j45tv bass response

[salomonander]

hey

this is my first post here. so hello first of all!

im about to buy a j45 for myself and my studio. i ordered two standards and one true vintage from thomann in germany. i prefer the general voicing of the tv. there is a somewhat modern sound in the standards that i dont care for. problem is that the tv seems to have a lot less bass than the standard models. i have to strumm my flatpick in the middel of the soundhole to get a similar bass response than from a regular position on the standards. is this normal? or did i get a bad tv model? i can return them all so im not worried....

 

 

ps: i also got a d28. which i like a lot as well (basically im torn between the d28 and the j45tv). but its really hard to play compared to the gibsons. i have to apply way mor muscle in my left hand. the gibsons play like butter. the martin simlpy hurts after hald an hour of playing. again - is this normal for a d28s?

 

 

thanks a lot

jakob

[Salfromchatham]

Well, I have a J45TV. It has that low E thump yet it is balanced. I think it would make an outstanding studio guitar. I also own a Martin D15m, and a Martin M-21. The D15m has a dark sound with supreme bass. And I recently owned the following as well: Martin HD-28, Martin D-18 (pre 2012), and a Martin D-18 new style (2012). I loved the sound of the new D-18 and think it would make a great studio guitar - more so than the D-28 or HD-28. It has a smooth sound, outstanding bass response, without the muddiness that I always seemed to find in the 28's. It is a non-muddy rosewood sounding guitar if that makes any sense (it probably doesn't). If sound were your consideration only for the studio, I would go J45TV and new Martin D-18.

 

However, if the studio will be used by other musicians commercially, and knowing that musicians tend to not care for gear as much as if it were their own, I would caution you that lighter-built guitars like the J45TV and D-18 are not as beefy as the D-28 standard, Guilds, etc. So you have a tradeoff to consider... robustness versus sound.

 

If the studio were for you I would go J45TV and D-18. If the studio is used commercially for others go with the D-28 straight braced and standard J45.

[Salfromchatham]

Well, I have a J45TV. It has that low E thump yet it is balanced. I think it would make an outstanding studio guitar. I also own a Martin D15m, and a Martin M-21. The D15m has a dark sound with supreme bass. And I recently owned the following as well: Martin HD-28, Martin D-18 (pre 2012), and a Martin D-18 new style (2012). I loved the sound of the new D-18 and think it would make a great studio guitar - more so than the D-28 or HD-28. It has a smooth sound, outstanding bass response, without the muddiness that I always seemed to find in the 28's. It is a non-muddy rosewood sounding guitar if that makes any sense (it probably doesn't). If sound were your consideration only for the studio, I would go J45TV and new Martin D-18.

 

However, if the studio will be used by other musicians commercially, and knowing that musicians tend to not care for gear as much as if it were their own, I would caution you that lighter-built guitars like the J45TV and D-18 are not as beefy as the D-28 standard, Guilds, etc. So you have a tradeoff to consider... robustness versus sound.

 

If the studio were for you I would go J45TV and D-18. If the studio is used commercially for others go with the D-28 straight braced and standard J45.

 

Here is a comparison video I made a while back... hope you find it useful: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X16JYp59mos

[E-minor7]

If studio guitar means a guitar for all purposes - kind of like a jeep I'm not sure I would go for too much bass.

It's fine if recording the lone folkie or other solo stuff, but as soon as a band or other ensemble comes in, plenty of BASS will be present right there and the last thing we'd want is 'bass war'.

Just a thought -

[salomonander]

hey guys

thanks for the replies. by studio guitar i dont mean a general purpose guitar for walking clients. in that case id pick the d28 immediately. this is for my music which is old school folk and country music. im looking for something warm and round. i do like the bass response on the standards and the d28. the j45tv seems really weak in comparison. anyone have both and can comment? thanks

[salomonander]

ps: i am also concerned about the light build. i do like the weight of the standards and d28 a lot more. maybe one could get rid of the "modernish" sound of the standard by replacing the saddle with a bone one? im not expert enough to know that kind of stuff.

[dchristo]

your TV has a red spruce top ( like mine ) the bass response will get better every time you play it.

Ive had mine about a year and the bass is ten times better that it was when I first got it.....I would bet yours will get better too

 

PS. I almost got rid of mine, but it kept getting better

 

[duluthdan]

I have an HD-28 and a J-45TV. They are both wonderful guitars. The 28 lives tuned down one whole step with 13 gauge 80/20 strings, the J45 tuned standard with 12 gauge Phospur Bronze. The bass response on my J45 is fine, and well balanced with the rest of the guitar, is very nice for folk genre stuff. It does not have the power and projection of the HD 28, which also has a great bass register. They both have a sound that is pleasing. For pure fun, I always grab the J45. If I could only choose one, I'd be a mess.

[E-minor7]

The term modern is pretty vague, but my take is that you mean slightly compressed and not as raw and direct as the classic (do not read Modern Classic) J-45.

One of the reasons I fell for the Standard was the strong bass and almost gentle voice – in my ears this made it a very lyrical instrument, not the best strummer/flatpicker nor most offensive 6-string I've met.

I often ran the risk of being regarded a clown here by claiming exactly that - perhaps what you call modern - had moved the new version a step away from the image as steaming workhorse.

But it's such a nice companion and it looses up while riding.

 

 

Bwt. welcome aboard.

 

 

[salomonander]

hey

thanks for your replies.

i do have to admit that my search is getting kind of frustrating. i ordered another j45 tv to compare. the new one has great bass response but is kind of dead in the mids and high end. now im sitting here with one tv that is absolutely sweet in the higher register but really lacks bass and another one that i actually feel when hitting a chord but that simply doesnt sing anywhere else. i did re-string them both on the same day with the same set of strings....

they sound fundamentally different - i guess what people say about gibson consistency is true. too bad.

dont know what to do and i guess ill send them both back. although one of them as the sweetest high end and mids i have heared on a guitar for a long time - but no bass response whatsoever :-(

i did send an email to gibson today to see if they might use different tonewoods for the top - the difference is that big. maybe one is sitka and he other red spruce? i tried two modern classics that sounded almost identical.

[CAMELEYE]

As dchristo has noted, the adi top on your TV will take some breaking in and will sound way different in a relatively short while (should you have the patience to wait). I have a new L-00TV and even in the week plus that I've been playing it, it's starting to sound deeper, fuller and the trebles are more pronounced.

So ... since you have two, send one back and let time do its magic on the other one. Good luck! Ce

[Gio]

Does it have to be a J-45? When I was looking for one myself I ended up taking home an Advanced Jumbo which had everything I was looking for and much more. This AJ has quickly become my favorite one; it's the typical "can't put it down" guitar. With the best thumping yet defined bass and singing mids and highs.

 

Unersetzbar.

[zombywoof]

If there is one thing that unites my favorite guitars it is the low end. I only play with my fingers and I rely on that low end to keep a steady rhythm if that is what I am aiming for or to place notes and bass runs to accent a melody line.

 

One of the things that for me distinguishes Gibsons from the herd is that percussive low end. I mean, just pull that low E back and let it snap. A great flippin' sound. The low end on my Banner J-50 is huge and dry. I have heard nothing else like it. My 1950s Epi flattop - while I have heard crisper upper ends and more satutrated mids than I can pull out of that guitar what it does have is a deep, round low end - almost sounds like a double bass.

[salomonander]

hey everyone

 

thanks for your replies. i did another day of testing. and i realized that maybe the MC suits me better than the TVs. the TVs tends to get in the vocal range with their presence boost while the standard simply lays a great fundament. i put the MC away in the beginning because there was something i did not like about the high end. and i still dont like it. its a subtle thing - but there is a certain "string bite" or plastic sound about it - for a lack of better words. the TVs are really round in the high end while the MC just sounds slightly "fake" in that register.

could it be that i dont like the sound of the tusq saddle? maybe thats my only problem about the standard. when trying to ignore this problem i actually prefer the standard in every way. it has a great "lonesome" cowboy sound :-) while the TVs sounds very polite and friendly in comparison.

i did listen to some comparisons that people did on other guitars - changing from tusq to bone. and i think it made a huge difference in the "mellowness" and natural sound of the high strings. does anyone have experience in that field? im not really that much of a guitarist but a music producer. so i have a very firm idea of the sound im trying to get. but not much clue about guitars :-( the standard actually has that sound - but a plastic feel in the high register.

[j45nick]

hey everyone

 

thanks for your replies. i did another day of testing. and i realized that maybe the MC suits me better than the TVs. the TVs tends to get in the vocal range with their presence boost while the standard simply lays a great fundament. i put the MC away in the beginning because there was something i did not like about the high end. and i still dont like it. its a subtle thing - but there is a certain "string bite" or plastic sound about it - for a lack of better words. the TVs are really round in the high end while the MC just sounds slightly "fake" in that register.

could it be that i dont like the sound of the tusq saddle? maybe thats my only problem about the standard. when trying to ignore this problem i actually prefer the standard in every way. it has a great "lonesome" cowboy sound :-) while the TVs sounds very polite and friendly in comparison.

i did listen to some comparisons that people did on other guitars - changing from tusq to bone. and i think it made a huge difference in the "mellowness" and natural sound of the high strings. does anyone have experience in that field? im not really that much of a guitarist but a music producer. so i have a very firm idea of the sound im trying to get. but not much clue about guitars :-( the standard actually has that sound - but a plastic feel in the high register.

 

 

There are so many variables in the tone of the guitar that it is really difficult to generalize about this. Every time you change one of the characteristics, whether it is strings, pick material, or components such as the saddle and pins, the guitar's voice will change. And, of course, you also have the guitar's aging process and its associated unpredictable changes to contend with.

 

At the end of the day, you have to go with the one whose sound qualities best suit your purposes, but you have to be aware that these qualities not only can change, but most likely will change as the guitar develops. And as a music producer, you know that the processed and recorded sound, with its many variables, can be quite different from the "raw", live sound in the music store or studio.

[GotTheSilver]

I know I am coming late to this conversation, but I wanted to add my two cents! I have a J-45 Legend that I have had for about a year and a half. It has an adi top. At first the bass was very light and constricted. It slowly developed over time until one day it was like, BAM, where did all this bass come from? I am now really impressed with the bass on this guitar, it just took some time to develop. Another factor that I think might have helped is that I switched to lighter gauge strings. I think the 13s I had been using were choking the guitar somewhat.

 

My Advanced Jumbo has a Sitka top, but I noticed a similar progression in the development of the bass in it.

[merseybeat1963]

hey

this is my first post here. so hello first of all!

im about to buy a j45 for myself and my studio. i ordered two standards and one true vintage from thomann in germany. i prefer the general voicing of the tv. there is a somewhat modern sound in the standards that i dont care for. problem is that the tv seems to have a lot less bass than the standard models. i have to strumm my flatpick in the middel of the soundhole to get a similar bass response than from a regular position on the standards. is this normal? or did i get a bad tv model? i can return them all so im not worried....

 

 

ps: i also got a d28. which i like a lot as well (basically im torn between the d28 and the j45tv). but its really hard to play compared to the gibsons. i have to apply way mor muscle in my left hand. the gibsons play like butter. the martin simlpy hurts after hald an hour of playing. again - is this normal for a d28s?

 

 

thanks a lot

jakob

 

 

Martin hard to play..take a look down the neck towards the body...is it straight looking or bowed? If bowed get it adjusted.

Bass good mids dead ...get new strings ...Elixer Nano .012 Phospher Bronze will be better than what guitar came with and last long enough till you find strings that suit you.

D28 Standard?..If yes why on earth would anyone buy that overbuilt guitar unless heavy strings & muscle were an issue...an HD28 is better 95% of the time.

[Del Nilppeznaf]

Hey salomander

 

welcome aboard. As other have stated..the bass response of a new guitar will need a little time to 'open up' and become fuller.

i have had a Hummingbird TV for just over a year and the bass and overall 'warmth of the guitar has changed significantly in that period. It sounds like you have a sweet J45 TV already..... I would keep it..the bass WILL open up

 

I find my HB TV a joy to record..because it is so balanced... i think that's one of the advantages of the TV range... a bass heavy guitar is not a good recording guitar.

 

I would not think changing saddles on these guitars will make so much difference concerning the bass response... its about the top opening up some what I believe.