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Buying a 93' Les Paul Standard - Advice appreciated

#1 User is offline   Shagura 

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Posted 14 November 2017 - 05:56 PM

Hello guys. I have a line on a 93' Les Paul Standard which I'm going to be trying out in a couple of weeks, which I'm really excited for. I've read about the 90's being a good period for Les Pauls but I want to test it before I buy it. I currently own a 2015 Les Paul Deluxe which Í'll be selling to partially fund this guitar.
The reason I signed up was to post some pictures of the guitar, since the current owner doesn't have the bill since he bought it from someone else, nor does he have documents that came with the guitar. I know a bit about fakes but I don't want to take any chances and I was hoping some of you guys could cast an eye on it to see if it's authentic or not.

I'm going to be paying 1600 euro's for it, which is around 1850 US dollars. Do you guys think this is an okay deal, or should I go for some other year maybe? All tips are welcome.

Thanks in advance.

Here are the pictures:
Front: https://ibb.co/czos56
Neck: https://ibb.co/itys56
Headstock: https://ibb.co/e31ZJR
Back: https://ibb.co/kbaGXm
Suitcase: https://ibb.co/igc8dR
Front close up: https://ibb.co/bGfN56
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#2 User is offline   Johnny 6 String 

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Posted 14 November 2017 - 06:11 PM

Hi Shagura;

From the pics everything looks good to me, no idea what current prices for 90's LPS. I would suggest looking at completed listings on ebay, reverb etc to get an idea of competitive pricing.


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#3 User is offline   jdgm 

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Posted 14 November 2017 - 06:23 PM

1433 (GBP), not a bad price but not that great either....however I think it is about right and should be well worth it, looks good from the pics.
Yes the early 90s were good years for Gibsons.
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#4 User is offline   pippy 

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Posted 15 November 2017 - 03:34 AM

Hi and welcome to the forum.

My tuppence-worth;

That one is definitely not a fake. It's in good condition for a 24-y-o Les Paul and it has a very nice dark 'board, too.
Judging by the shape of the heel my guess is that it may very well have quite a beefy neck profile so it's a very good idea to try this one out before you commit to buy it as this detail can sometimes be a deal-maker / deal-breaker.
I wouldn't see any particular reason to go, specifically, for any one year over any other. IMX there were many very good LPs built during the '90s (*) but there's no reason to assume '93 was either any better nor any worse than any other year in this respect.

Price-wise I'd echo jdgm's comments above; 1600 Euros is neither a bargain nor a rip-off. It's probably just about right.

Good luck with the prospective purchase.

Pip.

(*) FWIW I happen to have a '91, a '93 and a pair of '95s.
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#5 User is offline   Shagura 

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Posted 15 November 2017 - 06:58 PM

Thanks for the responses guys! I'm glad to hear you don't think it's a fake. How do you spot that it's not a fake, though, I'm wondering? Hearing that takes a bit of uncertainty away, so I probably won't have to check for signs of fakeness when I see it in person. :)

The darker fretboard, do you guys think it's ebony? I hadn't really noticed that tbh, before you mentioned it.
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#6 User is offline   Paully 

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Posted 16 November 2017 - 02:12 AM

You might want to check out the "Epiphone Talk" forum, if you're concerned about authenticity.
Those guys are very knowledgeable about Gibson product. They're especially adept at detecting fakes. 😎
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#7 User is offline   pippy 

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Posted 16 November 2017 - 06:26 AM

 Shagura, on 15 November 2017 - 06:58 PM, said:

...The darker fretboard, do you guys think it's ebony?...

No.
It's just a very dark slab of rosewood.

Pip.
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#8 User is offline   Shagura 

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Posted 22 November 2017 - 05:23 AM

Thanks for the help guys. I talked with the current owner on the phone and he sounds like an honest guy, plus I believe you guys when you say it's authentic.

Quote

No.
It's just a very dark slab of rosewood.

Pip.


I asked the owner about this and he does say it's an ebony fretboard. So either he is or you are wrong. I read about early 90's Studios having ebony fretboards, what makes you think this one is a dark rosewood? Didn't Standards normally have ebony boards?
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#9 User is offline   pippy 

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Posted 22 November 2017 - 06:31 AM

 Shagura, on 22 November 2017 - 05:23 AM, said:

...I read about early 90's Studios having ebony fretboards, what makes you think this one is a dark rosewood? Didn't Standards normally have ebony boards?...

Some of the LP Studios made between 1987 and 1998 had ebony 'boards - they were offered in both ebony and rosewood versions - but the LP Standard model has never been offered with an ebony 'board - always rosewood. The Les Paul Custom was traditionally fitted with an ebony 'board although this has now changed (in 2012) and the regular - i.e. non-reissue - LPC now comes with a Richlite 'board.

Rosewood can be found in pretty much any shade you imagine from reddish mid-brown to almost black. Ebony has a much tighter grain structure than rosewood which is more open by comparison. Have a look at the relative openness of the grain in the areas between the 12th and 13th- and 15th and 16th frets in the second snap in your OP.

Here's a quick snap of my '91 1960 Classic with very dark-brown rosewood 'board as an example - but they do come even darker;

Posted Image

Pip.
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#10 User is offline   Shagura 

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Posted 22 November 2017 - 09:59 AM

Very nice guitar! I love the burst on that one.

Honestly I don't really see the grain that well. I have compared rosewood and ebony fretboard pictures on the internet to the pic of the one on the Standard. To my eye it looks more like ebony than rosewood, but that might just be me. I believe you when you say there haven't been any standards made with an ebony board. Though makes it weirder for me since rosewood seems to have a lot more grain than that, combined with the guy saying the Standard has an ebony board.
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#11 User is offline   pippy 

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Posted 22 November 2017 - 10:42 AM

 Shagura, on 22 November 2017 - 09:59 AM, said:

Very nice guitar! I love the burst on that one.

Honestly I don't really see the grain that well. I have compared rosewood and ebony fretboard pictures on the internet to the pic of the one on the Standard. To my eye it looks more like ebony than rosewood...

Thanks for the kind words about the guitar. It sounds as good as it looks.

I know what you mean about trying to judge from pictures on the internet. I have a couple of guitars with ebony 'boards (as well as quite a few with rosewood) and it's very much easier to see the difference between the two woods with the guitars 'in the hand'. Also having had such a straightforward comparison makes it easier, subsequently, to know what to look for in pictures.

Yes; the 'board on the Standard DOES look dark enough to be ebony but it WILL be rosewood.
But what's wrong with rosewood? After all; it's what all those 1/2 million dollar 'bursts came with...

Posted Image

Pip.
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#12 User is offline   kaicho8888 

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Posted 22 November 2017 - 12:29 PM

From your picture of the neck, it does look similar to ebony wood. It appears to be fairly smooth and have little or no straight grains...nice! Posted Image

I'm no expert looking at pictures ... just comparing it with my ebony fretboards.
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#13 User is offline   Shagura 

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Posted 23 November 2017 - 03:00 AM

 pippy, on 22 November 2017 - 10:42 AM, said:

Thanks for the kind words about the guitar. It sounds as good as it looks.

I know what you mean about trying to judge from pictures on the internet. I have a couple of guitars with ebony 'boards (as well as quite a few with rosewood) and it's very much easier to see the difference between the two woods with the guitars 'in the hand'. Also having had such a straightforward comparison makes it easier, subsequently, to know what to look for in pictures.

Yes; the 'board on the Standard DOES look dark enough to be ebony but it WILL be rosewood.
But what's wrong with rosewood? After all; it's what all those 1/2 million dollar 'bursts came with...

Posted Image

Pip.


It's not that it HAS to be an ebony board, I was just confused by the owner saying it's ebony and you saying it isn't possible, adding to that that the grain looks like ebony as well. I'm fine with it either way, I would just like to know. :)
I'm going to be handling it this sunday anyway so maybe then I'll have a better indication.


 kaicho8888, on 22 November 2017 - 12:29 PM, said:

From your picture of the neck, it does look similar to ebony wood. It appears to be fairly smooth and have little or no straight grains...nice! Posted Image

I'm no expert looking at pictures ... just comparing it with my ebony fretboards.


Yeah I thought the same about its smoothness and the little amount of grain. I'll see for myself this sunday.
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