Lars68 Posted March 14, 2015 Share Posted March 14, 2015 I tried again. This kind of electric sound might be an acquired taste for some of you, but I kind of like it... It might be a new genre, folk-punk :-) Did I do better? My singing on my first try was horrible. This is a little better, but I still have a loooong way to go. https://soundcloud.com/lars1968/over-and-over-1 Lars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorrisrownSal Posted March 14, 2015 Share Posted March 14, 2015 I tried again. This kind of electric sound might be an acquired taste for some of you, but I kind of like it... It might be a new genre, folk-punk :-) Did I do better? My singing on my first try was horrible. This is a little better, but I still have a loooong way to go. https://soundcloud.c...over-and-over-1 Lars Better Lars! I actually do have a suggestion though (actually two)... After listening some more, This seems lower than where your voice wants to go. How about capo-ing up one or two? And maybe adding just a tad reverb? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars68 Posted March 14, 2015 Author Share Posted March 14, 2015 Thanks Sal. I will try it. My ear is playing tricks on me. When I listened back at the first attempt at this song, which I recorded Friday, I realized the singing was really just horrible. I did not think so at the time. I believe I did a little better this time around, but I can still hear it is off. It is like my ear is coming and going, and some days are worse than others... Lars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorrisrownSal Posted March 14, 2015 Share Posted March 14, 2015 Thanks Sal. I will try it. My ear is playing tricks on me. When I listened back at the first attempt at this song, which I recorded Friday, I realized the singing was really just horrible. I did not think so at the time. I believe I did a little better this time around, but I can still hear it is off. It is like my ear is coming and going, and some days ate worse than others... Lars Lars - keep at it. You... me... and nearly most on this board with a few exceptions... are amateurs having fun. We do this not for glory, or love of women, but because it makes us feel to play and sing. Keep doing it, and keep practicing. To guys like you and me it is not as natural as it is to others. Change the capo and post back on this thread, so its easy for us to go back and forth and hear the difference.. You're doing fine. Wait. The love of women doesnt sound so bad... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duluthdan Posted March 14, 2015 Share Posted March 14, 2015 Wait. The love of women doesnt sound so bad... Good lord, for a secong there I thought you had lost your mind.... This truly does sound like a take on Neil Young Kurt Cobain somehow. Sals right - capo up one I'll bet that will be more comfortable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flatbaroque Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 Kudos on the song writing effort Lars.Probably cause it is your own song and the melody is "new" would be one reason for the wandering in your pitch. With a cover that you've heard 100 times the melody may be more hardwired into your brain and vocals. Just a maybe lame theory on my part. I still remember the first song you wrote and posted.About your homelife / partner / baby? I think the vocal was more confident.Perhaps cause it was a simpler melody. Keep at it mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 Is there any latency in your vocal monitoring signal path? Interferences can make both expression and intonation difficult. Take care for an all-analog signal flow between mic and headphones. Anything that makes a nice song translate better is worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allie Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 Let me start by saying I'm certainly am in no position to criticize but I will add this....I hope it doesn't offend, I surly don't intend for it to. Your spot on with the music, timing is great I can only hope to be as good as you.... eventually. I think Sal is dead on with all the comments he makes, You appear to be playing in to low a key for your voice, It's very easy to do in a situation where you're alone in a small room.. I do it myself a lot. The only place I play out is at church and a few retirement/nursing homes and around campfires but at first I found that what sounded 'right' at home in my living room was to low for the more open larger sittings (I don't use any electronic for music or voice) after I got adjusted for that things started to come around. I'm still not getting any recording contract offers though You on the other hand are well on your way to fame...Your on the internet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars68 Posted March 15, 2015 Author Share Posted March 15, 2015 Let me start by saying I'm certainly am in no position to criticize but I will add this....I hope it doesn't offend, I surly don't intend for it to. Your spot on with the music, timing is great I can only hope to be as good as you.... eventually. I think Sal is dead on with all the comments he makes, You appear to be playing in to low a key for your voice, It's very easy to do in a situation where you're alone in a small room.. I do it myself a lot. The only place I play out is at church and a few retirement/nursing homes and around campfires but at first I found that what sounded 'right' at home in my living room was to low for the more open larger sittings (I don't use any electronic for music or voice) after I got adjusted for that things started to come around. I'm still not getting any recording contract offers though You on the other hand are well on your way to fame...Your on the internet! Allie, thanks for the helpful comments, and don't worry. I am not offended, not the slightest. By the way, I would not post a song on the world wide web with that kind of singing performance asking for advice, if I was easily offended :-) Music is a life force for me, and I really want to get better. This forum is a great place and I always gain a lot from the comments. Capmaster, I don't believe there is a latency issue. Usually I record singing and playing at once into one mic (Ipad+Apogee mic). This last attempt I did the singing on a separete track, but the results are about the same. I am of course very discouraged by not being able to get the vocals in tune, however, I am really surprised how easily the songs (melody, chords, rythm, and words) came to me. This was the second original song I attempted, and it was done in a matter of about two hours. I realize there is massive room for improvements in these two songs, but since it took me ten years just to learn basic chords on the guitar, this is a surpise. I am definetely going to try to write more soon. The two I have now, I basically wrote in my head before sitting down with the guitar. I need to work on translating what I hear in my head into the notes that actually come out of my mouth. I am somewhat confused by the fact that the first is so easy and the second so hard. I will give my song another chance by using a capo and report back. Lars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 ... Capmaster, I don't believe there is a latency issue. Usually I record singing and playing at once into one mic (Ipad+Apogee mic). This last attempt I did the singing on a separete track, but the results are about the same. ... Lars There you have the basic problem. Never use a mic with a digital output for recording vocals. You unavoidibly suffer the A/D, processing, and D/A latencies. No vocalist can intonate correctly this way. Even lots of pro engineers don't know since they never tried themselves. They agonize their artists and use pitch correction afterwards. Recently I recorded a young girl's voice, and she put off one can of her headphones in advance. I asked her why she did that, and she replied to control her voice. I told her she may put both cans on, and in case I couldn't make it work for her, I would give up audio recording forever. Then she put both cans on, and I recorded eight voices of her, a four-part backgruond choir in stereo to a song of her sister. The eight tracks took her nine takes. Finally she stated that she never happened to intonate correctly and express nicely before with both the cans on, and asked what I do different. I replied that I fed her own actual monitoring signal all analog to her ears through a separate signal chain. No audio technician would feed a repro head signal of an analog tape recorder to an artist's ear, would he/she? That's why Les Paul invented SelSync. In digital, latencies are just milliseconds, but this will cause +6dB peaks and minus infinity dB notches in your hearing frequency range. One must never feed a post-digital signal of the vocals the artist actually performs to his/her headphones. What you need is an all-analog mic, an interface with built-in mic preamp, mic monitor control, monitor mixer for adding the other signal you feed from digital, and a headphones amp. You will sing like a nightingale, believe me. By the way, from the notes causing problems to you I determined the overall latency of your system to about 4.5 milliseconds. This is a hell of a lot, three times of mine, and I can't sing fine using it. Vocals work best around 400...500 microseconds which are covered by the air path of the typical mic distance. That's what we are accustomed to by our nature. The subsequent analog electronics work close to the speed of light - a huge difference compared to digital. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allie Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 Allie, thanks for the helpful comments, and don't worry. I am not offended, not the slightest. By the way, I would not post a song on the world wide web with that kind of singing performance asking for advice, if I was easily offended :-) Music is a life force for me, and I really want to get better. This forum is a great place and I always gain a lot from the comments. Capmaster, I don't believe there is a latency issue. Usually I record singing and playing at once into one mic (Ipad+Apogee mic). This last attempt I did the singing on a separete track, but the results are about the same. I am of course very discouraged by not being able to get the vocals in tune, however, I am really surprised how easily the songs (melody, chords, rythm, and words) came to me. This was the second original song I attempted, and it was done in a matter of about two hours. I realize there is massive room for improvements in these two songs, but since it took me ten years just to learn basic chords on the guitar, this is a surpise. I am definetely going to try to write more soon. The two I have now, I basically wrote in my head before sitting down with the guitar. I need to work on translating what I hear in my head into the notes that actually come out of my mouth. I am somewhat confused by the fact that the first is so easy and the second so hard. I will give my song another chance by using a capo and report back. Lars Lars, I feel like I owe you an apology or something. I didn't realize that the song was your own composition, it's plain to see I'm way out of my league on this site, I do well to srum along and pluck a few strings to OTHER people songs ......I think some where it must be written or at least implied that you can sing your own songs any dang way you please. Good luck with the song writing and don't stop putting them out there And more importantly don't read any more of my responses..I'm clueless :wacko: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars68 Posted March 22, 2015 Author Share Posted March 22, 2015 Yet another attempt: https://soundcloud.com/lars1968/over-and-over-acoustic Any better, or am I just digging a deeper hole? Lars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorrisrownSal Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 Lars. I'm on my phone now, so I'll give it a listen latet. I think it's great that you are courageous and throw this stuff out there. It's how we get better. I'll listen when I'm at my computer tonight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars68 Posted March 22, 2015 Author Share Posted March 22, 2015 You know Sal, I really love music and I want to get better. Trying hard and posting songs here is the only way I know how. I am not worried about what others think about my best efforts. This is all just fun, and I have enough belief in my abilities in the parts of life that really counts. After all, here I'm just a stranger on the internet. It is much harder asking my wife for advice :-) Lars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 Sounds better to my ears now. Just the last few words are slightly out of pitch, but I guess these pensive lyrics would cause me a melancholic mood. Your song is fantastic, by the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 ... It is much harder asking my wife for advice :-) Lars That's completely understood. It has been the same for me most of the time I was married. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars68 Posted March 22, 2015 Author Share Posted March 22, 2015 Thanks capmaster. I appreciate the kind words. The funny thing is that I have no confidence in my ear, whatsoever. When I listen back to my previous two attempts at this song on Soundcloud. They are almost unbarebly hard to listen to, because of the poor pitch. Just a couple of days ago, I thought it sounded fine. Drives me nuts! :-) Lars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorrisrownSal Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 Now I can't wait to hear it... Ps my wife... She does not share music as an interest with me. I purposely record when she is not around. I know this may sound dysfunctional, but hey it works. We have been married a long time. I relate! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 Thanks capmaster. I appreciate the kind words. The funny thing is that I have no confidence in my ear, whatsoever. When I listen back to my previous two attempts at this song on Soundcloud. They are almost unbarebly hard to listen to, because of the poor pitch. Just a couple of days ago, I thought it sounded fine. Drives me nuts! :-) Lars This appears to be normal. I never manage doing a take I'm really content with, regardless if on drums, bass, guitar, keyboards, or vocals. The destructive part of perfectionism I think. Sometimes I even go back to a take I had considered as inferior before... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars68 Posted March 22, 2015 Author Share Posted March 22, 2015 This appears to be normal. I never manage doing a take I'm really content with, regardless if on drums, bass, guitar, keyboards, or vocals. The destructive part of perfectionism I think. Sometimes I even go back to a take I had considered as inferior before... Well, second thoughts can kill a man! I really thought those others songs were in tune. Today I clearly hear that they were not. I wonder what I will think of this last one in a few days... Weird that the ear can work like that. Lack of experience, I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 Well, second thoughts can kill a man! I really thought those others songs were in tune. Today I clearly hear that they were not. I wonder what I will think of this last one in a few days... Weird that the ear can work like that. Lack of experience, I guess. Regardless of experience, I always make the same mistake again and again when mixing a song I was singing myself. My vocals are too quiet. Every time it takes another person to tell me that the lyrics don't translate. This never happens to me when it's about other vocalists. It doesn't seem to depend on knowing the lyrics by heart because I do of each and every song I record until mixdown arrives. Still a mystery to me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flatbaroque Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 That's the best by far..more tuneful for sure. As far as the song goes..the alarm..alarm...work work ..etc repetition parts are a bit awkward.Seems to be too many words - to my ear anyway.Almost sounds a little bit Wiggles..not sure if you have them where you are. I probably shouldn't knock the Wiggles :mellow:.If it's an important part of the song to you...keep it.Mine is just one amateur opinion. But there is a decent song in there,bit of tweaking to get a smoother lyrical flow. Cheers mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 That's the best by far..more tuneful for sure. As far as the song goes..the alarm..alarm...work work ..etc repetition parts are a bit awkward.Seems to be too many words - to my ear anyway.Almost sounds a little bit Wiggles..not sure if you have them where you are. I probably shouldn't knock the Wiggles :mellow:.If it's an important part of the song to you...keep it.Mine is just one amateur opinion. But there is a decent song in there,bit of tweaking to get a smoother lyrical flow. Cheers mate. I may get the meaning different because English is my second language, and therefore my opinion may count less. Nevertheless I decided to dare saying it. To my feel the flow of the lyrics exhibits the breathless hustle in the everyday treadmill. Everything is scheduled, no way out, you even have to eat, drink, sleep, and plan the flow of nature compliant to the labour organisation. No break, no solo, no surprise allowed. The listener has the permission to change from feeling to thinking when the song is over. I believe that as a total work of art this song is spot-on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flatbaroque Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 I may get the meaning different because English is my second language, and therefore my opinion may count less. Nevertheless I decided to dare saying it. To my feel the flow of the lyrics exhibits the breathless hustle in the everyday treadmill. Everything is scheduled, no way out, you even have to eat, drink, sleep, and plan the flow of nature compliant to the labour organisation. No break, no solo, no surprise allowed. The listener has the permission to change from feeling to thinking when the song is over. I believe that as a total work of art this song is spot-on. yep i can see the point you are making.You expressed it well.The beauty of a song is how it affects different people.And the fact we are discussing the song...shows it has something worth talking about.Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars68 Posted March 23, 2015 Author Share Posted March 23, 2015 I work in the Finance department of a big production company. I see the affects of repetetive factory work everyday around me. I used to do this kind of work myself many years ago, and it really kills your soul. The song is about the feeling of being trapped in this kind of situation, where you hate what you do, but you still have to put food on the table. Hence, also the reference to Springsteen's "The River" which kind of touches on the same subject ("Factory" is another one). The specific part of the lyrics you refer to has to do with the drudgery and repetitiveness of most facory jobs. I specifically wanted this part of the song to be kind of fast, monotenous, and repetetive. Thanks for the discussion. It means a lot to me, and also inspires me to try to write more songs soon. Lars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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