charlie brown Posted August 29, 2013 Author Share Posted August 29, 2013 How many people have gotten worked up about it to the extent that you have? A handful? Not enough to justify the cost. The guitar market is extremely competitive now with the lingering economy (people need food to live, not guitars). Epiphone's done a GREAT job of improving quality and lowering prices. Let them slide on this one. Hey, I'm not "worked up," just curious. Haven't you ever wondered "out loud" as it were, why some things are done, they way they are? Especially, where there seems no real logic to it. They have done a great job, no one...least of all me, contends otherwise. But, some of us (maybe, as you say, not enough) would like them to go just that little bit extra distance, to make them (more) perfect versions, to the models they base their current guitars on. That's all. LOL If they'd tool for it, in the first place, it wouldn't really cost any more, or take any longer, to "do it right," than to do it "almost right." Besides, I like, and it's interesting to hear, other's take, on things like this. What's wrong with that?! :unsure: CB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie brown Posted August 31, 2013 Author Share Posted August 31, 2013 Examples, of the body shape differences, for those who aren't familiar: "Samick" Body shape: Curent, "Gibson" body shape, produced in China: CB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluemans335 Posted August 31, 2013 Share Posted August 31, 2013 Examples, of the body shape differences, for those who aren't familiar Not like it's particularly obvious. And you wonder why almost no one cares about it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie brown Posted August 31, 2013 Author Share Posted August 31, 2013 Not like it's particularly obvious. And you wonder why almost no one cares about it? To YOU, maybe...but other's of us, see the differences as "Glaring!" But, to each his/her own! CB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coz52 Posted August 31, 2013 Share Posted August 31, 2013 Noticing and caring are two entirely different things. Just sayin'..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie brown Posted August 31, 2013 Author Share Posted August 31, 2013 Noticing and caring are two entirely different things. Just sayin'..... Understood...not saying anyone should, or has to...necessarily. I Care...but, so what?! It is only a topic, to be "cussed and discussed." No big deal. CB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
russinator Posted August 31, 2013 Share Posted August 31, 2013 I "notice" that my 2013 Indonisian Epi Dot body is pretty much exactly as the sunbust pix in post #29 above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluemans335 Posted September 1, 2013 Share Posted September 1, 2013 To YOU, maybe...but other's of us, see the differences a "Glaring!" 'Us' being you and a couple other guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eggs Posted September 1, 2013 Share Posted September 1, 2013 Personally, I love my Korean Sheraton... But I'm currently 'channeling' an absent brother... & he wants you to know that, IHO, CB is totally on the money :unsure: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayyj Posted September 1, 2013 Share Posted September 1, 2013 I suspect as far as the average Sheraton customer is concerned, I doubt the majority notice a small difference in body shape or would care if they did. The same is likely true of Korean vs Chinese manufacture. This is probably the bottom line as to why Gibson don't have a problem turning to Unsung or whoever if the Chinese factory is backlogged or Unsung have a batch of Sheraton bodies they need to unload cheaply. But hey, debating small inconsequential differences in guitar manufacture as though they were a matter of life and death is what the internet was made for! Compared to the tiny differences between a modern Gibson Dot Reissue and an original 50s 335 the Korean Sheraton is way off, but there are people out there who won't buy a Dot Reissue until they get the shape 100% accurate. Looking at Charlie's demo images I also hate seeing a Gibson style vintage sunburst on a Sheraton, never looks right to my eyes... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluemans335 Posted September 1, 2013 Share Posted September 1, 2013 Here's something else for CB to rant about: have you tried to put a (big) Gibson batwing pickguard on an Epi G-400 with a (small) angelwing pickguard? You'll notice the the PU holes don't match up with the PU's, and that Epi has not been consistent with their PU placement over the years. There's got to be at least a dozen guys nationwide up in arms about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie brown Posted September 1, 2013 Author Share Posted September 1, 2013 Have a nice day, Bluesman... CB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cinos Repus Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 I'm definitely with CB on this. I MUCH prefer the Gibson style bodies that are being produced in China over the (IMO) ugly generic Korean ones. How big of a deal is it? Well I wouldn't own another Korean one with that body style. Bluemans335, I find it hilarious that you keep giving CB grief over his attention to detail when practically every post you make is some obsessive compulsive rant about the smallest details of the inner workings of pickups, which "only a handful of people" might care about. Good Day Sir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluemans335 Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 Bluemans335, I find it hilarious that you keep giving CB grief over his attention to detail when practically every post you make is some obsessive compulsive rant about the smallest details of the inner workings of pickups, which "only a handful of people" might care about. Yes, because my attention to detail is tone-related, not cosmetic. Big difference. And no, you need to visit some of the PU forums to see how many thousands and thousands of people obsess about details of PU's (I've been on the Duncan forum for years). There's many aftermarket PU manufacturers in this country and worldwide; they exist solely because of the tone quality of their products. I don't know where you've been to miss all that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie brown Posted September 5, 2013 Author Share Posted September 5, 2013 Well, since they're all made outside the good old USA, what actual country they're made in is not so important, really. It's only important (to me anyway), that they be made well, and consistent in spec's, so that there isn't one set of spec's, for Korea, another for China, and yet another for Japan (Elitist), and/or Nashville/Memphis (in the case of the special edition models, made there). The USA versions (as one would expect) and Japanese "Elitist" versions have by far, been the most accurate, to the originals. The recent Chinese versions would be a close 2nd, to those. The Korean versions, are very well built, great playing guitars, but have had "generic" Samick style bodies, which they're "tooled up for," with Epiphone headstocks. I know, after recent postings, that some here, don't feel that's any big deal. But, if it's supposed to be an "Epiphone," based on late '50's, and 60's USA Epiphone models, with all those familiar names, then it should be important, that they use the same spec's, all around, regardless of where they're made! IMHO... I would never say the Korean, or any other current Asian made Epi, is not a good, or even Great, product. Just that some aren't all that accurate, to the original Gibson Era versions, on which they're based. But, if it doesn't matter, why buy the "Epiphone" brand, at all. There are a LOT of similar priced brands, to choose from. It matters, because some of us still love Epiphone, especially the familar model names, we knew, from the Gibson era. There seems to be a few more, than myself, that have those similar feelings, so I hardly think I'm "all alone" in this. But, As Always...this is only my humble opinion, and observation(s). :) Cheers, CB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Zeplin Posted September 5, 2013 Share Posted September 5, 2013 Well, since they're all made outside the good old USA, what actual country they're made in is not so important, really. It's only important (to me anyway), that they be made well, and consistent in spec's, so that there isn't one set of spec's, for Korea, another for China, and yet another for Japan (Elitist), and/or Nashville/Memphis (in the case of the special edition models, made there). The USA versions (as one would expect) and Japanese "Elitist" versions have by far, been the most accurate, to the originals. The recent Chinese versions would be a close 2nd, to those. The Korean versions, are very well built, great playing guitars, but have had "generic" Samick style bodies, which they're "tooled up for," with Epiphone headstocks. I know, after recent postings, that some here, don't feel that's any big deal. But, if it's supposed to be an "Epiphone," based on late '50's, and 60's USA Epiphone models, with all those familiar names, then it should be important, that they use the same spec's, all around, regardless of where they're made! IMHO... I would never say the Korean, or any other current Asian made Epi, is not a good, or even Great, product. Just that some aren't all that accurate, to the original Gibson Era versions, on which they're based. But, if it doesn't matter, why buy the "Epiphone" brand, at all. There are a LOT of similar priced brands, to choose from. It matters, because some of us still love Epiphone, especially the familar model names, we knew, from the Gibson era. There seems to be a few more, than myself, that have those similar feelings, so I hardly think I'm "all alone" in this. But, As Always...this is only my humble opinion, and observation(s). :) Cheers, CB My belief is that they don't want to absorb the costs associated with retooling those factories. Any outlay of cash is a loss if there is little upside to it. It has happened before in Gibson's history when the LP was reintroduced in 1968. In 1969 due to customer requests for humbuckers they were told to do it without retooling. The '68 LP had P90s so that is when they used minihums from the Epiphone acqisition and the LP Deluxe was born. Simple economics in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie brown Posted September 5, 2013 Author Share Posted September 5, 2013 Yeah, I undestand that "retooling cost" to/profit ratio, probably wouldn't be worth it. And, it's only my personal quibble/wish, anyway. Epi will do what it wants/needs to do, regardless of what "I" think. LOL CB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Zeplin Posted September 5, 2013 Share Posted September 5, 2013 Yeah, I undestand that "retooling cost" to/profit ratio, probably wouldn't be worth it. And, it's only my personal quibble/wish, anyway. Epi will do what it wants/needs to do, regardless of what "I" think. LOL CB There was a member here a while back who had an issue with pot positioning on G400s and the like when compared to Gibson. Not blatantly noticeable but evident when placed side by side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie brown Posted September 5, 2013 Author Share Posted September 5, 2013 There was a member here a while back who had an issue with pot positioning on G400s and the like when compared to Gibson. Not blatantly noticeable but evident when placed side by side. Yeah, they are a bit different. Not sure "why" they do that?! Wouldn't seem to be a "retooling" issue, as much as just a different jig, or placement pattern. Would love to see Epiphone go more the direction, that Gibson has, of late...back to wider deeper bevels, and horn tapering, on the SG models. SO MUCH NICER looking and feeling, too! IMHO, as always. CB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dporto Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 "The best-sounding necks are thick and one-piece. Having multiple pieces of wood glued together gives more rigidity, but glue isn't known for it's tonal properties" Oh geezzzzzzz... Really? Any real irrefutable evidence to support this position? I didn't think so... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluemans335 Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 "The best-sounding necks are thick and one-piece. Having multiple pieces of wood glued together gives more rigidity, but glue isn't known for it's tonal properties" Oh geezzzzzzz... Really? Any real irrefutable evidence to support this position? I didn't think so... Nice to hear from you, and there's no denying your detailed and well-reasoned argument. Since tone is subjective, there's very little 'irrefutable evidence' with electric guitars. But you no doubt already know that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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