Epiphone AJ200SCE

[MediaMan]

I am looking into picking up an inexpesive solid top cutaway acoustic/electric - kind of a back-porch, campfire, knock-around, practice acoustic I can have some fun with (the serious Taylor is staying in the house).

 

I am looking at the Epi AJ200SCE and the Fender CD140SCE (w/Fishman Presys). Same price ($300 CDN)

 

1) Is the Epi (a jumbo?), larger or smaller than a dreadnaught?

 

2) Any happy ( or unhappy) owners?

[Manfred33]

I own an AJ220SCE and am very happy with it for the price. It has a great sound, one of the reasons i picked it when I was trying acoustics, and the electronics are very nice, as is the built in tuner. I see that they updated the electronics on the new models, so hopefully they are just as good if not better.

 

It is a jumbo, since the "AJ" in "AJ200SCE" stands for "Advanced Jumbo"....

[GuitarLight]

Hi, I own The Epiphone AJ220SCE in Vintage Sunburst, and I am thrilled with it. I consider i to be a much nicer guitar than Fender for the price..in fact it is a steal in my opinion. It is an Advanced Jumbo Solid spruce Top cut away acoustic electric ...but It is considered by most people today as a "slope shoulder dreadnought", and very close in size to a normal dred. It's shape and fit, sitting in your lap, l find it amazingly comfortable....more comfortable than a standard dred...probably the most comfortable of all guitars to play..and it produces a very sweet, very clear, very clean tone. The neck you will find amazing....almost exactly as clean and easy to play as any Taylor with a slim taper D profile in non stick satin...butter smooth up and down the neck. In fact I was amazed that the neck was so delicious..one of the best necks I own..and I've owned 5 high end Taylors and 5 high end Martins. They have nothing on the 220's neck. ..I found mine in a Guitar Center show room and could not leave without it. The action is perfect, very low, and easy to play. After 18 months of owning it..I am to this day amazed at its wonderful look, sound, tone, and quality for just $299. ....You will need new strings for sure and they made a HUGE difference instantly for me. I use Elixir nanoweb 80/20 lights (.12-.53)...or Elixir PB's for a deeper PB sound. I also removed the plastic pins and replaced them with a nice set of black ebony wood MOP tipped bridge pins, available in most music stores or online at MF, and together they make this a guitar that sounds and looks so good you will be hard pressed to call it a beater or camp guitar. If you find one in a GC show room you could try it out. Some say you need to find the right one...I did find it..and value it every bit as much as my other guitars..its full gloss finish is flawless, and the burst..just beautiful...but its the TONE that hooked me....because with new strings and a good set up ..you just won't believe what you are hearing. Take a look at this short AJ220sce video...what you see is what you get...and what you hear...is what you actually get. Good luck!

[MediaMan]

Thanks for the valuable info. They both seem like good values. I am more inclined to go with the Epiphone, as Fender just doesn't have the track record, tradition, reputation, etc Still, it's a interesting option, and gets really good reviews .. Also looking at Seagull Entourage cutaway for absolute $150 more, but that's a slippery slope.

 

Read about the bridge pins in a few reviews, so that's a non-issue - easy enough to change out. Are the ones shown here the correct size to fit the Aj220sce?? :

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/accessories/planet-waves-ebony-bridge-end-pin-set?CJAID=10684459&CJPID=5696037

[GuitarLight]

Thanks for the valuable info. They both seem like good values. I am more inclined to go with the Epiphone, as Fender just doesn't have the track record, tradition, reputation, etc Still, it's a interesting option, and gets really good reviews .. Also looking at Seagull Entourage cutaway for absolute $150 more, but that's a slippery slope.

 

Read about the bridge pins in a few reviews, so that's a non-issue - easy enough to change out. Are the ones shown here the correct size to fit the Aj220sce?? :

http://www.musicians...9&CJPID=5696037

MediaMan..yes those are the same MF Planet waves ebony pins I used on my 220, except I had selected white pearl in the tops for a few more bucks. I also use them on my Epi Hummingbird, and Masterbilts and they fit.

[MediaMan]

PINS - Thanks for the confirmation.

 

SADDLE - Did you end up changing out the plastic compensated saddle to tusq or bone? If so, is there an easy swap-out option or does one need to shape and file the new saddle to work?

 

CASE - Did you end up with one? Perhaps not even worth it ; at most I would consider a generic soft case if the Epi would not fit in any of my existing cases.

 

 

The only remaining concerns would be the cautions from MF/Amazon posts (some surprisingly quite recent). Proper humidication and setup would seem to address most of these, but there are some quality control issues there. Then again, its a $300 guitar :)

 

Sept 2013 - Surprised to see several blemishes and scratches .. After playing it a few days, I decided I could live with it even though the fret ends were not dressed properly, I will need to have some work done to it.

 

June 2013 - Love the sound, but my quality of build was poor. When I received mine the plug in jack on back of guitar was not assembled correctly and unscrewed, hanging out of guitar.

 

June 2011 - It needs very minor adjustment (humidify it a day or so with a damp sponge in the case) such as smooth the fret ends with the right type file (cheap to buy from StewMac), deepen the nut slots carefully (most folks should have a luthier do this), oil the fretboard and bridge wood, clean off the frets and change strings last. I took out some neck relief and tune mine to 1/2 step low and then let 1/8 turn out if needed to get just enough neck relief to stop rattles.

 

Mar 2011 -When it arrived it was completely unplayable. The bridge was set too low, and the frets were unleveled and peeling up from the bevels. Got the exchange delivered a few days ago..

 

Jan 2011- I have had nothing but problems. ... high e string the thinest one, from the 5th fret on down to the 13th fret the notes are dead and sound exactly the same pitch....slight crack forming in it at the 1st fret, ... but multiple dead notes on a product name I have grown to love and trust since 2004 is unacceptable. What happened to the quality of Epiphone? See : http://forum.gibson.com/index.php?/topic/61626-huge-problem-with-indonesian-aj220sce/

[GuitarLight]

PINS - Thanks for the confirmation.

 

SADDLE - Did you end up changing out the plastic compensated saddle to tusq or bone? If so, is there an easy swap-out option or does one need to shape and file the new saddle to work?

 

CASE - Did you end up with one? Perhaps not even worth it ; at most I would consider a generic soft case if the Epi would not fit in any of my existing cases.

 

 

The only remaining concerns would be the cautions from MF/Amazon posts (some surprisingly quite recent). Proper humidication and setup would seem to address most of these, but there are some quality control issues there. Then again, its a $300 guitar :)

 

Sept 2013 - Surprised to see several blemishes and scratches .. After playing it a few days, I decided I could live with it even though the fret ends were not dressed properly, I will need to have some work done to it.

 

June 2013 - Love the sound, but my quality of build was poor. When I received mine the plug in jack on back of guitar was not assembled correctly and unscrewed, hanging out of guitar.

 

June 2011 - It needs very minor adjustment (humidify it a day or so with a damp sponge in the case) such as smooth the fret ends with the right type file (cheap to buy from StewMac), deepen the nut slots carefully (most folks should have a luthier do this), oil the fretboard and bridge wood, clean off the frets and change strings last. I took out some neck relief and tune mine to 1/2 step low and then let 1/8 turn out if needed to get just enough neck relief to stop rattles.

 

Mar 2011 -When it arrived it was completely unplayable. The bridge was set too low, and the frets were unleveled and peeling up from the bevels. Got the exchange delivered a few days ago..

 

Jan 2011- I have had nothing but problems. ... high e string the thinest one, from the 5th fret on down to the 13th fret the notes are dead and sound exactly the same pitch....slight crack forming in it at the 1st fret, ... but multiple dead notes on a product name I have grown to love and trust since 2004 is unacceptable. What happened to the quality of Epiphone? See : http://forum.gibson....esian-aj220sce/

No I did not change out the saddle or nut, as I was satisfied with the natural sound the installed plastic saddle and nut produced. Be advised that a bone or tusk saddle and nut, on a "laminated" guitar can make it sound shrill and piercing because it forces the solid top to work harder while the laminated sides and back move in a more limited fashion. This can result in over working the spruce top, causing it to sound shrill and even harsh to the ear for some people. I do keep the 220 in a case which I already had from a previous guitar which I sold....it does have a solid top, and it is best kept humidified....at about 45% to 55%...on a hygrometer (walmarts) But a normal night of playing it at a campfire or other high or low humidity levels will not harm it...but prolonged humidity control in a case would be advised if you don't want the top or neck to move out of line over time. Any problems you are experiencing with it would probably be quickly fixed with a set up...well worth the money. (fret leveling, saddle height, neck adjust)--- Remember that many guitars, if not most, even the $2000 acoustic guitars usually require a set up..costing about $50.00 at a guitar center or other luthier. This set up will fine tune the guitar for the best playing. Also if there are defects you can not live with..send it back and get another. I once did this 3 times for an Epiphone Masterbilt DR-500mce Masterbilt until I got the right one.

[MediaMan]

GuitarLight - Really appreciate you sharing your experience and advice. Thanks again. Point taken re saddle - there is only so much one should change out of these type of guitars.

 

Over lunch I saw and played one at a local dealer. I had played the ebony before in passing, but now that I am more serious, was looking for one in natural - found it , and ya, pretty nice! Its perfect for what I want it for.

 

Based on serial number, it was brand new - June 2013 and made in Indonesia (Factory Code 23). It was a bit buzzy but that's easily fixed. Could not find the Fender to compare. I did play a Yamaha FCX700SC, which was quite good to be fair, but I have no desire to own a Yamaha.

 

I did not walk out with it as I prefer to purchase all my guitars from my regular dealer who will order one in, inspect it on arrival better than I can, send it back if its too much out of whack), so a setup etc.

 

I dont know what stock strings it comes with (I will confirm but guessing uncoated D'adarrios PB lights??) but I will leave them on for reference before changing them out...and will add in the new PW ebony pins at that time as well.

 

Its amazing how one gets just as excited about a new $300 guitar as a new $3000 one!!

[MediaMan]

What strings do the AJ220SCE come with? Couldn't find it on the web site.

 

- Dadarrio or Elixir?

- Coated or Uncoated?

- PB or 80/20?

- Medium or Light?

 

They will of course get changed out, but as a reference, its good to know what I am listening to out of the box.

[GuitarLight]

What strings do the AJ220SCE come with? Couldn't find it on the web site.

 

- Dadarrio or Elixir?

- Coated or Uncoated?

- PB or 80/20?

- Medium or Light?

 

They will of course get changed out, but as a reference, its good to know what I am listening to out of the box.

 

The Epi 220SCE normally comes shipped with light gauge non coated Gibson Masterbilt phosphor bronze strings (.12 to .53) ...Those have a feel of being heavier but they are not. On my 220SCE I use... Elixir 80/20 nanoweb lights (.12 to .53) So if you take a close listen to it when you get it.....you should be hearing factory Phosphor bronze strings...lower and deep, pretty rich sounding. I find PB's not quite as clear as 80/20's, which to my ear sound crisp, pure, and clean without the overtones of PB's. I find the amp also likes 80/20 better for clarity of the reproduction of notes. ...PB's equal sort of fuzzy deep and rich and three dimensional in tone,which can equate to "mumbly" on an amp to my ear.......80/20's equal brightness, clarity, and clean precise notes. Both good..just depends what you are looking for. I understand that the 220SCE also sounds good with ultra light strings if you use the amp exclusively, but for acoustic richness and beauty, the regular lights should do for both. I would not recommend using medium strings, nor should you need them. Elixirs will be brilliant out of the box and they will play easily, and have all the depth and tone of mediums. Lights will also reduce the stress on the top as they hold less poundage pressure then mediums. Many people use lights (.12 to .53) on every guitar because they sound and play so well without the added finger stress that mediums often give. Elixirs do indeed last 5 to 10 times longer than other strings. My 220 presently has its Elixir strings on for 18 months. They could use a change now, but no rush, they still sound pretty good. Of course any string you choose is your choice, I'm not pushing Elixirs, its just that I do use them on all 6 of my guitars, and have used them for over 10 years. Very satisfied with them.

[Manfred33]

I guess I will delve further into this topic and share my experience with my AJ220.... As I said, I am pretty happy with this guitar and how it sounds. It is not a Martin or Taylor and I know what i paid for it so I am happy with the sound I am getting for the price. I think it sounds pretty damn good, but I have also never played a higher priced guitar, so ignorance is bliss, right?

 

Anyways, when I bought my Epi brand new from a Guitar Center, everything seemed fine, until i started trying to play something that had me playing higher up on the neck and I ended up noticing that the octave E on the 6th string, 12th fret was sharp compared to the open E. This wasn't the case on the other strings, at least not as obvious.... I took it to a Sam Ash that is an authorized Epi service center and has one of the best guitar techs in the Atlanta area- he was widely espoused as being the best, and I would tend to agree based on my interaction with him... Anyways, he agreed with me as far as there being a bit of a problem, so he conferred with Gibson and they said send the guitar in, which he did. Some time later on, i got a brand new guitar. I thought, that's great, what a company!! But, after some playing up the neck i again noticed the same problem, which was baffling, that two different guitars would have the same issue.

 

Now, again, i know that this is a $300 guitar, and it is not going to be perfect nor is it going to play in tune on all parts of the neck, but when I brought this new guitar back into Sam Ash, the tech again agreed with my assessment. This time, he did some of his own work on the guitar and replaced the bridge, which he felt was the problem. After that, he thought it sounded a bit better, but still wasn't satisfied and elected to again send the guitar back to Gibson. This time, they were less than friendly about things and even I was surprised at their tone when I spoke with them. They were basically arrogant and talked to me like i was an idiot and how dare I suggest that a guitar manufactured by Gibson/Epiphone have some kind of flaw.... They even went so far as to say that the guitar tech had installed the bridge backwards.... I found that laughable. Anyways, this time they did NOT send me another new guitar. They tested the guitar and found that there was nothing wrong with it and said have a nice day. Of course, it had a new bridge on it and new strings and had been set up, so yeah, i can see that they would think there was nothing wrong with it, except they accused the tech of installing the bridge backwards so.... I don't know. I am still happy with the guitar. Next time, i won't buy a guitar from Guitar Center though, if I have my choice it will be from a Sam Ash.

 

On a side note, the tech put on a set of Cleartones strings and WOW, they sound awesome. I highly recommend those bad boys....

 

Hope this doesn't dampen your resolve to purchase an Epi MediaMan..... Just my side story and like i said, I am still very satisfied with the guitar for the money i paid and would buy another Epi again....

[MediaMan]

MediaMan..yes those are the same MF Planet waves ebony pins I used on my 220, except I had selected white pearl in the tops for a few more bucks. I also use them on my Epi Hummingbird, and Masterbilts and they fit.

 

I ordered the AJ220SCE from my regular dealer ( bought many before over the last few years so he knows me well) asking he put on fresh set of Elixir 80/20 lights and the Planet wave pins. It's ready for pickup HOWEVER he didn't change out the pins (yet) as they noticed the low E hole would have to be enlarged a bit, and want to ensure the guitar was other ok by me. Did you find any such issue? Could of course be the variance from guitar to guitar at this price point.

[GuitarLight]

I ordered the AJ220SCE from my regular dealer ( bought many before over the last few years so he knows me well) asking he put on fresh set of Elixir 80/20 lights and the Planet wave pins. It's ready for pickup HOWEVER he didn't change out the pins (yet) as they noticed the low E hole would have to be enlarged a bit, and want to ensure the guitar was other ok by me. Did you find any such issue? Could of course be the variance from guitar to guitar at this price point.

 

I have found that issue on several other guitars, but not on my 220. The low E being the thickest string takes up more space. The pin needs only to be ground down on the side where the divot is to allow more space for the low E. I use a pliers to hold the pin tightly wrapped with a cloth over the head (to protect the pin head from being marred) where the pliers is holding it. Then I take a small drill bit, and slightly bore or shave the side of the ebony pin just enough that it fits in with the E string..Ebony is very hard and drilling may require pressure to remove some of it....I have also successfully solved this problem by inter-switching pins...trying pins in other holes..sometimes they fit...unless the hole in your guitar is actually too small, I would not alter it, I would alter the wooden pin just enough so that it goes in. Perhaps your dealer could alter the pin for you....having the tools and knowledge to do so. I have done this successfully for years, to many guitars including..Martins, Gibsons, etc...in order to accommodate a stubborn ebony pin. That altered pin is then always used on that same hole during string change. Pins are funny things....sometimes they fit perfect..sometimes not. But unless the hole of your guitar is actually smaller and was drilled wrong, I would not alter it, I would simply alter the ebony pin...and this is very easy to do by boring its divoted side where the E string lays against while you are inserting it. It can easily be drilled the full length of the pin just enough to insert it. It will not harm or weaken the pin if done correctly. I have never had an altered ebony pin fail even with 20 years of continuous use....ask him to do it. Tell him to bore or thin out the side of the ebony pin enough only that it will go in the hole with the string. Good luck.

[MediaMan]

OK, I picked it up to try out before dealing with the pin issue.

 

Gotta say, I do love it - exactly what I was looking for in this type of guitar. Love playing it it, holding it, admiring it:). No glaring flaws in the finish or the frets. At this price point, I didn't even want to look that close:). Just picked it up and started playing. Very comfortable. The neck is absolutely great. It plays nice and easy (light strings are a joy). Its really quite suitable fort soft fingerstlye, picking and moderate strumming. On this guitar, I don't use a pick and its bright with 80/20;s and I like to mellow it out a bit with my fingers. Sustain is decent as well. Lot of potential. Great style, love the cutaays, nice electronics, solid top - man this is a good deal - period.

 

If I attack it to hard I start to hear some string buzz - but action is nice and low and with light strings which vibrate more than the mediums I am used to, so some such buzzing not a surprise - I can tweak it out over time if I wanted to. Also everything is new (wood, strings. room, etc), so I want touch anything just yet.

 

So, very happy with the purchase. Doesn't compare with my high-end Taylor on tone or volume but it wasnt intended to. This is the fun one that I wont be afraid to take out of the house at 1/10th the price. Lots of potential here

 

On the pins, good advice not to play wit hteh pins, not the guitar, I ahd hoped I could just buy and use the PW set and be done with any need for drills, files etc. but I guess I will deal with it on the next string change. Thanks for your post of how to do this - now I have it for safe keeping.

 

[MediaMan]

GuitarLight - forgive my ignorance but there are 8 pins in the PW package - 7 are normal size - one is huge/oversized - what is the purpose of that one???

[wiggy]

GuitarLight - forgive my ignorance but there are 8 pins in the PW package - 7 are normal size - one is huge/oversized - what is the purpose of that one???

 

Endpin?

[GuitarLight]

GuitarLight - forgive my ignorance but there are 8 pins in the PW package - 7 are normal size - one is huge/oversized - what is the purpose of that one???

 

 

Wiggy is correct. That large pin is the end pin which would be used used at the bottom of the guitar if there were not an electric input. You won't need that pin for this guitar since it does have an electric input. Just dis-regard it, or save it for a different guitar where it might be used. You hare given 7 other normal pins..one as a spare in case one gets lost or broken. Very nice looking guitar by the way!