Vladimir2014 Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Hi Everyone! I am new here. Sorry for my English, I'm Russian. I would like to buy gibson super 400. My question is about serial number. Does anyone have knowledge for "instrument rank" designation in S/N? According to "Blue Book of Electric Guitars Sixth Edition" last 3 digits in s/n "is the plant designation and/or instrument rank". Also the "Blue Book of Electric Guitars Sixth Edition" says that: "...Bozeman instruments began using 001-299 designations and, in 1990, Nashville instruments began using 300-999 designations. .." In different online shops I've seen gibson super 400 guitars with 001 and 002 designations in s/n. So it's unclear to me: does the lower number in certain range mean better quality? In other words, do guitars with different ranks have to have different quality? Thanks in advance. --------- (This is quote from "Blue Book of Electric Guitars Sixth Edition" (see attachment gibsonserialnumbers.pdf) : "In 1977, Gibson first introduced the serialization method that is in practice today. This updated system utilizes an impressed eight digit numbering scheme that covers both serializing and dating functions. The pattern is as follows: YDDDYPPP YY is the production year DDD is the day of the year PPP is the plant designation and/or instrument rank. The numbers 001-499 show Kalamazoo production, 500-999 show Nashville production. The Kalamazoo numbers were discontinued in 1984. When acoustic production began at the plant built in Bozeman, Montana (in 1989), the series' numbers were reorganized. Bozeman instruments began using 001-299 designations and, in 1990, Nashville instruments began using 300-999 designations. It should also be noted that the Nashville plant has not reached the 900s since 1977, so these numbers have been reserved for prototypes.") gibsonserialnumbers.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CR9 Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 In different online shops I've seen gibson super 400 guitars with 001 and 002 designations in s/n. So it's unclear to me: does the lower number in certain range mean better quality? In other words, do guitars with different ranks have to have different quality? YDDDYPPP YY is the production year DDD is the day of the year PPP is the plant designation and/or instrument rank. Welcome to the forum! The last numbers, as in the PPP in the above reference, are the order in which the guitars are produced for that one day. 001 is the first guitar made, 002 is the second guitar, and so on. The next day the serial numbers start at 001 again. It does not generally reflect the quality of the guitar. I say generally because serial number 001 may have some extra care than a higher serial number as it was made at the start of the day where some at the end of the day may be more hurriedly done. Serail number 001 is also a more desirable number for collectors. Essentially there there is no quality difference between the serial numbers, they just represent the order in which they were made similar to cars made on an assembly line. To answer your question, no, the number does not represent the quality. "Rank" in this case only means the order of production. The Gibson Custom Shop serial number do not follow this pattern. They run for the calendar year. A 1959 reissue will have a serial number starting with a 9, then a digit for the year and then the production sequence. So the first 59 reissue this year would be 9 4001. That number will repeat ever 10 years, so a 2004 guitar could be the same as a 2014. There are ways to tell the difference between the guitars but not by serial number. Sometimes they even go into 6 digits when the production goes over 999 guitars for the year. 9 4999 and then 941000. In the 5 digit serial number there should be a space between the 9 and 4 until the production goes over 999 guitars. 9 4001 then 941000. Hope that helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vladimir2014 Posted February 17, 2014 Author Share Posted February 17, 2014 ... Sometimes they even go into 6 digits when the production goes over 999 guitars for the year. 9 4999 and then 941000. In the 5 digit serial number there should be a space between the 9 and 4 until the production goes over 999 guitars. 9 4001 then 941000. Hope that helps. CR9, thank you for your time and comprehensive answer! It has really helped me! In my question I didn't mention that I'm looking for a new guitar. Actually, I've seen serial numbers of 4 new (2012-2013) gibson super 400 guitars in online shops. All of them have YDDDYPPP pattern of S/N. And it looks like all these new S/Ns implement combination of first and second patterns you've described. Because last 3 digits (like 001) in this case means that it was first guitar in that year, according second pattern. But first 4 digits (YDDDY) follow to the first pattern. it turns out that in 2013 gibson made about 3-4 super 400, because 3 of them are in online shops with numbers 001, 002 and 003. And last one (13183003) was made in 318 day of year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badbluesplayer Posted February 18, 2014 Share Posted February 18, 2014 CR9, thank you for your time and comprehensive answer! It has really helped me! In my question I didn't mention that I'm looking for a new guitar. Actually, I've seen serial numbers of 4 new (2012-2013) gibson super 400 guitars in online shops. All of them have YDDDYPPP pattern of S/N. And it looks like all these new S/Ns implement combination of first and second patterns you've described. Because last 3 digits (like 001) in this case means that it was first guitar in that year, according second pattern. But first 4 digits (YDDDY) follow to the first pattern. it turns out that in 2013 gibson made about 3-4 super 400, because 3 of them are in online shops with numbers 001, 002 and 003. And last one (13183003) was made in 318 day of year. The last 3 digits represent the "rank" of that guitar on that particular day of production, not the year of production. So the one with the 003 at the end was the third guitar made on that particular day, not during that year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vladimir2014 Posted February 18, 2014 Author Share Posted February 18, 2014 The last 3 digits represent the "rank" of that guitar on that particular day of production, not the year of production. So the one with the 003 at the end was the third guitar made on that particular day, not during that year. Thank you, you're absolutely right, but I thought that I had written exactly the same thing as you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmyl51 Posted February 18, 2014 Share Posted February 18, 2014 Vladmir, If you are trying to decide which Super 400 to buy by a serial number analysis in all honesty you are wasting your time IMHO. You are talking about the most expensive guitar that Gibson currently makes outside the Citation. The only way for you to figure out whether or not the guitar would meet your expectations would be to get an in hand,detailed inspection/description of the guitar over the telephone. Your English is very good so I don't believe that that would be a problem for you. However to decide if you would be happy with a Super 400 by choosing by a serial number sequence I believe would a major waste of time for you. I don't believe that Gibson has an authorized dealer in Moscow but I may be wrong too with that assumption. The next thing to do would be to find a Gibson dealer in Europe that could assist you with an in hand description before you would have the instrument shipped all the way to Russia IMHO. Bottom line is that there are not that many Super 400's out there in comparison say to a Les Paul. Good luck regardless! jim in Maine USA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vladimir2014 Posted February 19, 2014 Author Share Posted February 19, 2014 Jim, Thank you for your helpful tips and good wishes! Of course, I was not going to choose a guitar by a serial number analysis. But now it's clear to me that the "rank" has nothing to do with something like "quality sign". In fact, I'll try to get a US visa with friend of mine to visit themusiczoo.com music shop in New York. But if I don't get a visa, I will try to visit Thomann.de music shop in Germany. Because you were absolutely right about Russian distributors - there is no chance to find this guitar in Moscow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vladimir2014 Posted February 19, 2014 Author Share Posted February 19, 2014 I want to thank everybody once more for your attention and help. My question about "RANK" (RRR) was resolved. By the way, I've just found one more source that officially confirms previous replies. I should look here at first place : Here gibson says about Gibson Custom CARVED TOP MODELS that : ... Carved Top models (serial number on orange label) YDDDYRRR YY is the production year DDD is the day of the year RRR indicate the guitar's place in the sequence of carved tops made that day. NOTE - as of 2000, 1st digit will be a "2" Examples: 91418009 is the 9th carved top produced on the 141st day of 1998. 20045002 was the 2nd carved top stamped on the 4th day of 2005 ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny W. Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 It takes months to build an archtop guitar--the serial number just indicates the day it was completed. Danny W. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.