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    Gibson ES 335 or Epiphone 335 Pro...Be Honest

    in Gibson ES

    Posted

    Sorry Bluesy but there just ain't no contest.

     

    No, they do NOT use the same woods. The Gibson woods are of higher quality and the construction is far better. It is for this reason alone that model for model the sound is different. Yes, I agree that for some models it gets darn close but it is not the same.

     

    I'll give you an example from personal experience:

     

    Many, many years ago I had a Gibson ES345 1964. Like so many of us on here I sold it and have regretted it ever since. I din't ever think I would own a similar Gibson again.

     

     

    When Epiphone brought out their version of the ES345 I was elated. I ordered one in advance and made extensive high grade modifications. It was a damn good guitar no question.

     

    But then I came by a bit of money unexpectedly at the same time Gibson started making reissue ES345s. I could not resist and got a 1959 reissue ES345. Not the same as my 1964 but - in my opinion - even better.

     

    I was obviously able to directly compare the Epiphone with the Gibson. The difference was astonishing. Just no comparison. The Gibson was leagues better. The Epiphone was nowhere near the same class (and sound).

     

    I got rid of the Epiphone.

     

    Case closed.

    Les Paul High Performance Love Thread

    in Gibson USA

    Posted

    Thanks, I've never played a richlite fb, but I do like ebony and I'm not a vintage minded guy, so what ever works is good with me. I'm not trying to provoke you guys, but I'm considering getting a g-force tuner to put on. In my band I need to do alt tunings. My #1 guitar is a modified Variax, which lets me do alt tunings with a knob turn. I'm hoping to get close to that with this new LP. So far every guitar I've played with the g-force has worked fine. So until I get a roadie, I need something that will keep me playing instead of standing on stage tuning while the rest of the band stares at me.

     

    Not a provocation at all drew. Again I couldn't bear a G-force thingy on my guitars but as you describe your circumstances there is a plain purpose to it and so why not? If it makes life easier and it would surely do that given a need to change tunings frequently and on stage then by all means...it makes perfect sense.

    Les Paul High Performance Love Thread

    in Gibson USA

    Posted

    it has a very dark fret board which makes me think it is Richlite. I know that will excite you guys. [rolleyes]

     

     

    Arrrrrgh! [scared]

     

     

    I haven't played a Richlite board (and personally wouldn't buy one) but people who have say they are as good as ebony to play.

     

    It is a great looking guitar! Good luck and enjoyment with playing it! [biggrin]

    Gibson Epiphone SG 'Neck Dive" Poll

    in Gibson USA

    Posted

    Is this statement even close to reality? I mean, my XPT700 dives like an eagle/firebird, so it was quite refreshing to play a guitar that doesn't.

     

    Not with me it isn't JAF. My Epiphone SG-400 dives like Billy-Oh even with "grippy" straps.

     

    In fact it was so bad that I placed lead fishing weights (about 3 ozs) inside the control cavity which hardly makes a difference to the weight of the guitar but completely stopped the diving. The weights do not move they are fixed to the bottom opposite corner of the cavity to the neck.

     

    Result = complete satisfactory solution to a problem which irritated the hell out of me.

    Les Paul High Performance Love Thread

    in Gibson USA

    Posted

    I wasn't going to say anything else here but...

     

    I don't really care much about anyone's playing style or skill at all. I mean, I do hope everyone plays well of course, but everyone's different and we all enjoy (hopefully) playing what and how we play it.

     

    If this thread had been about how much a person was enjoying their guitar, and even why, that would be great. I'd have been happy to congratulate them and even compliment them on a fine looking Les Paul. But if's when you start telling everyone else they should share you're preference or be a stale, old fashioned poser is when it goes bad.

     

    Like I said, a preference for a wider fret board is completely valid and I don't knock anyone who plays an HP. I'm sure they're nice.

     

    To each their own. Enjoy.

     

    I hope your comment isn't aimed at me because if it is then I heartily resent it.

     

    I make no comment whatsoever about anyone's playing skill. Truth be told I reckon just about every poster on this website plays better than me.

     

    Who exactly is telling anyone that they "should share" this opinion or that opinion. I don't think I have ever done that in any post I have ever posted on this site and certainly not within this thread.

     

    I don't getting where you are coming from mate. Don't get it at all.

    Les Paul High Performance Love Thread

    in Gibson USA

    Posted

    About the E falling off the neck.

     

    I've always had a problem with this.

    Partly for this reason, I would never use a guitar that was too rounded at the edges. Nor one with nibs.

     

    Maybe (partly) explains why I like nibs so much. I can honestly say that this just doesn't ever happen with me (no matter what guitar it is).

    Les Paul High Performance Love Thread

    in Gibson USA

    Posted

    It is probably better to simply agree to disagree Sabredog.

     

    You are not going to change my mind about nibs in a million years and vice versa I fancy.

     

    As for other manufacturers I really wish my Yamaha SG did have nibs but it hasn't. I can happily live with that because it is a superb guitar anyway.

    Les Paul High Performance Love Thread

    in Gibson USA

    Posted

    that's a reasonable explanation. feel as you said is subjective, but certainly important, so that design probably does have a very nice feel to your style,

     

     

    but engineers learn how to break that feel down into measurable quantitative elements that can show improved performance, measurable performance increase, that 95 out of 100 players can achieve the intended target note, or accuracy of fretting, or accuracy the desired result, or 10 vibrato movements obtained in one second can consistently be obtained and errors are reduced. Where as the other model has increased error rate, when the string is not hit perfectly an actual error occurs like accidentally fretted on plastic surface.

     

    Re your last main paragraph and the link:

     

    http://www.gibson.com/News-Lifestyle/Features/en-us/Undercut-Fret-Over-Binding.aspx

     

    Taking the paragraph quoted above and the content of the link my thoughts are thus:

     

    Self-justificatory Sales Bollocks. Pure and Simple.

     

    But as Merciful said above - a lot of us just don't believe a word of it and prefer the original version of Gibson binding.

     

    But as I said, you like it done Yamaha style and that's fine by me. It isn't as if Gibson never did it your way. I think the Les Paul Recording is not nibbed and never has been.

    Les Paul High Performance Love Thread

    in Gibson USA

    Posted

    Sabredog, Gibson learned the hard way in 2015 that the Gibson faithful are still calling the shots (if they had any doubt). The vast overall majority want 1959 specs.

     

    Gibson knew that the 2015 policy (of modern specs) was a huge risk, and they lost out massively on sales as a result. At the end of 2015, when the 2016 sprint run models were appearing, shops were discounting the 2015 models heavily. My LP was a 49% reduction from list price.

     

    So you, me and any other HP fans are very much in the minority.

     

    When I first came here it shocked me how passionate the traditionalists are. I didn't understand it. I'm only just starting to now. I decided to stick around and discovered that they are incredibly knowledgeable about guitars. There are some excellent players, luthiers and professionals here. Most are generous with their help & time too. I have learned quite a bit here.

     

    You've made your views known in the OP. I recommend engaging with those who disagree with you. Intolerance is a dead end! ](*,)

     

    That's a very good post Mr Mercy Sir.

     

    Yes, I confess straight up to being an absolute hidebound traditionalist. I absolutely don't want auto-tuners, PCB boards or other deviations unless I choose to stick them on myself. I am happy with things like coil splits and series /parallel switching and that sort of stuff but to be told by Gibson (2015) that the "new" frets-over-binding is somehow so way huge superior got my goat so bad that even now I still choke on the memory of it. And as for auto-tune...no, we won't go there... [cursing]

     

    The exception to my self-imposed "rule" is if modifications form part of some other "system" of generating music (e.g. midi and the Roland 13 pin or the Fishman Triple Play systems).

    Les Paul High Performance Love Thread

    in Gibson USA

    Posted · Edited by Pin

     

    but I've never heard a rational well thought out, well written description of how and why they bring so much pleasure,

     

     

    That's very easy to supply.

     

    The "playing feel" of a bound neck with well finished nibs is second to none and better than the feel obtained (example: my Yamaha SG2000 - a very fine guitar if I might say so) that with a guitar without a nib finished neck.

     

    Now is what I have said irrational? No, it isn't. Is it an objective testable statement? No, it isn't. It is my subjective opinion which is as valid as yours any day of the week. It is not better than yours but nor is it worse.

     

    I am very happy for you to hate nibs and carry on hating them for the rest of your life but I resent being told I can't bend, do vibrato or otherwise do anything than show crap technique that inevitably will manifest on a nibs equipped guitar. Because it isn't true.

     

    And I can also do all these things on my Les Paul 25 / 50 which is a fully nibbed "fretless wonder" - flat as a pancake style - fretboard of the same kind as on B.B. King's "Lucille" ES355 (but without the inlays going all the way up the neck).

    • Upvote 1

    Les Paul High Performance Love Thread

    in Gibson USA

    Posted

    my first question is:

    Do you have any intention of buying a new Gibson guitar? I think we can see the answer is absolutely not.

     

    I understand the collecting of antiques, I just don't think there's any room to argue the nibs are a well performing feature. they might be cute, and if you play very simple music with no hammer-ons and no vibrato and no fast grabbing of a barre chords, you can make the instrument work. It is like buying a 1959 Bel Air it is very cool it's fun to drive once or twice per year, but most of the modern cars give considerably more driving pleasure in every aspect, it certainly gives a flavor of a specific driving era.

     

    You do like to write absolute cobblers old chap.

     

    But you are welcome to your tripe. That old fella B.B. King had such crap vibrato did he not? [biggrin]

     

    Would I buy a new Gibson guitar?

     

    Of course, just so long as it had nibs!

     

    But I'm fine. You have your preferences and I'll stick to mine thanks very much.

    • Upvote 1

    Les Paul High Performance Love Thread

    in Gibson USA

    Posted · Edited by Pin

    I've had the 2016 Les Paul high-performance for a year and a half now.

     

     

    that's the stupidest traditional feature I've ever seen ending the frets early and extending them with plastic binding, plastic frets.

    I took it back after about 3 1/2 weeks and swore I would never get a guitar where the frets did not go over the top of the binding.

     

     

     

    Ahhhh, the nibs!

     

    And I won't buy (even look at) a Gibson guitar without the nibs.

     

    It is what makes (for me) a Gibson a Gibson.

     

    But then I have never had any problem at all with binding on the Gibson's I have owned and still own.

    • Upvote 1

    Upgrades to Matsumoku Sheraton

    in Epiphone Electrics

    Posted

    I just found the pics online, so not sure what year. I've seen flamed Sheratons like that before (love that dark burst!), and they are NOT photo-flame, but actual veneers. The Matsumoku Sheratons and Emperors were very high-quality instruments --- some would say on a par with the Elitist series --- so they didn't cut corners and costs with photo-flames and such like.

     

    If you do a Google Advanced Image Search for "Matsumoku Sheraton," you may find more details.

     

    I have a Karera thinline semi-hollow whose model number is SH-800-AN. The AN stands for Antique Natural, but I'm convinced this was made by Peerless using Sheraton specs (the "SH" in the model name) Notice the headstock logo which somewhat resembles a letter "P" for Peerless. This guitar is also all real wood veneers, including the pickguard, which I like a lot.

     

    DH5fCiW.jpg

     

    That Karera is one very nice guitar indeed. I particularly like the inlays going all the way up the neck like (IMO) they should do.

     

    I would have been surprised that Maksumoto used photo-flame but I'm very pleased to hear it confirmed from people who know better than me that they didn't and don't.

    MHS Humbuckers

    in Gibson ES

    Posted

    Wow Déjà Vu.... I had a Sunburst '59 ES345 Stereo with Varitone & those amazing sounding PAFS too when I was a young guy. I had no idea what I had & sold it. I've been chasing that sound for the past 30 years. I've yet to find it. I recently purchased a new Sunburst Gibson ES335 with MHS Pickups. It is a great Tribute to the '59's & comes very close & may even be as good. Sometimes I wonder if it's the memory of the old Guitars we used to have that makes them seem just a little bit sweeter? Nah! That was the best sounding Guitar I've ever heard!

     

    Lars

     

    Hi Lars,

     

    Yes, the MHS are pretty close - very good indeed IMO. I shall certainly not be swapping them out that's for sure.

     

    But you are right also about those original PAFS. They were indeed really sweet.

    MHS Humbuckers

    in Gibson ES

    Posted

    Likewise here. What 345 did you get? Mine is the '64 reissue TDC Maestro VOS, and I like it just the way it is. (The varitone is interesting, but not essential)

     

    Hi Wmachine,

     

    I got a sunburst 1959 ES345 reissue and I love it. I have made two small changes to it - swapped the tailpiece for a TP6 (already faded) which I prefer and fitted a tortoiseshell pickguard which I also prefer. Of course I have retained the original fitments.

     

    Many years ago I had a sunburst 345 (of course that one was stereo which I always found a nuisance) and I bitterly regret selling it on but then I was young and even more silly than I am now.

     

    I love the varitone myself and just wouldn't buy a 345 or a 355 without one.

    MHS Humbuckers

    in Gibson ES

    Posted

    A lot of this discussion is down to personal preference, so this is just my opinion of course.

     

    That's the truth of it Dave.

     

    Personally, I love the MHS pickups on my reissue ES345. I couldn't believe just how good they are when I got the guitar and still feel like that.

     

    On the other hand, I hate the original series 7 pickups in my Les Paul 25 / 50 (muddy crap) and if I have said once I'm going to swap 'em out I've said it a dozen times. Still haven't done it yet though!

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