Swirl & Scratch Removal Question

[bluezguy]

It's been a month now that me and my Dot-Reissue Figured have been courtin' & sparkin'. It's just recently begun to bug me but, the guys at GC, where the guitar came from, use all kinds of cloth material to clean the showroom guitars.

 

They don't care about how abrasive the cloth is they use to remove fingerprints, sweat, sneezes etc...

When admiring my baby under lights, I can see the swirl marks of their efforts.

 

What do any of you more anal retentive types use to remove these human incurred flaws? I got stuff for the paint on my Harleys - I got stuff for my windshields on the truck.

What about Nitro finishes on wood??

[j45nick]

You might want to visit the Virtuoso website, and review the specifications on their two products: Virtuoso Cleaner and Virtuoso Polish.

 

I use these extensively for finish restoration (Cleaner) and maintenance (Polish). Fine scratch removal depends very much on the polishing technique as well as the polishing cloth and the polishing medium. In this case, "polishing" is a bit of a misnomer, in that it is the Virtuoso Cleaner that can be used for scratch minimization and removal, while the Polish is used to restore gloss and protect the surface.

 

The Cleaner should not be used on a regular basis as a maintenance product, IMHO.

[Guest EastEnder]

I've finished a number of raw T- and S-style bodies in nitrocellulose and I could tell you what I use in the final buffing stages, but I have a very good idea of how thick my clear coats have become. The danger of even the finest abrasives is cutting through the clear. I have no clue as to how thin the Gibson nitro clearcoats are.

 

If it were my guitar I'd run it over to a good luthier, get it buffed out and start from scratch, as it were.

 

You'll probably hear all sorts of recommendations of Meguiar's, 3M, Virtuoso, inter alia. Judicious use of such products can do the trick, but great care and skilled hands are required.

 

— And the uncaring, sales-motivated morons at GC can go to hell. They're not qualified to clean a windshield.

[j45nick]

I've finished a number of raw T- and S-style bodies in nitrocellulose and I could tell you what I use in the final buffing stages, but I have a very good idea of how thick my clear coats have become. The danger of even the finest abrasives is cutting through the clear. I have no clue as to how thin the Gibson nitro clearcoats are.

 

If it were my guitar I'd run it over to a good luthier, get it buffed out and start from scratch, as it were.

 

You'll probably hear all sorts of recommendations of Meguiar's, 3M, Virtuoso, inter alia. Judicious use of such products can do the trick, but great care and skilled hands are required.

 

— And the uncaring, sales-motivated morons at GC can go to hell. They're not qualified to clean a windshield.

 

 

I don't disagree with anything you say. A professional buff-out using a large, slow wheel is the best solution for most surfaces. Electrics like the 335 may require hand-buffing of most parts of the top due to the hardware. Patience and persistence will be rewarded in any case. There are no shortcuts to proper cosmetic maintenance.

 

Hand-buffing using non-abrasive products like Virtuoso pose modest risk of damage to a nitro surface, but you do have to exercise judgment. Vigorous rubbing on a single scratch can cut through a finish quite quickly. It is rare that 100% of even tiny scratches can be removed. Some will inevitably be deeper than others. Removing 90% of the scratches is a very, very good result that can dramatically improve an instrument cosmetically.

[strat-o-steve]

I have used 3M Scratch and Swirl remover several times. If you use a clean cotton rag and do the job by hand, you will have to work hard to burn through the clear coat. Even then, it would likely be on sharp corners. I have never had a problem using 3M. The finish is quite hard, and it really doesn't remove that much. I know, cause you have to really work at it to remove visible scratches ;) If it isn't too bad, you could ignore the swirls. If it bugs you, the 3M will work just fine. It goes on like a white liquid paste that you rub in circles until the paste dries to a powder, like wax, then you flip your rag over and rub off the residue :)

[Guest EastEnder]

I have used 3M Scratch and Swirl remover several times.

 

"Several times?" Your clear coat is slowly eroding.

 

My advice to the original poster would be to do a one-time job as described above then perform occasional finish maintenance using high-quality, non-abrasive, silicone-free polish and microfiber cloths.

 

No further scouring needed.

 

Respectfully.

 

EE

[sok66]

Over time I've stopped using anything but Martin guitar polish on any of my instruments, and then only infrequently. Bear in mind I'm not particularly put off by normal wear & tear or signs of use on guitars, as it adds character and to me looks better than squeaky-shiny-of-the-line new. But, to each his own.

 

For certain, never use a polish that includes any form of silicone, like some furniture polishes, etc. If you have a particularly grungy looking one, with caked on grime & sweat, beer, etc., pure naptha (lighter fluid) on a terry cloth rag works great as a first step. Use in a well ventilated place and well away from any ignition source. After you get the worst of it off, try using a clean rag moistened with warm water to shine it up a bit. After that step I've had great luck using Meguiar's professional detailing products, especially their #9 Swirl Remover on an otherwise good finish. Got the tip about Meguiar's products from Dan Erlwine's book many years ago. Barry Meguiar is a guitar fan, as well as a car nut. I had great results using Meguiars fine cut cleaner on an ES345 that had been damaged in a house fire and suffered both smoke and water damage. I stripped it completely, cleaned it as per the above, then used a small orbital buffer on the finish with the fine cut, then successively less abrasive polishes. Looked fantastic afterwards. Cleaning the individual components took forever, and anyone who wants to R&R a 345's pots & Varitone components should do deep breathing & yoga first.

[guitarosaur]

I've gotten good results using plastic polish, which was created to take out scratches from convertible tops' rear plastic windows.

[AlanC]

Hi guys. Very interesting topic. I use Gibson polish on a day to day basis with either a gibson soft cloth or a micro fibre glass cloth.

 

However when I've had marks that I couldn't get out, I've used, VERY sparingly a car polish called 'Nu Finish Once a year car polish'. My tech who is really great put me onto the stuff. I've used it on my 1948 ES 150 for stunning results. I use this guitar as an example because of its great condition and the fact that I wouldn't take any risks with it. I also find that its good to get rid of the 'sticky neck' problem.

 

So when using it, I use a Gibson soft cloth. I apply a little bit of the polish to the cloth and then gently rub it on and then use a clean soft cloth to take it off. Not too much rubbing!! And in fact you don't need to rub much. I use very little of the polish. Its great for removing dulling caused by sweat.

 

The good news is this works.

 

I have a few arch tops with floating bridges and one time I accidentally moved the bridge on my L4 and it scratched the top of the guitar quite noticeably. I used a small about of the polish and the scratches were gone.

 

Good luck.

[Guest EastEnder]

Hi guys. Very interesting topic. I use Gibson polish on a day to day basis with either a gibson soft cloth or a micro fibre glass cloth.

 

However when I've had marks that I couldn't get out, I've used, VERY sparingly a car polish called 'Nu Finish Once a year car polish'. My tech who is really great put me onto the stuff. I've used it on my 1948 ES 150 for stunning results. I use this guitar as an example because of its great condition and the fact that I wouldn't take any risks with it. I also find that its good to get rid of the 'sticky neck' problem.

 

So when using it, I use a Gibson soft cloth. I apply a little bit of the polish to the cloth and then gently rub it on and then use a clean soft cloth to take it off. Not too much rubbing!! And in fact you don't need to rub much. I use very little of the polish. Its great for removing dulling caused by sweat.

 

The good news is this works.

 

I have a few arch tops with floating bridges and one time I accidentally moved the bridge on my L4 and it scratched the top of the guitar quite noticeably. I used a small about of the polish and the scratches were gone.

 

Good luck.

 

As far as I know, Nu Finish is a silicone-based product. It certainly looks good on cars, but conventional wisdom would suggest not using it on nitrocellulose lacquer. I believe it's quite abrasive, too.

 

Sorry.

 

EE

[AlanC]

1330748043[/url]' post='1139509']

As far as I know, Nu Finish is a silicone-based product. It certainly looks good on cars, but conventional wisdom would suggest not using it on nitrocellulose lacquer. I believe it's quite abrasive, too.

 

Sorry.

 

EE

Hi EastEnder,

Sorry to disagree but my comments are not based on theory, I've used the stuff. It works and is not severe. I do accept the point that you should not use much of it and don't rub too much or too hard.

I have lots of guitars and I'm extremely fussy and I wouldn't use anything that put them at risk. The polish works! The proof is in the eating!!

 

 

 

[j45nick]

Hi EastEnder,

Sorry to disagree but my comments are not based on theory, I've used the stuff. It works and is not severe. I do accept the point that you should not use much of it and don't rub too much or too hard.

I have lots of guitars and I'm extremely fussy and I wouldn't use anything that put them at risk. The polish works! The proof is in the eating!!

 

I hate to tell you, but EastEnder is correct. Nu Finish is silicone-based. Just go on their website. Yes, it will do a really nice job on your guitar, and it will cover up any nitro "stickiness" with a nice, slippery film of silicone.

 

Just hope you never have to do any finish touchup. If you do, you will need to solvent-wash any areas that have come in contact with the Nu Finish. It takes very little silicone to contaminate a surface, and lacquer is notoriously sensitive to this type of contamination. Nu Finish says that as long as a car surface isn't freshly polished, you should be able to paint it. That implies a fairly small amount of silicone. But it's there, and you need to be aware of it.

 

The very properties that make silicones so great in some ways make them a real headache when it comes to refinishing.

[bill67]

I use Zaino products on every thing I have guitars and fret boards,guns, cars,their not cheap but is easy to use and really makes stuff smooth and shiney.

[AlanC]

I hate to tell you, but EastEnder is correct. Nu Finish is silicone-based. Just go on their website. Yes, it will do a really nice job on your guitar, and it will cover up any nitro "stickiness" with a nice, slippery film of silicone.

 

Just hope you never have to do any finish touchup. If you do, you will need to solvent-wash any areas that have come in contact with the Nu Finish. It takes very little silicone to contaminate a surface, and lacquer is notoriously sensitive to this type of contamination. Nu Finish says that as long as a car surface isn't freshly polished, you should be able to paint it. That implies a fairly small amount of silicone. But it's there, and you need to be aware of it.

 

The very properties that make silicones so great in some ways make them a real headache when it comes to refinishing.

 

Hi j45nick,

 

Thanks for your comments. So assuming that the NuFinish does have some silicone in it and as you say it does improve the look of the guitar including dealing with sticky neck. However, I was not suggesting to use Nu Finish unless you have a problem. What I did say is that I use Gibson polish to clean my guitars. In fact that sorts out keeping the guitar looking clean and new.

 

But I would ask you how many resprays do you need to do? I've had a number of Gibsons since 1972 and in that time I've resprayed once and only a neck. The other time I needed to respray, Gibson replaced the guitar free of charge. As I said Nu Finish can sort out a problem but I'm not suggesting to use it for anything else. The scratches on my L4 were very noticeable. Now I can't see them and the guitar looks great. Am I likely to need to respray it? The answer is no and even if I had to I'm not sure that I would have a problem. Certainly my tech doesn't think so particularly given that if I need to respray he will do it.

[brantobrien]

Hi j45nick,

 

Thanks for your comments. So assuming that the NuFinish does have some silicone in it and as you say it does improve the look of the guitar including dealing with sticky neck. However, I was not suggesting to use Nu Finish unless you have a problem. What I did say is that I use Gibson polish to clean my guitars. In fact that sorts out keeping the guitar looking clean and new.

 

But I would ask you how many resprays do you need to do? I've had a number of Gibsons since 1972 and in that time I've resprayed once and only a neck. The other time I needed to respray, Gibson replaced the guitar free of charge. As I said Nu Finish can sort out a problem but I'm not suggesting to use it for anything else. The scratches on my L4 were very noticeable. Now I can't see them and the guitar looks great. Am I likely to need to respray it? The answer is no and even if I had to I'm not sure that I would have a problem. Certainly my tech doesn't think so particularly given that if I need to respray he will do it.

 

I relunctantly agree with you on the merits of holding off on a polishing product because of a future refinish. From what I've heard and seen very few people actually refinish a Gibson (perhaps on broken necks???). I'm sure that there are some that do, but it's not typical. Personally though, even in spite of not ever desiring to refinish any part of my guitars, I won't be using any product that potentially has silicone in it. Products are readily available that do a fantastic job (Virtuoso, 3M, etc) and relatively harmless when used correctly.

 

To the OP, virtuoso is great. Follow the directions and see what happens. You should be happy when you're done.

[roadhog96]

I've used the Harley scratch and swirl remover, the 3M scratch remover they all work fine and you can't tell any diffetence from one or another. I pretty much just use the Virtuoso polish now mainly because I bought some to try and I still have plenty left and a little goes a long way. I don't see were the guitar finish looks any different than using any other product. I guess you should use what ever one smells the best to you because they all work and they all stink.

[jt335]

The best polish I've used is D'pergo. http://www.dpergoguitars.com/index.html. It may not help with the scratches, but as a polish it's great. It can be used an all parts of the guitar: neck, metal and plastic.