j45nick

Many cedars are distinctively aromatic (just like mahoganies and rosewoods), with different cedars fairly easily identifiable by their smells. You might try sanding a patch on the inside of the top and seeing what it smells like. After working with wood for more than 50 years, I can pretty much walk into a shop and tell what wood is being used just by the smell of the sawdust. Of course, if you smoke a lot, your sense of smell may be compromised.

I don't think so. You see cedar tops a fair amount on classical guitars. I have a Spanish-built Pavan classical with cedar top, ebony board and bridge, and rosewood back and sides. Don't think I'm going to try steel strings on it, however....

Here's a bit of background on the original Gibson Smeck models, just so you understand the origins: Roy Smeck guitars The modern Bozeman re-issues are all set up for "Spanish"-style playing (as oppose to Hawaiian lap-style playing". Here's a video of Roy Smeck playing one of his eponymous guitars Hawaiian style: Smeck on a Smeck If anything, Smeck was better known back in the day for his ukulele playing. And welcome aboard!

Nice one, ZW! I know you love vintage, but Bozeman has built (and continues to build) great guitars.

Not in any definitive way, to the best of my knowledge. Zombywoof might have more insight, since he's a bit of a vintage tuner geek (no insult intended). There used to be a website devoted to vintage tuner identification, but it no longer contains that information. I can't be sure without pulling off the tuners (which will have to wait for a string change), but as I remember, some of the earlier closed-backs have a "patent pending" stamp, much like early PAF pickups, while later versions actually have a patent number. The problem with tuners is that there was probably a big supply of nominally and functionally identical Klusons that were probably mixed together the factory at some point, so using them for purposes of dating a guitar could be risky.

That makes things more clear. The back braces in this period are what some of us call "knife edge" braces, because that are tall, thin, and tapered in section. The transition from fabric to wood side stays (the thin vertical inside supports with the scalloped ends) apparently happened at roughly the same time as the switch to the block logo. Apparently, sometime in late 1947 or early 1948, the characteristics that we see in your guitar, pretty much defining the J-45 of the late 40's-early 50's were finalized: belly-up bridge with slot-through saddle, closed-back single-line Klusons, block logo, tapered headstock, wood side stays rather than fabric, fattish full-C neck profile with nut width of about 1 11/16" (about 43mm) or just over that, small bridgeplate of either spruce or maple. If your guitar has an easy-to-read and clearly printed FON of 1017, that may date to very late 1947 or early 1948 by some sources. It could be one of the earliest examples we've seen with all those post-war characteristics in one guitar. Unfortunately, the actual Gibson FON sequences we read may be single-source that gets repeated as fact by other sources, leaving the impression that they are authoritative. Only the shipping ledgers tell the true tale. It would be nice if Gibson would digitize those shipping ledgers if they still exist. A lot of mysteries could be solved for a lot of people that really care about vintage Gibsons. It's no secret I'm a big fan of these particular guitars. One thing you have to be aware of when looking at them is that they are notorious for loose back braces because of the very small gluing area of that brace profile. If you have mysterious buzzes or ripples in the back, these braces are the most likely culprit. John Shults of True Vintage Guitar tells me he rarely sees one from this era without the same issue. Fortunately, that's an easy fix for a competent luthier. These guitars may lack the mystique of the banner Gibsons, but they epitomize Gibson output shortly after WW2. And they have classic vintage Gibson tone. In any case, you've found a great guitar. Enjoy it, and play the heck out of it. Experiment with strings until you find the sound you want, but don't do anything irreversible to the guitar. Do not replace the tuners. As my luthier says, all the tuners have to do is hold the strings to tension. I've developed a clean-up protocol for those tuners that makes them function well and look good, while maintaining their vintage appeal.

Congratulations! Play it, and enjoy.

The adjustable saddle allows you to raise/lower the action to fit your playing style. To take extreme examples, a shredder, a bluegrass flatpicker, and a ballad fingerpicker probably need very different setups with different action heights. The concept is appealing but the impact on tone can be significant. This impact may appeal to some people, but not to everyone. That impact depends very much on the material used for the adjustable saddle. Some of these originally were ceramic, others rosewood. Some of us who had them back in the 60's and 70's modified the rosewood saddle with bone inserts. In recent years, we have seen modern bone versions of the adjustable saddle as well. Some of the iconic acoustic rock recordings of the 60's were made on Gibsons with adjustable saddles. It's a good arrangement for folks who really like to chase different tone. Em7 here can chime in on this aspect, since he is a great one for tonal experimentation.

Look at the final recent comment from bobouz in the thread "how I ended up with a custom shop LG2..." It's an old thread, but his recent comment may be relevant to your search. You might also send him a private message if you want additional input.

An LG-2 (sunburst) or LG-3 (natural) would be a good choice as an all-around smallbody. I would pass on an LG-1 because it is ladder-braced rather than x-braced, but that's a matter of personal choice. If you don't like big necks, you may need to look for a later model, say after 1959. Not sure if the neck pattern followed the same timeline as the slope-J guitars, so this is a case of try before you buy. There are also very good modern re-issues of the LG, which you may want to consider. The modern re-issues will not have the potential "vintage" issues of an older guitar, so in some ways they are a safer bet unless you are comfortable evaluating the condition of an older guitar. You may well find a good used modern LG around your $2k budget. A good vintage one is likely to be a bit more.

Dave, what's that natural-top guitar in the lower middle with the parallelogram inlays?

I am also of a certain age (72), with old, often-stiff hands and frequently-aching shoulders. I still have several Gibson slope-J largebodies, but for sheer comfort sitting on the couch or in my office and playing, my Gibson L-00 Legend takes the cake. That is a reproduction of a 1937 L-00. These guitars, and their vintage counterparts, have a big voice for being small guitars. I bought the Legend after spending a year trying vintage equivalents, almost all of which had one issue or another that needed addressing before they were truly everyday players. In recent years, Gibson has done a number of different high-spec L-00 re-issues, most quite accurate reproductions, but without vintage problems. they aren't that common, but they are worth looking for if you want a smaller guitar that doesn't feel like a toy. I also have a couple of smaller travel-style guitars in both carbon fiber and more traditional construction. Those have their place, but they are no match for a "proper" small-body guitar that you can play anywhere, including performing for others.

These early post-war guitars are from a great period. The wartime shortages of wood and metal were over. The spruce that went into gliders during the war was available for soundboards, and straight-grain quarter-sawn Honduras mahogany that was used for such things as planking PT boats during the war was once again becoming the sides and backs of Gibsons (and Martins). The folk music boom of the late 50's and beyond had yet to develop, so the demand for guitars was still at rational levels, unlike the 60's and 70's where the goal was purely maximum output. The OP's guitar is a beautiful example from a wonderful time in Gibson's history. I hope he enjoys it for many years. I would call that one a keeper.

Non-banner script logos are typically '46, some into '47. Remember, its not like changes happened on January 1 of any year, or all changes happened at once. It's not unusual to see a mix of features at various points in time. The shipping ledgers would tell the tale. Zombywoof might know when Gibson switched from open-back tuners to the single-line Kluson Deluxe with lube hole, like the ones on the OP's guitar and my all-original '48-'49-'50 J-45.

Dating in that period is tricky, since sources disagree on FON numbers between 1947 and 1950. Generally, the belly-up bridge would say no earlier than 1948, despite the FON suggestion (by some sources ) as very late in 1947. I'm surprised at tapered rather than scalloped top braces. You don't usually see those until a bit later, like 1954. But this is Gibson, after all, you can't really expect absolute consistency. Does it have fabric vertical interior side stays on the inside of the rims, or wood? Made in USA on headstock says export model, tapered headstock probably ended late '51. Unfortunately, shipping ledgers from this period are not readily available and may have been lost, hence the ambiguity in FON sequence. For instance, by one nominally-authoritative source, the FON's on both my J-45's could be either 1948 or 1950. One of those is 3358, the other 3644. Their top sunbursts were quite different from each other. Realistically, J-45's from 1947-'51 are essentially the same guitar, in most cases, including the nice, fat neck. The tapered top braces in yours are unusual for that period.

Yep, I've got two 1949-50 J-45's, one of which I've had for more than 50 years. I happen to prefer a slightly warm tone, and am using DR Sunbeam round-core PB 12-54's. I use those on all four of my Gibson flat tops right now. Don't play out, so I don't use amplification. Tell us the Factory Order Number ink-stamped on the neck block inside, and we'll give you a good idea of when it was built. The alligator chipboard case you have was probably bought when the guitar was new. You may want to get a more substantial case if the guitar ever leaves your house. The J-45 did not come with a case back then. You bought it separately. For others on the forum, please note the position of the bridge pins in the bridge on this guitar. As on my guitars from this same period, the pins are set about 3/8" (10mm) forward of the back edge of the bridge, unlike their position on modern versions of the guitar. That's a really fine-looking guitar, without a lot of obvious playwear. It looks all-original, probably with replaced tuner buttons. Where did you find it?

Way to go, ZW! We knew you couldn't resist a bargain. That may be one of the least-known Bozeman models, so your thoughts will be appreciated. The question is what kind of pickguard to put on it, if you put one on. If you're just finger-picking with bare fingers, I'd be tempted to go nekkid.

I suppose that depends on whether or not you go in and buy it. It's hard to believe folks are standing in line to buy expensive American guitars in your neck of the woods. Did you ever measure the pin spacing?

It certainly looks like it.

JT has been spoiled by owning and/or playing the best of the best of banner Gibsons. He may well say "there is no substitute for 75-year-old wood." I suspect he is right, but the (almost) 70-year-old wood in my "new" 1950 J-45 may be a close second.

With that round lower bout, it looks more like the "old" L-1 body shape ( the Robert Johnson guitar), but the waist looks a lot wider. Photos can be deceiving, however.

That makes all the sense in the world. The saddle isn't a tight enough fit in the slot. No big deal. that saddle looks wide enough that it can be compensated if you have any intonation issues. They will probably send you a saddle that is slightly wider than the slot, so that the authorized shop can refine it for a tight fit. You should decide on the strings you want, and then have the shop adjust the relief and action to suit by adjusting the truss rod and the height of the saddle. Kudos to Gibson on this.

The real questions are: how does it play, and how does it sound? The action at the 12th is set exactly at the nominal factory recommendations. The high saddle doesn't bother me. The saddle has a small forward lean, which is not unusual, especially with a tall saddle.

New product development.

Sal, It's so good to hear you recording again. And yes, we want you even when you're not yourself, if there was ever any doubt about that.