stein
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Posts posted by stein
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Gibson GForce and MinETune systems are a brilliant idea
![[thumbup]](//content.invisioncic.com/p286412/emoticons/default_msp_thumbup.gif)
The younger folks will take to it eventually, the elderly not so much.
And in the end, I don't mind tuning my guitar by hand.
I'm weird, so sue me.
:unsure:
I think a lot of it is that for folks that have been playing for many years, are USED to tuning and have certain rituals or techniques for doing it. Just as you don't learn to play the guitar without learning to tune it, you don't get GOOD at playing guitar without getting good at tuning it.
Maybe not so much an age thing, but an experience thing. Although, older folks tend to be put off by stuff they have to learn that isn't on the agenda.
I don't know if I would be called old, but I am kinda in that boat. My personal dis-like is I don't know how I could get used to pushing a button and hoping for the best as it ain't what I am used to, and if by chance something went wrong, what I would do about it. At least for guitars I might use for performing.
But for a COUCH guitar, might be kinda fun.
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I think it's something Gibson has really got right for a change.
See, a "typical" Gibson guitar is fairly expensive, made to play well, and last a lifetime. As in, not disposable. And that typically means being able to replace parts as they break, or as a player sees fit for whatever reason.
Finally after many years, Gibson has "robo-tuners" that are drop-in replacements that can be swapped in or out, as they break or fail, or at the player's whim. And fairly cheap.
That makes folks mad?
And "they" say Gibson doesn't offer a choice? You know every place I have seen the 2015's for sale, the place also has walls of displays with tuners on it, and most more than one option for any given guitar. It isn't hard to put two and two together to figure out if you have 1500 bucks or so in your pocket, you can have any tuners you want on any guitar you might want to buy.
But it's worth saying again, the technology Gibson is offering here is they can be swapped out or changed ANY TIME you want, and easily replaced with new ones, just like ANY other tuner.
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Since this thread is back on, did there ever develop a resolution to this particular Gold top?
Seems I remember there was at least one more thread where suggestions were offered.
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....its best once the wood has shifted and settled which actually ensures great tone and playability years later.
What we see on the photos looks like the typical signs of aging and playing in the wood, which appear on many nitro cellulose guitars after some years. Usually you do not need to worry.....
It's a BS answer and a waste of time.
Want to point out, in the answer it says "years" and "usually", which means basically the whole answer means nothing as there is no determination on their part, and it hasn't been years, it's been months.
Also, the part I find to be utter total BS is the wood "settling and shifting". No, sorry, the wood should be cured before it's used, and Gibson knows that and does that. Sure the wood will move because it's wood, but to imply the wood still needs to move and "settle" into something else after it's built certainly implies something else to most who would read this.
It kinda leaves the door open to someone saying, "Could you take this back and give me a guitar that is made of wood that is cured?" Which also, I believe they would do.
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This is a good example for discussion of "cause and effect".
The "effect" is finish cracks, but the "cause" is not paint failure or climate extremes, or the entire guitar would look like this. The "cause" is stress, or structural movement in the weak spot of the thin area of the control cavity routing.
I agree with this, but my guess is more movement due to the thinner wood there and more holes.
I am not sure that even though the guitar is weaker there, it's weak enough to flex from outside forces to the point it would cause finish damage. It's still failrly strong maple.
I don't know the cause, but I'm thinking it's finish and wood movement of some sort.
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Not sure what you mean by "CC"? Only thing I can think of is "Custom Classic", which are kinda rare.
Anyway, most stuff from the 90's on up to today are going to be closer to the late 50's/early 60's "originals" than the mid 70's you are using now.
So, it depends on what your definition of "classic" LP sound is, and what you are measuring against. Even though for the most part LP's are closer to the holy grail 50'5/60's than ever, there are still many of us who grew up in the 70's/80's and are familiar with those LP's, and they are more "original" to us.
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It depends on what one considers "rare".
For a particular color/hardware/whatever combo not really normal, it may be rare. But Gibson is ALWAYS making stuff a little or a lot out of the standard burst/chrome scheme.
In other words, it isn't unusual at all to find something rare.
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Last night was breakfast for dinner...the works.
That's hashbrowns AND hotcakes. And ALL the bacon I could handle.
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This may be the worst advice I've ever seen posted here. Crazy glue? Good grief.....
Here at a local GC, on "tech" will try and clean it off for you with WD-40.
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Since the subject of fast food came up, thought I'd go ahead and mention yesterday and the day before was McDonalds. They're open late.
We have a Dairy Queen here too, gave them a shot a while back, but man, they were spendy. Fast food prices here in Portland Or are going up quite a bit. Surely has to do with the Unaffordable Care Act and the minimum wage stuff. As far as that goes, I'm all for the workers getting more, and kinda willing to accept the cost on the driver's side window, but to be honest, might have to back off the fast food, as it's really getting to be a different kind of deal for me when the cost reaches a certain point.
Having said that, I recently have been learning to cook lobster. I wouldn't say I'm particularly good at it, but MAN lobster is TASTY. I get tails for about 10 bucks a piece around here lately. Back it up with some frozen shrimp, and it's a seafood feast!
The beauty of it is, being frozen, don't have to depend on my lazy self to be sure to cook them before they expire. I waste more money that way.
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Me? I'd warm the area with a hair dryer while it was laying flat on a table on towels, and then put a dictionary on top of it for a day. Preferably the dictionary that Anthony Buckeridge uses for this forum...
Man that's quality humor there.
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I know PEOPLE can become magnetized, as I have on occasion.
I can remember working in the rain with cords and electricity, and getting buzzed all day. My arms would ache. One pass with a bulk tape eraser would make it go away, instantly.
As I said before (maybe a different thread?), in winter, walking on carpet all day, every now and again would get shocked on a doorknob. Got it the habit of giving it a quick swipe to get the shock before I grabbed it, just so it wouldn't hurt as much. Once I got the spark out of the way, wouldn't get a shock.
Or how about cats? I used to have this fat kitty that used to sit on my lap, and would pet him until he was all full of static and make cracking noises like a spider web, and be all matted up and such.
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I tried the dryer sheet again...nothing. If I rub the wood body of the guitar, near the controls and behind the stop tail the guitar sizzles and busses just like on the neck, if I rub the large plastic pick guard I get no noise... The rear control plate is also very loud.
I know this isn't the $2000 LP but it's still a $1200 guitar and how any of these guitars are acceptable for sale is beyond me...despite loving the playability of the SG (almost as much as the LP, and more than my Tele) I think am going to return it.
I don't get why this isn't a larger consumer issue???
Long story short: store is Sam Ash in CT, guitar was Gibson LP T, with "static" issues had, returned it, got another LP T and this one had same issue only worse as this one also had a grounding issue that would cut out all the electronics on the guitar and cause serious feedback...returned it. A sales associate and I went though every LP in the shop, from Studio Faded to Custom Shop and in between...they all had static, every last one! We tried a bunch of Fenders (Teles and Strats)...no static. We tried a bunch of Epiphone Les Pauls...no static. I finally settled on a Gibson SG Stsndard that seemed "less staticky" with the agreement that if it didn't dissipate in a week is return it...3 days in and the static is growing daily.
I've wiped down with the dryer sheets with no benefit (the Les Pauls too, btw). I've switched cords, outlets, rooms...no change. I have a Fender Tele that works just fine, no static.
So, is this a Gibson QC is a issue? I don't know...but how can EVERY guitar of one brand have the same issue and no guitars of every other brand not have any issues IN THE SAME STORE? I stopped at two mom and pop shops locally who had a few used LP's... None of those had the static issue. (One was a T but had a repaired headstock and the other shop had some Standards but they were a little too pricey...just to answer the inevitable "why didn't you buy one of those from the M&P).
As an aside, I can tell you that Gibson customer service sucks...I've called them 4 times now...left 4 messages after long hold time( the system keeps prompting to leave a vm due to high call volume) with no return call. Also sent two emails...no responses.
So, I scrimped and saved for the past year to buy a Gibson Les Paul...sold one of my other guitars (a Strat) to help fund it as well and when none of them in the shop work as they're supposed to I settle on another Gibson product (stupid me) that also doesn't work and Gibson can't return my calls or emails?
.BTW, Gibson customer service still hasn't contacted me by email or phone.
This here, I don't understand. I don't know who does.
To be fair, not saying you aren't having issues, but your case is a mystery, because this isn't something that is occurring for most of us. Certainly, not a whole store suffering from this, and not being able to fix it.
As for Gibson CS, keep in mind, they get a lot of calls, and they likely don't know what to say, and are probably getting back to those that they have answers for. Besides, it isn't for sure a Gibson issue, it's just your particular store, and maybe just you as well (Again, not saying you don't have a problem or it's your fault).
Wish I had an answer, really I do. It's at the very least, a great mystery from here in the cyberworld.
One possibility: maybe you as an individual, for whatever reason, tend to have a lot of static electricity build up. I used to get that at work in a particular building, and would discharge myself on a doorknob. It would make a spark. Every day. It came from walking a lot on the carpet at a fast pace throughout the day.
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Caveat. The hum and the static are probably not related. If the ground is good it could be a fluorescent light or dimmer switch or an electric motor such as fridge or freezer.
maybe not related,
but I can say that when I was tracking down a similar little bugger, (static pops just like described here, a buzzing sound, stopped when I touched the bride) that's what ultimately fixed it. (eg: ground all the pots to each other.) seriously. quiet as a mouse.
So, the Sam Ash tech couldn't solve the issue, in fact it grew worse after he replaced the toggle switch and shielded some wiring. They pretty much tapped out after that and offered me a refund or exchange so they gave me a great deal on a 2015 LP Traditional Classic Ice Tea plain top. As I mentioned earlier, all the LP's there "crackled" somewhat but this one less than all the others so I'm hoping it just has to be worn in some. If not it's got full warranty coverage which is better than the one I returned (only 30 days).
Thanks for the replies and helping out this noob.
Static electricity that is built up can and will indeed itself be prone to picking up noise.
Grounding the heck out of everything is not always better, because it can cause ground loops, which generally will make a thing MORE prone to noise than not.
Without a full on lesson in grounding from an un-qualified guy, I'll just say that Gibson's have an advantage using humbuckers, but the wiring schematic and use of shielded hook-up wire makes grounding more complicated.
THIS result here is likely what one should expect if they just start soldering grounds to everything and each other. It might seem intuitive, but it makes things much worse, especially if it is already grounded.
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Larrivee. Very under rated.
Those are Canadian right? Ive seen a few on Craigslist, never actually played one but i tried a Cedar Seagull and it was actually pretty nice.
I have to agree. Top notch stuff, at least what I know.
I have one, bought it while shopping for a Martin.
Last I knew, Mr. Larrivee retired, or partially, or whatever, and moved to California and opened a factory/shop there. The family still made and kept the Canadian place. So there were Larrivee guitars coming from 2 places, both from the same people/family. California guitars only being the very high end stuff.
I haven't played many of the ones coming from California, and a couple I didn't like the sound of much, but the construction, at least on the surface, was like that of Santa Cruz or Collings quality. VERY nice.
The regular, or older stuff, are nicely built, and impressive in sound quality, at least to my ears. I'd rate them along with standard production Gibson and Martin, easy.
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It did happen. Smith in his comprehensive Leo biography, Bacon in one of his Fender books mentions the actual matter.
Leo didn't want to, Gibson was doing it. Forrest convinced Leo to put his name to it too.
The three or four named companies were served. Some guitars arrived after that in San Francisco and some of each type Fender and Gibson were confiscated and had the headstocks sawn off of them in order to demonstrate penalty.
That was it.
The rest of us were, for the most part, blissfully unaware because nobody was fawning over Love Rocks and Ibanezii.
My wife of 35 years does not play the guitar, but when she sees the later 80s or 90s Bugs Bunny on tevee she still calls him the Ibanez Bugs Bunny. THAT is how strong the "I" word is to Deptford kids that grew up guitar!
rct
From what I remember I read, the "lawsuit" was a letter, but no one got sued, so to speak.
So many stories. So much rumor. I don't know what to believe, but rather, I don't really think it was any big deal. Regardless of what the real facts are. Personally, I think the story gets embellished a lot of the times because it just ain't an interesting story to begin with.
Just rather to say, at some point, Gibson and Fender weren't going to let total "copies" be made and sold here. But just as importantly, Ibanez and the like weren't going to get all that far making copies anyway, but rather did better making their own designs and getting a rep that way.
I think the MAIN thing here, is COPIES in the 70's and 80's weren't looked at favorably, both because of the stigma of having a copy and not the real deal, and, they weren't "good"...yet.
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Headstock repairs for me depend very much in the nature of the repair. People quote the 50% off thing add ad nauseum but there's a world of difference between a clean break along the grain with plenty of surface area to glue and a mess of dowels or filler covered in opaque overspray. To me there are examples of guitars with headstock breaks that in no way deserve a 50% hit in value and examples that are worth little more than the value of the pickups and hardware.
I respect Larry's viewpoint that there are plenty of unbroken guitars out there but guitars with issues such as minor headstock breaks, changed parts etc can be a good way into a vintage instrument for people who might otherwise not be able to afford that level of guitar, particularly where the high value golden era models are concerned.
The chief issue for me with headstock breaks is the resale issue - there are so many people who won't touch a guitar with a headstock break, and so many who expect a rock bottom price on them, they're a risk if you think you might need to resell the guitar further down the line.
That's what I think. To me, there is no way a guitar with a well repaired headstock break is only half as good, or worth half as much.
But, they are. That's almost a rule, but I don't really think it's a fair one.
I don't have any, but knew lots and played lots who did. Most of the time, you don't even notice, you have to look.
Just my opinion, but it all comes down to chances of breaking again, and how much to repair it. Any break, ANY, can be repaired, even if it means splicing a piece into it. Even if it has a splice and dowels and such, repaired is repaired. At that point, the QUALITY of the guitar is how it sounds, plays, and feels as it is at that moment.
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There is no structural concern with a proper and professional repair, but....
Personally, I would never knowingly buy a guitar that I knew had had MAJOR structural repair. As a "buyer" there are just too many options. From '71 through '75 Gibson built about 13,000 ES-335's, surely there are more than a few on the market that have not been busted up and glued back together.
Yea, but....but...but....HALF PRICE!!!!
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At what the internet says is a 50% discount, I would DEFINITELY buy a guitar with a repaired headstock.
I would add though, I would take a good, hard look at the repair. I don't buy the "stronger than before" thing. Stronger than what? Before it broke? Stronger than another that never broke (yet)?
The MAIN reason to be leery, and such a "standard" 50% price reduction I think, is you really can't tell how good a repair is/was. You can guess, but looking won't tell you how much glue, what type of glue, or what the wood actually looked like before it was glued.
Still, a broken headstock is nothing to stress out over, most are easily repaired. It happens.
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Let's not forget ibanez made Gibson copies so good that Gibson sued them. In fact, some of their copies were flat out better than the real thing in that era. Friend of mine runs a guitar store and he has sold ibanez les pauls from that time for 3k each. The japan factories have made some great guitars thru the years and we yanks snub our noses at them, well some of us lol. the same could be said for mexi guitars, but ask yourself this. Do you like mim Fenders? I have never felt the urge to buy an American Strat or Tele, (tho i have traded for one) mainly because the mexican ones were made so fantastic.
Still, trade valuewise, people will snub their nose at them. It is something to consider if you trade a lot which i do, but i cant see me selling my taylor right now.
I'm sorry bud, that just did not happen.
The lawsuit of the 70's was a joint effort by American guitar companies to stop people from duplicating their guitars to such a degree that they could be mistaken at a certain distance. "so good" was never part of it, and never will be.
Pee in a can, put a red and white label with a gold circle in the middle, call it Kambulls, you will get sued for making cans of urine, not cans of good soup, because "good" has nothing to do with it.
It's a tired story, often repeated by people that (usually) weren't even born at the time, and even more often are selling something from that time. It's pretty interesting that guys my age are not the people buying these so great copies.
rct
I am 46 years old, i lived thru the lawsuit era, tho i did not learn guitar until 1983 at camp. SO good will never be a part? Anyone who says that has never tried the higher end Ibanez or the Super Real or Reborn Series, this is someone who most likely tried the cheapest clones and assumed they were all crap. I am a massive trader, have played and owned many of these and i can say with absolute certainty that some of those clones were in fact better. In fact, a couple of the 59 clones are still HIGHLY sought after collectible items. Plus, the norlin era guitars had many design flaws like on my j50, ive never seen one that didnt have a crack right up the middle! and their QC wasnt great then either. But, i dont care, i like oddballs regardless.
I have to chime in here on this here debate.
The "lawsuit" guitars, that's really rumor only. It's mostly just a legend created to make those old Japanese guitars seem better or more interesting than they were/are.
Sorry, not saying they aren't cool or suck, but this idea that they were all that great also, well...
Here's the truth: the "lawsuit" never happened. They just said "knock it off" and they did. I don't think there is even a story, but I have yet to hear a story worth writing that is/was true.
A lot of OLD Japanese "copies" were OK, and fine guitars, and I have played some. But not until YEARS and years later, did anyone think or claim they were really that good. The TRUTH of THAT is, Japanese guitars are better now than they have ever been. They were better in the 80's than they were in the 70's. and better in the 00's than in the 90's.
So, really, where does the idea that 70's Japanese "lawsuit" guitars being so good come from? I think it's EBAY. The only thing "better" I have personally ever seen is the prices.
Just my opinion here, but I think one would find the exact same thing and better value in buying the current "made in Indonesia" or Korea of China stuff available right now as we speak. And I bet if one is honest and objective, they are better than what Japan was making in the 70's/80's.
But, I can't think of a good rumor to go along with that right now.
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I (initially) miss that link, somehow.
![[blush]](//content.invisioncic.com/p286412/emoticons/default_msp_blushing.gif)
But, those in the photo look amazingly like the OLD Klusons, in that the front and back edges are slightly rounded, as
they were back then. Cool!
Seems like they old ones had double ringed keys, but they probably came
with double and single ringed models? I know the stock Klusons on my
1976 Gibson LP Deluxe, and my 1954 Gibson J-160E both had/have the double
ringed key buttons.
CB
That there, is an eye for detail.
The ORIGINAL Klusons, did come in both double and single ring on the key. In fact, it used to be the case, before reproductions were available, that the single ring were very rare as that is what the the oldest Gibsons used to have, and of corse, as you know, they tend to deteriorate. Gibson switched from single to double ring sometime in the 60's. Something like that, anyway.
These days, or corse, you can get anything, different looks, different quality. I can't keep up.
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Photos might be helpful?!
![[tongue]](//content.invisioncic.com/p286412/emoticons/default_msp_tongue.gif)
CB
I followed the link provided, and the Wilkinson Deluxe do in fact appear to look identical to every other Kluson Deluxe tuner, save for the writing on the back.
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It's very possible the tuners are the same exact tuners, but just branded differently.
I don't know what the "Wilkinson tuners" are that are "supposed" to be on that guitar, but it's kinda doubtful that for 350 bucks, they are as upscale as the name might lead one to believe. They look like standard "Kluson Deluxe" tuners made and branded by nearly everyone. (Kluson is no longer in business).
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Great find. I think everyone should have one of these, be it this one, a "lp", a champ, etc.
Thought I might add, what you describe the 6v6 tube doing, that's one way of checking for a bad tube. This one is clearly bad.
One of the charms of these is you only need one tube, so finding various real NOS tubes, or using leftovers, makes life more fun.
![[thumbup]](http://content.invisioncic.com/p286412/emoticons/default_msp_thumbup.gif)
![[blush]](http://content.invisioncic.com/p286412/emoticons/default_msp_blushing.gif)
But, those in the photo look amazingly ![[tongue]](http://content.invisioncic.com/p286412/emoticons/default_msp_tongue.gif)
1976 Gibson Les Paul Standard
in Instrument ID and information
Posted
There isn't a lot of detail in the picks to show the finish to really judge it, but another clue this is likely origonal is the clear finish on the rest of the guitar, which is proper for a Gold-top of this time.