onewilyfool Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 I played them side-byside today, the SJ-200 Koa, the J-45, and the L-20...Koa, Mahogany, and Rosewood......Large, medium and small......such a cross section of the Gibby sounds, all thick in the mids....all with a thump, and yet all so very different. The SJ-200 loud and even brighter than the J-45, the J-45 the IDEAl singer-guitar payer guitar, and the L-20, the Nick Lucas sized very woody 12 fret parlor par excellence !!! Just saying Kudos to Bozeman, with these 3 guitars I can do anything!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stein Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 I think we are in another "golden age" of guitars. I feel like Gibson Montana has made guitars as good as any in history. I think when you compare all the different "eras" and what was made and when, guitars in general are the best they have ever been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onewilyfool Posted December 11, 2012 Author Share Posted December 11, 2012 I think we are in another "golden age" of guitars. I feel like Gibson Montana has made guitars as good as any in history. I think when you compare all the different "eras" and what was made and when, guitars in general are the best they have ever been. Stein....I think you are right on!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombywoof Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 I think we are in another "golden age" of guitars. I feel like Gibson Montana has made guitars as good as any in history. I think when you compare all the different "eras" and what was made and when, guitars in general are the best they have ever been. I agree Gibson is certainly in another Golden Age. But I also think that could be said of many of the companies that have survived the decades. I would also think it is at least in part due to new technology the guitar making world has embraced. Parts made from CAD drawings and fashioned by a CNC router have allowed for very precise and repeatable results. A big difference from the "good old days." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j45nick Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 I agree Gibson is certainly in another Golden Age. But I also think that could be said of many of the companies that have survived the decades. I would also think it is at least in part due to new technology the guitar making world has embraced. Parts made from CAD drawings and fashioned by a CNC router have allowed for very precise and repeatable results. A big difference from the "good old days." Gibson has always used a lot of machinery in the guitar-building process, but I'm guessing that the increasing use of CNC for components such as necks, the use of vacuum presses, etc, has led to more consistency in today's Gibsons. In the future, it may reduce the urgency of the never-ending and addictive search for good vintage character in a guitar, but it's a big plus when it comes to buying a newer one. The aging process is still likely to treat every instrument differently, I suspect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stein Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 I agree Gibson is certainly in another Golden Age. But I also think that could be said of many of the companies that have survived the decades. I would also think it is at least in part due to new technology the guitar making world has embraced. Parts made from CAD drawings and fashioned by a CNC router have allowed for very precise and repeatable results. A big difference from the "good old days." Yes, I think Martin and Fender as well. I think at this place in time, a lot of it has to do with "technology" more in the sense of knowledge. Tooling is great, but WHAT to make with the tooling has made the impact I think. I think a lot of the "knowledge" part has a lot to do with the 'vintage' craze during the 90's. Fans seemed more interested in recreating, making the perfect "copy" to capture the details of the 50's and 60's guitars, which also has the impact of learning WHAT makes them so good, and how to recreate those things. Relicing aside, having to re-learn what a 'vintage' guitar was and how to build it, I might say that Gibson, Fender, and Martin have all learned how they made their guitars in the past and how to re-create them. But in addition, they have learned how to apply MANY different aspects at different levels as well. It's one thing for a guitar to be a better one from a makers "golden age", when they just happened to be good and they somehow knew how to build a good guitar. But, to RECREATE it demands even more knowledge then even they must have been aware of. So, combining that with more tooling options and technology in the machine sense, it's a recipe to build great guitars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onewilyfool Posted December 12, 2012 Author Share Posted December 12, 2012 Stein...I agree with you completely about the innovations......I'm just wondering about the quality of wood that guitar makers are going to get in the future......I'm seeing a lot of three piece backs from companies like Taylor, laminatea may not be far behind, koa is disappearing, so a lot of new woods may be in the future, like the Gibby Jackson Brown using Walnut...things are going to change. I think Gibson even used three piece TOPS during the war time shortages....... My friend, who is a luthier who builds Gypsy Jazz type guitars has even used Douglas Fir as a top, on one of his LOUDEST guitars!!! We will see.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j45nick Posted December 12, 2012 Share Posted December 12, 2012 Stein...I agree with you completely about the innovations......I'm just wondering about the quality of wood that guitar makers are going to get in the future......I'm seeing a lot of three piece backs from companies like Taylor, laminatea may not be far behind, koa is disappearing, so a lot of new woods may be in the future, like the Gibby Jackson Brown using Walnut...things are going to change. I think Gibson even used three piece TOPS during the war time shortages....... My friend, who is a luthier who builds Gypsy Jazz type guitars has even used Douglas Fir as a top, on one of his LOUDEST guitars!!! We will see.... Musical instrument making uses a tiny fraction of the world's exotic woods. The vast percentage of it probably goes into furniture, and even things such as house building. In Thailand, for example, a lot of older (and even new) homes contain vast quantities of teak, such as roof beams. Same thing in parts of India. Shipping cradles for yachts built in the Orient used to be made out of teak in the 1960's and even early 1970's. Exotic woods will probably become even more tightly controlled (as we have seen) in the future, but I suspect we will have them for use in instruments for some time to come. They'll just be harder to get, more expensive, and perhaps of lesser quality. People will undoubtedly experiment with other woods in place of our more familiar tonewoods. Martin has done this a fair amount, with decidedly mixed results. Their Stratabond neck is not exactly a thing of beauty. And if we run out of wood, there's always carbon fiber, like my decidedly un-beautiful little Composite Acoustics ugly duckling.... Maybe if I painted a sunburst on it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onewilyfool Posted December 12, 2012 Author Share Posted December 12, 2012 Nick, how does that one sound??? Although I love the look and smell of wood, if in the future, some guy comes up with a material that surpasses wood in sound, tone, etc....I'd be willing to go with the best sound, regardless of material..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j45nick Posted December 12, 2012 Share Posted December 12, 2012 Nick, how does that one sound??? Although I love the look and smell of wood, if in the future, some guy comes up with a material that surpasses wood in sound, tone, etc....I'd be willing to go with the best sound, regardless of material..... For a small guitar (13 3/8" lower bout, just under 23" scale), it sounds quite good, if a bit treble-heavy. Amplified (Baggs Active Element), you can do whatever you want with it. Maybe a bit too Taylor-like for my taste. Let's just say it sounds a lot more like a real guitar than my little Martin Backpacker, while serving a similar function. JT also uses one of these for a travel guitar. They make dreadnought-size models out of CF, but I haven't played one. The neck on this one is quite heavy, but the body is very light. The big ones just look like a black-painted D-28, more or less. Rainsong and Composite Acoustics seem to be the biggest makers of carbon fiber guitars. And no, I'm not getting rid of my Gibsons anytime soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vacamartin Posted December 12, 2012 Share Posted December 12, 2012 I am always stunned by the sound of my L-130. No matter what strings go on her, the lush, alive tone grabs my ears and strokes 'em. I always have 3 acoustics out , and with my new addition on the way it will be 4. All in different tunings. Not only is my Gibson the best sounding, she's the best looking. I agree with the sentiment already stated -Bozeman has produced some of the finest acoustics....ever! J.D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombywoof Posted December 12, 2012 Share Posted December 12, 2012 I gather the Cargo and Composite Acoustic guitars garner quite a bit of respect over at AGF. J45Nick is 100% on the money about how little wood guitar builders actually use. I recall reading somewhere that Bob Taylor once said that even with all the guitars they make, the total amount of Sitka Spruce logs he uses per year could be produced by a lumber mill in one 8 hour shift. It is now kind of hard to believe that it was not all that long ago when I would go to a lumber yard with a friend who made furniture and watch him pay something like $2.00 a square foot for it. Those days are certainly gone and no doubt that Gibson and others have had to rethink the notion of an inexhaustible supply of the woods they want the most. Nobody though wants to be the guys who cut the last tree. Guitar makers have been using sycamore, oak, ash and other woods for their guitars for decades. I expect we will start seeing more and more of it. I keep wondering if birch will make a comeback. Once a staple of the el cheapo mail order guitar business, it is not the prettiest stuff out there but not a bad wood at all if combined with a spruce top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j45nick Posted December 12, 2012 Share Posted December 12, 2012 Guitar makers have been using sycamore, oak, ash and other woods for their guitars for decades. I expect we will start seeing more and more of it. I keep wondering if birch will make a comeback. Once a staple of the el cheapo mail order guitar business, it is not the prettiest stuff out there but not a bad wood at all if combined with a spruce top. Wasn't most of the birch used ply rather than solid? Of course, my Gibson electrics (ES-335's) are maple ply, but when you generate the sound with a couple of screaming humbuckers and an amp, the wood probably doesn't matter that much... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stein Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 Alternatives are a good thing, I just don't want to see different materiels used just because it's called "green". There is still lots of good stuff. I want to see differnt woods chosen for the tone, the sound. I don't want to see bamboo for a guitar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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