I just got a Galaxy S III and my wife got an IPhone V. She likes her phone and I like mine III. But for computers, nothing beats a Mac.

[Tman5293]

But hey...why don't you educate me? What are the benefits of this OS to you? Sell me on it. And if you can, let me know why they have chosen to have different icons being a different size and shape. Seems silly to me.

 

I wont try to convince you that it's better than Windows 7 but I will tell my reason for switching. My reason is that Windows 7 is aging quickly. Especially in terms of technology. It's already 3 years old. With Windows 8, Microsoft has gone into the Windows 7 kernel and ripped it apart. They've taken out things that did not work well and at the same time they've made major changes that dramatically improve speed and efficiency when compared to Windows 7. However, most of these changes are things that only an enthusiast like me would really care about. Things like boot time. With WIndows 7, my PC would take about 1 minute to boot from the time that I pushed the button till it got to the desktop. Windows 8 does that in 20 seconds or less on my computer. They've also added dramatically better support for 8 core processors like my AMD FX-8350.

 

Those are my reasons for switching but I'm sure they don't apply to you in any way. It's mostly things that the average user would never even know about.

 

I'm still using 7 so I don't know where the option is but I've read you can go back to a basic layout somewhere in the settings.

 

 

I think thats only in the Pro version.. So if it wasnt he wouldnt have had that option.

 

I would like to inform you guys that you are totally wrong. I have Windows 8 Pro and there is no such setting anywhere in the OS. Microsoft has explicitly stated that they are permanently removing the old start menu from the Windows operating system. However that is easily bypassed when you actually know what you're doing with a computer. Witness the problem solved:

 

[EVOL!]

 

I would like to inform you guys that you are totally wrong. I have Windows 8 Pro and there is no such setting anywhere in the OS. Microsoft has explicitly stated that they are permanently removing the old start menu from the Windows operating system. However that is easily bypassed when you actually know what you're doing with a computer. Witness the problem solved:

 

 

So you can or cannot run Windows 8 in classic mode? I need to know because Window + R is all I ever use. I would be lost without my run box.

[Rabs]

 

I would like to inform you guys that you are totally wrong. I have Windows 8 Pro and there is no such setting anywhere in the OS. Microsoft has explicitly stated that they are permanently removing the old start menu from the Windows operating system. However that is easily bypassed when you actually know what you're doing with a computer. Witness the problem solved:

 

Have you tried Windows 8 RT? If not then how do you know..?

 

So what I was saying is that you will only be able to do it in Pro.. I dont think that work around to get the start menu back works in anything but the Pro version.

[ShredAstaire]

Don't question Tman about Windows guys! He's obviously on the design team. ;)

[milod]

I dunno about Tman but I think my baby bro - ain't 40 yet - was.

 

But what the heck, he likes his LP.

 

m

[Tman5293]

So you can or cannot run Windows 8 in classic mode? I need to know because Window + R is all I ever use. I would be lost without my run box.

 

As far as I know, all of the classic key commands still work. Windows + R still opens the run box.

 

Have you tried Windows 8 RT? If not then how do you know..?

 

So what I was saying is that you will only be able to do it in Pro.. I dont think that work around to get the start menu back works in anything but the Pro version.

 

I know that this work around will not work on Windows RT because it is designed to run on the ARM micro architecture. This means that it cannot run .exe files. Only apps from the new Microsoft store will work on Windows RT. It is only intended for tablet use. Windows 8 and Windows 8 Pro are standard x86 operating systems. They function exactly like previous versions of Windows and so my solution to the problem works just fine on them.

 

Windows RT is not really Windows. It's basically Microsoft's version of Android.

[badbluesplayer]

Windows 9.

[Buxom]

Tman just dropped the mic and walked off stage. that's how he do.

[Jeff-7]

Windows is srs business.

[Tman5293]

Windows is srs business.

 

Indeed sir.

[ChanMan]

Things like boot time. With WIndows 7, my PC would take about 1 minute to boot from the time that I pushed the button till it got to the desktop. Windows 8 does that in 20 seconds or less on my computer. They've also added dramatically better support for 8 core processors like my AMD FX-8350.

 

Those are my reasons for switching but I'm sure they don't apply to you in any way. It's mostly things that the average user would never even know about.

 

Just built a 64bit Win 7 system that presents a desktop in under 30 seconds. I've seen NT 4 boot in 8.

 

I'm curious... exactly how much knowledge and training, or IT certifications does one have to have in order to notice how long it takes a PC to start?

 

 

 

However that is easily bypassed when you actually know what you're doing with a computer.

 

I love your arrogance. Reminds me of the old days.

 

/chuckle

[Tman5293]

Just built a 64bit Win 7 system that presents a desktop in under 30 seconds. I've seen NT 4 boot in 8.

 

I'm curious... exactly how much knowledge and training, or IT certifications does one have to have in order to notice how long it takes a PC to start?

 

 

 

 

 

I love your arrogance. Reminds me of the old days.

 

/chuckle

 

Please try to tell me something that I don't know about the Windows OS or about computer hardware itself.

 

I've been building custom computers, installing operating systems, troubleshooting and finding solutions to problems, overclocking processors, graphics cards, and RAM, installing water loops, etc for almost 10 years now. Just because you have some stupid sheet of paper with your name on it that says you're a certified IT technician does not make you any better than me. I don't need that. I've acquired all my knowledge over years of practice in the field. I know what I'm doing.

 

EDIT: Please show me a regular computer user that cares about what I listed. Very few exist. Most people have a computer to browse the internet and check their email. Not very many people are worried about how fast their computer boots or how many cores their processor has. They don't care what speed their RAM clocked at or how high an overclock they can hit on their processor if they put it under water. They don't have an insatiable need for performance out of their computer like I do. Just in the past 3 weeks I've rebuilt my system in a new full tower chassis. I've installed a new CPU to replace my quickly aging Phenom II 1055T. And just this past week I upgraded from Radeon HD 6850s in crossfire to a Radeon HD 7970 GHz Edition (the most powerful single core GPU on the planet).

 

Please go on about how arrogant I am when it comes to computers. You'll find that I actually do know what I'm talking about and that most people haven't got the slightest clue.

[DrJustice]

It's nice when good prevails over evil...

Apple is the new Evil Empire, haven't you noticed?

 

Lock-ins, protectionism and exploitation is their business nowadays.

 

;)

[Tman5293]

Apple is the new Evil Empire, haven't you noticed?

 

Lock-ins, protectionism and exploitation is their business nowadays.

 

;)

 

Not to mention their failed attempts at trying to sue their competition out of the business. That is not how you run a company. It's just plain foul play.

[EVOL!]

Not to mention their failed attempts at trying to sue their competition out of the business. That is not how you run a company. It's just plain foul play.

 

I am not justifying this practice, but there is an epidemic of absurd patent lawsuits in this country. Apple is far from being the only guilty party.

[ShredAstaire]

ar·ro·gance noun \ˈer-ə-gən(t)s, ˈa-rə-\

Definition of ARROGANCE

: an attitude of superiority manifested in an overbearing manner or in presumptuous claims or assumptions

 

You could either go with arrogance, or simply, asshole.

Either would work in this case really. :)

[milod]

In a sense I think we're well past the initial hypothesis of the thread.

 

I think that Apple and MS both, in their very different ways and different perspectives on their market positions, are too typical of much of what we see in our current cultural tech phase - and our economy.

 

Actually to me if you wanna dis the Firebird X, you're dissing an effort to look toward the future. Period. It's like when Apple's "Lisa" came our, I thought it was silly. As a working piece of hardware and software, I still think it was, as was the original 68000 Mac with a screen you barely could read and even had difficulty using to write a letter.

 

Windows 1.1 is what I used - with some difficulty with fonts and drivers for a white-write printer that gave far better quality than Apple's black-write laser of the time - for my first "desktop publishing" piece, a tech manual.

 

Right now "we" are trying to figure out what a batch of new devices are, and what they're for. "We" are going from owning our own intellectual property on our own storage devices to renting space on a "cloud."

 

I'm reminded of tales I've been told about the early days of telephones and folks asking why they needed more than the telegraph or a short trip to talk face to face. What real good did this rapid voice messaging bring other than offering an opportunity for little old ladies to banter on and on and on at the cost of several dollars a week.

 

Well, we've seen how the telephone and telephone lines with 300 baud teletype and punch potential have turned from being king, to being just a piece of our rapid communications potential. We're in that "what is the real good, business and social consequence" with our new stuff.

 

"We" also have to recognize too that these big companies may make this or that, or offer this or that service, but their real business is business and figuring the best way to leverage company costs into company profits.

 

I freely admit that makes me sound very cynical. But I'd far prefer seeing Gibson run by a guy who's played guitar most of his life, regardless of his skill level, than by a guy who has six degrees in accounting and thinks the guitar is a poor cousin of real music that he listens to on the radio...

 

Firebird X and a lotta this new "device" stuff is at the forefront of what we'd best expect in our future. I may be dead before it happens, but I've a hunch you'll see the FX perceived as the first real electronic, rather than electric, guitar, and more connectivity of most guitars complete to ways to retrofit your 1960 335...

 

Now... those lawsuits? Yeah, silly in ways, but it shows to me that "we" are in a period of figuring standardization of certain things such as we take for granted in our cars, in our computer file formats and most everything else.

 

m

[Guest Farnsbarns]

Please try to tell me something that I don't know about the Windows OS or about computer hardware itself.

 

I've been building custom computers, installing operating systems, troubleshooting and finding solutions to problems, overclocking processors, graphics cards, and RAM, installing water loops, etc for almost 10 years now. Just because you have some stupid sheet of paper with your name on it that says you're a certified IT technician does not make you any better than me. I don't need that. I've acquired all my knowledge over years of practice in the field. I know what I'm doing.

 

EDIT: Please show me a regular computer user that cares about what I listed. Very few exist. Most people have a computer to browse the internet and check their email. Not very many people are worried about how fast their computer boots or how many cores their processor has. They don't care what speed their RAM clocked at or how high an overclock they can hit on their processor if they put it under water. They don't have an insatiable need for performance out of their computer like I do. Just in the past 3 weeks I've rebuilt my system in a new full tower chassis. I've installed a new CPU to replace my quickly aging Phenom II 1055T. And just this past week I upgraded from Radeon HD 6850s in crossfire to a Radeon HD 7970 GHz Edition (the most powerful single core GPU on the planet).

 

Please go on about how arrogant I am when it comes to computers. You'll find that I actually do know what I'm talking about and that most people haven't got the slightest clue.

 

I have to say, albeit with a large dollop of respect, that when I was younger and I'd built a few PCs (Which required soldering of components and some actual electronics knowledge in those days), done some hardware hacking and tweaked windows here and there, I thought I new about computers but when I started studying properly things like the tcp/ip protocol stack, server OS's etc I thought I knew about computers. Then wen I started running a Novell network with lan and wan hubs, print servers, tape backups and arcserve archiving and restoration I thought I knew computers. Then when I started managing multi-forrest server networks and load balancing solutions I thought I knew computers. Then when I started my own company providing maintenance of all the above and creating bespoke database driven software solutions I thought I knew computers. Then, When the online revolution occurred and I started developing similar web based solutions I thought I knew computers. Then when I started developing custom Asop based mobile roms and associated apps I thought I knew computers.

 

I now know that I can learn more from almost anyone.

 

Your attitude is a bit arrogant mate.

[Tman5293]

I have to say, albeit with a large dollop of respect, that when I was younger and I'd built a few PCs (Which required soldering of components and some actual electronics knowledge in those days), done some hardware hacking and tweaked windows here and there, I thought I new about computers but when I started studying properly things like the tcp/ip protocol stack, server OS's etc I thought I knew about computers. Then wen I started running a Novell network with lan and wan hubs, print servers, tape backups and arcserve archiving and restoration I thought I knew computers. Then when I started managing multi-forrest server networks and load balancing solutions I thought I knew computers. Then when I started my own company providing maintenance of all the above and creating bespoke database driven software solutions I thought I knew computers. Then, When the online revolution occurred and I started developing similar web based solutions I thought I knew computers. Then when I started developing custom Asop based mobile roms and associated apps I thought I knew computers.

 

I now know that I can learn more from almost anyone.

 

Your attitude is a bit arrogant mate.

 

Networking solutions does not equal computer knowledge. You run a company focused on large scale networking. That has nothing to do with what I do with computers.

 

You may say that I am arrogant but am I not right in saying that the majority of computer users do not know about half of what goes on in their computers? You of all people should know this to be true.