Guest alanhindle Posted December 19, 2008 Share Posted December 19, 2008 We don't know that Ant's isn't real. Besides' date=' judging from what he wrote on the "background" thread, I think he's experienced enough to tell the difference... I was just a bit shocked to see the photo of the headstock overlay which MarxBros posted... If Gibson are using those on their Customs rather than using inlays, that is sort of taking the p*ss, given how much they cost...[/quote'] My view: If the Gibson plant was magically tranported to China and all the same materials were used but the word 'Gibson' was taken off the logo and replaced with 'Epiphone' a Les Paul made there would cost 1.5 to 2 times the price of an Epi rather than 4 to 5 times the price. Again, if that very same plant was then magically transported to Japan and the same materials were used and 'Gibson' was replaced with 'Epiphone' on the headstock, then the cost of the Les Paul would be about 2.5 times the price of the Epi we currently know and love. One thing I do know is that the Gibson snobs have an over-inflated view about the quality of their instrument because of where it is made and, mostly, because of the history behind the name on the headstock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pohatu771 Posted December 19, 2008 Share Posted December 19, 2008 One thing I do know is that the Gibson snobs have an over-inflated view about the quality of their instrument because of where it is made and' date=' mostly, because of the history behind the name on the headstock.[/quote']I have a friend who bought an SG Special Faded, and his favourite part of the guitar is that it says "Made In USA" on the headstock. I have two Made-in-USA guitars - a vintage Gibson acoustic, and a Martin. I'm not going to lie, I'm a bit proud that they're American (more for the Martin), but it isn't a selling-point. It's more of a "local economy" deal. I'm from western New York, and half the people that live in my town work for Kodak. If I can buy something from Kodak rather than another company - without sacrificing quality, I try to. I also have a Whirlwind guitar cable - another local company. I'm wearing the t-shirt of a local store. When it comes right down to it, though, I am the local economy. It's nice to help out everyone around me, but I need to help myself as well. I could buy a Gibson ES-330, but it would mean that I wouldn't have my Strat, my Martin, my amp, my keyboard, or my computer. I'd rather have the Korean Casino and all the other things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alanhindle Posted December 19, 2008 Share Posted December 19, 2008 I have a friend who bought an SG Special Faded' date=' and his favourite part of the guitar is that it says "Made In USA" on the headstock. I have two Made-in-USA guitars - a vintage Gibson acoustic, and a Martin. I'm not going to lie, I'm a bit proud that they're American (more for the Martin), but it isn't a selling-point. It's more of a "local economy" deal. I'm from western New York, and half the people that live in my town work for Kodak. If I can buy something from Kodak rather than another company - without sacrificing quality, I try to. I also have a Whirlwind guitar cable - another local company. I'm wearing the t-shirt of a local store. When it comes right down to it, though, [i']I am[/i] the local economy. It's nice to help out everyone around me, but I need to help myself as well. I could buy a Gibson ES-330, but it would mean that I wouldn't have my Strat, my Martin, my amp, my keyboard, or my computer. I'd rather have the Korean Casino and all the other things. I've no problem with either patriotism or supporting the local economy. They're far nobler reasons for buying a Gibby than headstock snobbery or QDD (quality delusion disorder- works both ways you know!). In fact, can we adopt QDD as an official forum acronym to joint the infamous GAS and HNGD. I bought my Gibson SG faded because I've always wanted one since my teenage years and finally went out and did it. I'd love a black Epi G400 to go with it too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngusWaters Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 I am relatively new to the guitar world and i was after a new guitar! I set my heart on an epiphone les paul standard which i found on mzonline for 2/3rds of the price anywhere else. I did some research on them and although there was a bit of suspiscion surrounding the company i decided to order my guitar from them! I found their service to satisfactory and the guitar took about 10 days to arrive. during this 10 days i e-mailed them to find out when it will turn up and i pleased to receive a response within 30 minutes telling me that it had just been shipped and would be with me in about a week! When it arrived i was wary that it could be a fake but on closer inspection i think it's real, i was wondering what you guys think about it!! http://s446.photobucket.com/albums/qq187/AngusWaters1991/?action=view¤t=DSC00028.jpg http://s446.photobucket.com/albums/qq187/AngusWaters1991/?action=view¤t=DSC00031.jpg http://s446.photobucket.com/albums/qq187/AngusWaters1991/?action=view¤t=DSC00032.jpg http://s446.photobucket.com/albums/qq187/AngusWaters1991/?action=view¤t=DSC00026.jpg http://s446.photobucket.com/albums/qq187/AngusWaters1991/?action=view¤t=DSC00024.jpg hope you can tell by the photos!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcwillow777 Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
28v6r Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 For a fleeting moment there JC, I thought someone had drawn squares on your settee narrowly missing your guitar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron G Posted January 16, 2009 Author Share Posted January 16, 2009 ...... i was wondering what you guys think about it!! I think I have a bridge to sell you. P. T. Barnum was right.:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyushPresley Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 I may well be wrong here but I really have this feeling that this is a great fake..or a Factory B ?? The "Les Paul" signature is not at the right place..it way far from the truss rod cover when it should be fairly closer to the TRC and the "E" on the logo is way to fat. it's supposed to be a bit slim..or it can also be the camera. The Knobs are parallel and the volume and Tone knob is straight to the Screw on the pick Guard but the screw is closer to the sides and further from the bottom. The pickguard as I can see it in your 4th pic is not a perfect fit as well.. Shouldn't the Vol/Tone knobs be a bit darker too ?? Others would be able to help but tell me if i am going overboard with this !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gibplayer Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 I am relatively new to the guitar world and i was after a new guitar! I set my heart on an epiphone les paul standard which i found on mzonline for 2/3rds of the price anywhere else. I did some research on them and although there was a bit of suspiscion surrounding the company i decided to order my guitar from them! I found their service to satisfactory and the guitar took about 10 days to arrive. during this 10 days i e-mailed them to find out when it will turn up and i pleased to receive a response within 30 minutes telling me that it had just been shipped and would be with me in about a week! When it arrived i was wary that it could be a fake but on closer inspection i think it's real' date=' i was wondering what you guys think about it!! [/quote'] Angus, some of your pics are a bit fuzzy and the angles at which some are taken make them difficult to assess for certain points. Have a look at the original post on this thread (which apparently has been updated to include subsequent suggestions made): http://www.mylespaul.com/forums/epiphone-les-pauls/12286-fake-epiphone-thread.html Go through all the steps and tell us what your own assessment is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngusWaters Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 After reading that i now beleive mine to be real!!! All the knobs are correct as is the headstock! Even so i'm still a dubious of the seller and will not be buying from them again!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IntelligentAl Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 I'm with Ayush on this one. Now, I'm no expert on this, but the pickgaurd just doesn't look right. Maybe it's just the picture, but it is almost certainly an incorrect size. The screw is also not in the correct posistion (too close to the edge). Another thing that caught my eye was the nut. It seems to be a bit thick which is common among the other fakes posted on the forum. I don't know about the Les Paul signature, though. It seems like there is always a bit of inconsistency among it's position. Anyway, I'm no expert, but it does seem a little funny looking... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyushPresley Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 After reading that i now beleive mine to be real!!! All the knobs are correct as is the headstock! Even so i'm still a dubious of the seller and will not be buying from them again!! I still say check the Guitar..it doesn't look right to me... I don't know about the Les Paul signature' date=' though. It seems like there is always a bit of inconsistency among it's position.[/quote'] I actually checked several signatures on several headstocks are they are a bit inconsistent but not that way off.. mainly most of the fakes have lespaul written a bit far from the TRC... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alanhindle Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 After reading that i now beleive mine to be real!!! All the knobs are correct as is the headstock! Even so i'm still a dubious of the seller and will not be buying from them again!! A few things we know about MZ online: -They are not a guitar or instrument specialist retailer -They source from a variety of suppliers in China and arrange carriage direct from there -They will send a replacement if you say it's fake -People seem to be getting anything from genuine guitars (maybe slight seconds) to obvious fakes Still a big risk but it seems you can get a good instrument from them. Yours looks genuine to me. At worst, it's a factory second. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngusWaters Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 i had a feeling it might be factory second because of the pickguard!! Only one thing is it has an EE serial No. on the the back which i didnt think factory 2nds had! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IntelligentAl Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 Surely, even a factory 2nd would still have the screw in the right place? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron G Posted January 18, 2009 Author Share Posted January 18, 2009 i had a feeling it might be factory second because of the pickguard!! Only one thing is it has an EE serial No. on the the back which i didnt think factory 2nds had! Factory seconds have "2nd" stamped on the back of the headstock. Serial number remains intact because the guitar is still warranteed. MZONLINE sells fakes, period. End of story. No exceptions. Debate is stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gibplayer Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 Factory seconds have "2nd" stamped on the back of the headstock. Serial number remains intact because the guitar is still warranteed. MZONLINE sells fakes' date=' period. End of story. No exceptions. Debate is stupid.[/quote'] Yes, they do sell fakes, but we can't be 100% sure they don't sell genuine Epiphones as well. Surely a 'no exceptions' judgement can't logically be made on the basis of the small handful of guitars we've seen pictures of, at least one of which looks very very genuine. Doing a brief search of recent posts, it seems that more than one person on the forum is of the view that their MZ online supplied Epi is genuine. If MZ source from numerous suppliers inside of China, as they appear to have said, does this mean we have to assume that all Epiphones sold within China are fakes? Gibson/Epiphone surely must know about MZ Online. What surpises me is that, if they've been selling fakes for all these months, why have they not been stopped following complaints from Gibson/Epi. They're trading in a country where something can be done about it aren't they? One thing is definitely not in doubt. Only order from an authorised supplier if you don't want the risk of a fake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron G Posted January 18, 2009 Author Share Posted January 18, 2009 Fake or not, an "Epiphone" purchased from MZONLINE or any unauthorized dealer will not be covered by the warranty. Some of us, me included, have had a defective guitar replaced by Gibson/Epiphone, so the warranty does come in handy. As I've said before, Epiphones are Asian "fakes", too. Buy what you want to buy, for the price you want to pay - just be knowledgeable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gibplayer Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 Fake or not' date=' an "Epiphone" purchased from MZONLINE or[i'] any [/i]unauthorized dealer will not be covered by the warranty. Some of us, me included, have had a defective guitar replaced by Gibson/Epiphone, so the warranty does come in handy. I agree. At the end of the day it's just not worth the risk for the money 'saved' whether it is genuine, a Chinese shop second, smuggled out of the EE's back door or however else its got in to the supply chain. And if the buyer gets an obvious fake, definitely no sympathies there l'm afraid! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duffy Posted January 19, 2009 Share Posted January 19, 2009 This question of authenticity is a good question. It seems like one could contact Epi/Gibson and inquire to see if these are real Epiphones or not. A straightforward approach to Gibson would not be out of order. Also, contacting MZonline and directly asking them if they are authorized Epi's would also be enlightening. Conjecture is not going to solve the question. Some direct questioning would probably reveal some good results. How do these guitars play? That flammed maple top one looks real good. I have two EE LP standards and they are both very good guitars, and they are not fakes just because they are Epiphones. Yo, the Beatles played Epiphones to phenomenal success. I don't think the Beatles played fake guitars. The Epi/Gibson argument seems very insideous. There are plenty of great Epiphones out there that I have played. How about you? Duffy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngusWaters Posted January 19, 2009 Share Posted January 19, 2009 I've just been on this page and typed in my serial No. http://www.guitardaterproject.org/epiphone.aspx Can i trust this?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyushPresley Posted January 19, 2009 Share Posted January 19, 2009 I've just been on this page and typed in my serial No. http://www.guitardaterproject.org/epiphone.aspx Can i trust this?? No, checking the serial number on the site will not confirm that your guitar is Authentic.. the fake ones seem to have legit serial numbers, which were probably copied from legit ones as well.. any way if this guitar by any chance is authentic, which I strongly believe it's not, then from next time be sure not to visit that site..buy it from an Authorized Dealer or atleast from a place which has good history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngusWaters Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Just took some more images of it to see if you can get a better view!! BTW this did come in a legitimate box and it did have the stickers on the pups! http://s446.photobucket.com/albums/qq187/AngusWaters1991/?action=view¤t=DSC00041.jpg http://s446.photobucket.com/albums/qq187/AngusWaters1991/?action=view¤t=DSC00042.jpg Try to excuse the shoddy string work thats my fault!! http://s446.photobucket.com/albums/qq187/AngusWaters1991/?action=view¤t=DSC00043.jpg In response to the colour of the knobs, i have looked at many epi's on the internet and the knobs are the same colour as mine http://s446.photobucket.com/albums/qq187/AngusWaters1991/?action=view¤t=DSC00044.jpg http://s446.photobucket.com/albums/qq187/AngusWaters1991/?action=view¤t=DSC00045.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenegadeMaster Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 I have received two guitars from MZOnline, And the second I received, the standard, was a really bad fake, cosmetically it was pretty spot on though it has to be said, but it has a wrong serial number and it sounds terrible........ MZOnline have still not sorted the problem, we have been in negiotations of a refund for awhile now, the last email I received he wanted me to pay to send them back! The cheek :| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonedogg Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Hi all, new to this forum. I unfortunately got LP standard from mzonline, not sure if its a fake but because of what i have read here i am very dubious, under distance selling law in UK, you have 7 days to inspect and return for a refund. I checked the serial and it was supposed to have been made in china in may 2006, so even if it is legit where has it been till now. on this one the pickguard screw is knackered and the truss cover screw is loose, so they could be 2nd hand or refurbished, but i wouldn't pay that amount if I thought they were, plus they don't say anything about that so worst I would expect is a new guitar maybe registered a few months old due to stock quantitie. anyway try contacting consumer direct for help, I did today as I have had no replies to emails as yet. the more who do they may actually stop this site selling fakes. I have contacted gibson to see if they can verify the legitimacy of this guitar. though I am still seeking a refund under the distance selling act, as I will never be happy with this guitar having doubts in my mind and even if legit overpriced, maybe gibson could set up something like car registration so serials are registered to owners, maybe that would stop alot of fakes as you could contact them on it. ok peeps have fun and keep twangin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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