wildmann Posted April 2, 2010 Share Posted April 2, 2010 WHY does the Epiphone P-93 Riv. come with Imitation Klusons that say Epiphone on them, when it's supposed [according' to the Promotion/Literature/Ads] to have "GROVERS". Klusons ain't Grovers, and the 1'st thing ANYBODY did back in th' Day, was to Remove Th' Klusons and install Grover, or Schaller Machine Heads. AND, Why do the Strings on New Epi's turn your finger-tips BLACK, [or dark Grey]??? What Brand are they? Just' Asking. Bear in mind that I own a REAL Gibson Factory Cherry Red Casino, '66 Vintage, w/Bigsby Vibrato, an' a P-93 Riviera, '66 Alpine White Wilshire re-issue, and an Alpine White LP Studio. Also about 14 other axes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianh Posted April 2, 2010 Share Posted April 2, 2010 The Grover reference is probably a typo, there are lots of them in current Epiphone AND Gibson marketing copy. Those Kluson copies aren't so bad though, they hold tune just fine on my P93, and I'm fairly picky about tuners. The black fingers issue is residue from the dye they use to darken the cheap *** Indonesian rosewood. A good fretboard cleaning with naptha and lemon oil will get rid of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildmann Posted April 3, 2010 Author Share Posted April 3, 2010 [ Yeah, they hold tuning, [with a WD Gold Chrome Brass Roller Bridge] and they're tight, certainly Smoother than Vintage Klusons, But, they're Not Grovers. I've got a REAL[Gibson Factory Vintage] '66 Casino, w/Bigsby, and the Klusons are not nearly as smooth. [They're not worn out , as I got that Ax in 83, and it had virtually NO USEAGE!!] I'm GLAD I didn't Alter the '66 Casino with Grover/Schallers --Now,-- cuz-- It's still Original. For playin' purposes, I much Prefer the Cast type Tuners, even if they Speak Chinese. I Traded an Ol' Black LP, ['60s] for the Casino., cuz my giggin' ax was a '70 335 w/Bigsby, and I needed a Back-up ax.. STILL, ALL the P-93 LIT says Gold Grovers--- I was Kinda PO-ed, But all in all, th' P-93 is a Great Ax. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hungrycat Posted April 3, 2010 Share Posted April 3, 2010 I have some Grover brand Kluson copies on a Les Paul. They have a higher ratio than standard Klusons. You could look into that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildmann Posted April 3, 2010 Author Share Posted April 3, 2010 I think that WD music has Klusons that are Cast, but LOOK like, and have the same footprint as stamped Klusons. Ya kin even get 'em with Keystone buttons!! However,[un-Fortunately] ya still hafta drill out the rear of the headstock with a 27/64 drill,to accomodate the cast[extra] width. Fortunately, I have a Chinese Drill Press, for Just Such occasions. I have Drilled out Many a headstock, BUT--I still don't ENJOY IT!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hungrycat Posted April 3, 2010 Share Posted April 3, 2010 I have Drilled out Many a headstock' date=' BUT--I still don't ENJOY IT!! [/quote'] Then don't drill. Get a reamer. http://www.stewmac.com/shop/Tools/Special_tools_for:_Tuner_installation/Peghole_Reamers.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RSDx Posted April 3, 2010 Share Posted April 3, 2010 Tuners are overanal-ized, imo ..... I've never had a problem with any tuners, on even the cheapest of guitars .... proper nut "cut," proper saddle "cut," and proper string winding technique are paramount. Tuners are small potatos, in the scheme of things .... Frankie says "RELAX...." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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