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Help with a 59 reissue

#1 User is offline   stayfreejc 

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Posted 15 April 2017 - 12:47 AM

Hi chaps. I am currently playing a 2016 Les Paul Trad and absolutely love the thing. I came from an SG and a USA PRS Custom 24. I sold the PRS and SG shortly after buying the Les Paul as they became redundant. Anyway I am lucky enough to have a few grand coming my way and wanted to plough it into something that will not devalue. I can imagine this topic has been done to death but cannot find any hard answers. If I were to buy the right 59 reissue would it eventually increase in value or at least stay the same? It is my dream guitar but cannot justify spending on something that realistically will sound no better than my Trad if it is going to devalue. Basically I am looking for a Les Paul up to 5k that will be financially sound. Cheers chaps
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#2 User is online   Farnsbarns 

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Posted 15 April 2017 - 05:55 AM

Prices are high at the moment. If you bought a reissue 5+ years ago it's resale is often now higher than the new price was back then. That's because new prices have risen so fast of late, much faster than inflation. That's not sustainable and I doubt there can be more massive price rises coming so I would think it would take a while before the used value catches up with what was paid. Probably more like 10+ years.

That said, it's all speculation and we could see the end of reissues with stricter wood controls and that would push the used value very fast.
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#3 User is offline   pippy 

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Posted 15 April 2017 - 08:05 AM

View Poststayfreejc, on 15 April 2017 - 12:47 AM, said:

...If I were to buy the right 59 reissue would it eventually increase in value or at least stay the same?...

Almost certainly not. It will merely become a second-hand guitar and second-hand guitars are almost never more expensive than their new equivalent.
Check out the price of a new R9 and then compare with the numerous offerings on eBay for an indication of how much prices drop once 'out-the-door'.

Some exceptions are certain examples of the Collector's Choice or Artist's Signature replica models.
The Melvyn Franks (i.e. ex-Peter Green) CC#1; the Jimmy Page #1; the Billy Gibbons 'Pearly Gates' are all sort-of holding value but these are in the tiny minority which are doing well. They are also, unfortunately, outside your hoped-for budget.

However, there are a few gems in terms of original buying price if you look hard enough. Not an R9, I grant you but here's an R8 available at the moment for a price whose s/h value is unlikely to drop anytime soon;
http://www.richtonem...tobacco_vos.asp

Thomann has also got an 'interesting' Collector's Choice available for a great price if you don't mind something...erm...a bit different, shall we say?;
https://www.thomann....s_choice_10.htm
The Tom Scholtz isn't my cuppa by a long way but as an investment it's probably(*) quite sound.

One thing I have noticed over the years is that guitars with highly flamed/figured/3D tops will always command prices higher than lesser-endowed examples. Shame, as a nice bit of maple adds nothing to the tone and there are some very pretty dogs out there but, as a general rule, the s/h market seems to put looks as their #1 priority. With this in mind my advice from the investment angle would be to buy the most 'killer' top you can find and just hope to goodness that the rest of the guitar matches up to a certain extent.

Pip.

(*) All just my opinion, of course, and I'm nobody's financial advisor. YMMV.
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#4 User is offline   Black Dog 

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Posted 16 April 2017 - 07:28 AM

I think the general rule is anytime you can still buy the same thing new, any previously owned example will always be worth less. If you want something that will hold or increase in value, you need a true antique, or some super special limited edition that's highly desirable, and no longer available. Other than that these things are not investments, just really expensive toys that make us very happy, certainly nothing wrong with that. [smile]

On the other hand as was said, the nicer the piece you buy, the less you'll lose.
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#5 User is offline   MichaelT 

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Posted 17 April 2017 - 10:34 AM

I think they all initially go down at first, although a Les Paul goes down less than many other guitars. From what I've seen and heard is that if a Les Paul is kept for a number of years, say 25-30, that value does increase. The ones these days will never be the 200,000 dollar guitars the 50's Les Pauls bring. But maybe 5,000 more than originally paid for. My 81 V, which I paid $800.00 for is now appraised at $3000 and it's not in mint condition. Mint would have made it worth another 800-1000 more. My case is trashed too, so I'm sure that counts as part of it. It's been played, been loved, not sat in a case and untouched for 3 1/2 decades. That's just my personal experience.
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#6 User is offline   pippy 

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 09:20 AM

View PostMichaelT, on 17 April 2017 - 10:34 AM, said:

...From what I've seen and heard is that if a Les Paul is kept for a number of years, say 25-30, that value does increase....

I'm not so sure, Michael.

I've just had a quick look on the USA eBay and, as an example, there are a number of '76 LP Customs (first year of the re-introduction of the 3-p'up Custom) to be had for anywhere between $3,000 up to $4,200 for a mint, totally original 3-p'up version with OHSC.
A new LPC, on the other hand, is currently listed on the Sweetwater site as costing $4,799 so even the earliest non-'50s 3-p'up LPC usually costs less than a new example.

Some of the very late '60s ones do go for bigger money but they are far more scarce which, in turn, drives the price up.
There were just far too many Les Pauls made in every decade from the '70s right up to today to make them collectable / valuable.

Pip.
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#7 User is offline   MichaelT 

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 02:14 PM

Good to know, Pip. I stand corrected. Thank you. [thumbup]
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#8 User is offline   pippy 

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 04:33 PM

Thank you for taking my post in the right spirit, Michael.
I'm not trying to start a bunfight or score points but as far as recent Les Pauls go I believe only the rare / special edition / Tom Murphy aged etc...etc... ones will be of interest to collectors = investment potential. Shame as my own quartet are between 22 and 26 years old so the "25-30-year-old" concept might have been good news otherwise...

Your Flying V, OTOH, is a different matter because V's have always been produced in smaller quantities (and not at all in some years) and are therefore more likely to have a dedicated - if less numerous - following / captive market.

I wish you the best of luck if you ever decide to part company with her.

Pip.
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#9 User is offline   MichaelT 

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Posted 27 April 2017 - 07:08 AM

View Postpippy, on 21 April 2017 - 04:33 PM, said:

Thank you for taking my post in the right spirit, Michael.
I'm not trying to start a bunfight or score points but as far as recent Les Pauls go I believe only the rare / special edition / Tom Murphy aged etc...etc... ones will be of interest to collectors = investment potential. Shame as my own quartet are between 22 and 26 years old so the "25-30-year-old" concept might have been good news otherwise...

Your Flying V, OTOH, is a different matter because V's have always been produced in smaller quantities (and not at all in some years) and are therefore more likely to have a dedicated - if less numerous - following / captive market.

I wish you the best of luck if you ever decide to part company with her.

Pip.


Perhaps when I'm in the grave I'll part company with her, Pip. I love that guitar and she's been from one side of the country to the other with me and with me for 33 years, played tens of thousands of hours, thousands of gigs. The case is trashed, the guitar has definitely seen some love/wear, worn through two guitar straps. Her frets are worn, pots and electronics have been cleaned. But, she sounds amazing, stays in tune, plays like a dream and is a beautiful guitar. The ONLY reason that I wouldn't take her to the grave is that hopefully someone will love and play that guitar for years in the future as I have after I'm gone.
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#10 User is offline   cjsinla 

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Posted 31 May 2017 - 07:32 AM

My advice to the OP is to buy used, you will get more bang for your buck and lose less if you decide to sell it next year. CS models are generally better than USA models to me and I enjoy playing them more. It's worth it to me to pay a little more for them. But, my limit is in the $3000 range.
Life is too short to play crappy guitars:

1959 Les Paul Jr
1960 Melody Maker
1979 Flying V
1982 Heritage Flying V
1982 30th Anniversary Les Paul
2009 VOS Les Paul Special DC
2011 50th Anniversary Pete Townsend SG
2011 61ri SG
2011 VOS 1960 Les Paul Special
2013 SG Original
2013 61 Les Paul SG
2013 ES335
2014 Les Paul R6 Goldtop
2014 Les Paul Traditional
2015 VOS 59 ES330
2015 VOS 63 ES335
2016 VOS 1960 Les Paul Special DC
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