lespaulj45 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 anyone can master a five note pentatonic run-what you dont play is just as important as what you do play Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surfpup Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Yassih, us middle class and (predominantly) middle aged white folk sho do know us sum blues music. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjay777 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 I think Jimi nailed it with this quote.... "Blues easy to play, but hard to feel." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milod Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 I'll keep making this point on blues until I exhale my last breath: It is what it is, various African influences meeting various traditions of European music ranging from "folk" to "serious professional" stuff in a unique historical setting. Everyone talks so often about the "black" influence on "white" music. Naaah. People of different backgrounds were influenced as much as they influenced others. As far as "personal depression blues" and "pentatonic scale" and such stuff... Yeah if you only want to have the entree at a blues dinner or maybe just the okra. There's happy blues that may not even have a 12-bar "thing." There's stuff like Stagolee and Candy Man and Basin Street Blues and Gimme a Pig's Foot. There's complex stuff like Ellington and Basie (I got to hear both when I was in college). Ever hear April in Paris and think "Gershwin?" Some of the earlier recordings in rural areas a century ago had stuff that could have been either "black" or "white." Lomax's "negro music" - it was okay to use that term when he was doing that stuff - often was pretty far from "blues." But then some of his "white folk" stuff was pretty "black." What kinda stuff did Leadbelly do? Gary Davis? (I got to watch him too, but not as much as some "famous" folks.) Dozens of others? What of early "country" that's almost indistinguishable in ways in terms of color of artists and their recordings? Does anyone think both poor blacks and whites didn't recognize a lotta commonality in rural settings? And ditto the wealthier regardless of color? It ain't so simple as some might lead us to believe. All the old guys I've been around who were doing music in the 20s and 30s, black, white and various combinations with at times a bit of "red" proclaimed, that they "just play it." Just play what? Music. They listened to radio. They heard marching bands. Whether they fiddled or picked guitar or pounded pianos... they just played "music." Like the song? Play it with your technique and instrumentation. They did. Yeah, "we" run into "you ain't the right ethnicity." Okay. Whatever. I think they're right in ways, dead wrong in others. "They" said the same about other stuff too. I say with all due respect we are each individuals. When we recognize that and play music we enjoy how we hear and feel it... it's cool. Young pickers may have to await some aging before they're comfortable and get paid for "their" inside heart music regardless of theoretical genre, but... it's how it is. m Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbreslauer Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 with the great blues artists, to me, there is a sense of effortlessness. there isn't a 'showoff' feel to it (that doesn't mean it ain't there tho.) i think that if you think "the blues" is nothing but a pentatonic scale over I-IV-V, you're missing the point: several have iterated this on this thread already. that is part of it, but there is more. i too disagree that gender or race has anything to do with it, other than origin. 3 CDs i've been listening to extensively are Beano, A Hard Road and Crusade by John Mayall: the "trilogy" of Clapton, Green and Taylor in subsequent albums. Each shined on a Freddie King cover track: very "bluesy" for a bunch of brits... honestly though, jamming the "5 right notes" over a 12 bar is so much fun, why not enjoy it for what it is too? :) Cheers! Don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milod Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Don... I think you nailed it. All the old, longtime musicians I've known regardless of style or background got to a point somewhere in their lives whether they made money with music or not, that they just played. Some have been very skilled, some very talented, some were skilled and talented enough to get paid in another world and economic setting. Some still were getting paid in old age, some felt the world had passed by their music, but... When I knew those old guys, they just played. And they kept playing. I think when the physical pains of life finally were done, their hearts still were playing music their way and they probably walked into the light with a smile and hopes they'd find a guitar or fiddle or piano somewhere on the other side. m Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Versatile Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 I agree...interesting how 'the brits' via John Mayall, Alexis Korner et al were instrumental in reinterpreting the Blues for a 60's audience...taking the electric Chicago style with it's potential for large amplified performance...adding a touch of Rock variety and excitement. Rock 'n Roll is Blues at a faster tempo :blink: V Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbreslauer Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Some have been very skilled, some very talented, some were skilled and talented enough to get paid in another world and economic setting. Some still were getting paid in old age, some felt the world had passed by their music, but... When I knew those old guys, they just played. And they kept playing. I think when the physical pains of life finally were done, their hearts still were playing music their way and they probably walked into the light with a smile and hopes they'd find a guitar or fiddle or piano somewhere on the other side. m to me, that is the ultimate blues: an old(er) man, looking back at his youth (and the youth around him), realizing his prime has past and his time is coming... and the one constant is his music. I wonder how Muddy Waters really felt about the Rolling Stones: Sure there was the revival in interest, etc. but here are these young kids getting a LOT of glory on what was essentially his legacy... very interesting! -Don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surfpup Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 I wonder how Muddy Waters really felt about the Rolling Stones: Sure there was the revival in interest, etc. but here are these young kids getting a LOT of glory on what was essentially his legacy... Probably thought they were a buncha wankers! At least they didn't just rip off his songs like some bands did. They did try to focus some attention back on the original talents from whom they borrowed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjay777 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 to me, that is the ultimate blues: an old(er) man, looking back at his youth (and the youth around him), realizing his prime has past and his time is coming... and the one constant is his music. I wonder how Muddy Waters really felt about the Rolling Stones: Sure there was the revival in interest, etc. but here are these young kids getting a LOT of glory on what was essentially his legacy... very interesting! -Don It's kinda funny when you think about it...guys like Muddy or Howlin Wolf were strict with even the young brothers trying to make it in the blues world... then here come these white brit boy bands like the Stones and The Animals jamming on the same stage with Muddy. If anything it was the fact that they were recognized by a very unlikey younger generation thousands of miles across the pond. How could Muddy not appreciate that? Plus they made him famous. Without the british invasion, the blues might have been much more obscure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milod Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 In the 50s and 60s there was so much stuff flying around that a lot of "us" had no idea where it originated. I don't think it was a matter of wanting to "rip off" other artists, especially some of the blues folks, but more along the lines of no internet, little documentation and just playing stuff you heard around you. The only time I usually as aware of some documentation was if there were a vinyl "record" with a label on it or whoever the disk jockey on the radio said was doing a song (later a tv jockey like **** Clark in the US). A lotta the old stuff... you heard others in bands or, with my "high school/college" age lifestyle all the other pickers there were around, and there were many, you had no idea. Folk, rock, country, blues... from my experience it was pretty much all that way. Some may have known more, I didn't. Well, I did have my Lomax book and some "Sing Out" magazines/books, but... Also... as BB would tell you, there was a time when blues were not something anybody wanted. In the 1980s before the Beale Street "renovation," it was very, very difficult to find blues in Memphis. I had a lotta black friends and ... not one was a blues fan, regardless of their age. m Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbreslauer Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Also... as BB would tell you, there was a time when blues were not something anybody wanted. "if you want the blues, you ain't got the blues..." i forget who said that. :) Don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FirstMeasure Posted January 15, 2011 Share Posted January 15, 2011 Blues.....Man! Like Notes Norton, I'm in a bit of a hurry, so I was only able to speed read the responses here. But here's my take on it.... There's two musical definitions for the word "Blues". One is the 12 bar chord progression with plenty of room for improv (that's NOT from the dictionary btw). Then there's the Blues that is a discipline and a tradition, that is lived and studied, not just played. The discipline may not be as demanding as that of Classical Music, but it is a discipline of sorts. A Rocker can play the blues and a Bluesman can play rock, but that doesn't change who they are. Now I have to take my Fiance shopping for stage cloths, see ya all later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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