Locking Tuners on my R9?

[canon_mutant]

I've heard others swear by the stock tuners on these reissues but I spend more and more time swearing at them. Since my playing style involves lots of string bending, I just can't keep this otherwise wonderful guitar in tune. I've tried wrapping over, wrapping under, wrapping over and under, no luck. I have locking tuners on all my other guitars because of this and problem solved.

 

Nothing more aggravating than going out of tune mid-song. Does anyone make direct replacement lockers for the stock tuners = NO post or screw hole drilling required? Can't stand the thought of modding this 1 of 25 50th R9 in "any" way.

 

Or for those of you that think the stock ones are bullet proof, can you share your stringing secret?

 

thanks,

[SixxstringKing]

I do alot of string bends with all my Pauls and don't have any real issues of them going out of tune. Here are some things you may want to try because I'm sorry but I'm afraid that you're SOL as far as a direct replacement without modding your guitar and I don't think you would want to come to that!

 

1. How often do you change your strings?

2. What brand/type do you use?

3. What guage?

 

 

[BigKahune]

.

Big Bends Nut Sauce

 

 

Have you ever tried some lube in the nut slots and saddle slots?

[canon_mutant]

Nuts and saddles are fine. Get lubed on each string change.

Strings changed once a month. Wife actually nags me about it. Given my albeit meager collection in my signature, she says I'm always changing guitar strings.

String types: GHS Boomers, Carvin [GHS Boomers], EXL and EXP D'Addarios, Elixer Nanowebs. All 10/46s. Have tried Gilmour's GHS 10/48s that I use on my Strat but they exibit the same problem on my LP as 10/46s.

 

This isn't a problem that happens over time. It's worse when they're new but once the new strings are seated good the problem is much better, just never goes away. The more I solo the more problems I have. You can power chord all day without problems.

 

I've had this problem with every guitar I own except my Carvins which come with Sperzels so I've added lockers to the others, even my Lifeson which I hated to mod but with that Maestro Tremolo, it wouldn't stay in tune for 10 minutes just sitting there without lockers. Even with lockers I still had to put a roller bridge on it and now it behaves pretty well. Still has an occasional problem but behaves better than my LP does.

[SixxstringKing]

Here's a trick I've heard of people doing before the advent of locking nuts and bridges, boiling the strings.

I always had guitars with locking nuts and trems and had found curtain strings would go out of tune. I've always had great luck with Dean Markley Blue Steel.

I use Dean Markley Blue Steel 9-42 on all my guitars, never had to boil them but also never had the problem of them going out of tune either.

[canon_mutant]

I've seen other players running stock tuners reach up and tweak their guitars live nummerous times - just saw Mick in Bad Company do it a number of times during their Paladia concert running now [Highly Recommended, BTW]. I've seen Alex Lifeson do it. Don't think it's just me.

 

Can't believe people playing in "real bands" [unlike me] don't have lockers on everything they play. Not only so they resolve this problem but if you happen to break a string on the fly a new one's on in like 20 secs.

 

Anyone tried these? They have the right shaft size though they are top lockers which aren't as preferable.

 

http://www.guitarcenter.com/Kluson-KB3L-Keystone-Locking-Guitar-Tuning-Machines---3-Per-Side-Bolt-Bushing-300225-i1374087.gc

[jamman]

Do you stretch your string completely? How many wraps on the strings? Bass should be 2-3, Treble should be 3-4 at a minimum. Imo that’s where the problem is. If it’s happening with all your guitars tuners, than try doing something different when you change strings. Chances are, not every guitar you have had has bad tuners. Sounds to me like they are not getting locked in . Of course if you just want locking tuners , go for it.

 

 

 

 

My Gear :-)

‘05 (bought 8-2010) Gibson LP TM DC ( Tak Matsumoto Sig. guitar) used

‘10 LP R0 50th Anniversary Version 3 1/500 (Cherry Burst)

‘09 LP R9 50th Anniversary (Heritage Dark Burst) 1/500, Bought 4-2010 new

‘10 PRS 25th Anniversary Santana Model ,10Top / Santana Yellow

‘09 LP R9 50th. Anniversary 1 of 59 (Rust Burst)

‘09 LP R0 Standard Ebony VOS

‘09 “Wildwood” CS - 356 Quilted maple & Korina

‘05 Les Paul Standard Faded T.B.

‘08 50th comm.edition, G.O.M. Flying V

‘08 July G.O.M. Longhorn Double Cut BV (Trans Blue)

‘08 Firebird VII (metallic red)

‘10 SG Bass Heritage Cherry

‘08 Fender Stratocaster ‘70’s reissue (black / rosewood neck)(Fat‘50’s pups)

‘08 Fender Stratocaster ‘70’s reissue (natural / maple neck)

1999 MIM Fender Stratocaster ’70’s reissue (white / maple neck)(‘69 pups)

1987 Japan Squier by Fender, Stratocaster (white / maple neck)

1986 Ovation Model # 1767-Legend

‘08 Marshall JVM 210H - 1960 AX Cabinet

‘10 Fender Blues Deluxe reissue

And some pedals

[canon_mutant]

Well, of course, back when I started playing, I just noticed problem solved when I got my first Carvin. They just come standard with Sperzels. So, as I continued to have problems with every "non-locker" guitar = add lockers = solved.

 

It could be "the way" I'm wrapping them all these years is wrong but I've got plenty of wraps in. I go 2,3,3,4,4,5 as a habit on the initial wraps. Then they wrap even more as you tighten the tuner.

 

I personally think it's that I bend bends when playing, if you know what I mean. Which should also answer your "do you stretch the strings" question. I do this right after a new set are installed from bottom to top practicing scales in the process.

[swleary]

Always pre stretch my strings before you even tune it. I use my two thumbs and bend on the string up , I stretch them first then tune to pitch, then stretch again and tune to pitch. I keep doing it it until it becomes very stable tuning. I also lube the nut and the saddles.

 

I use Ernie Ball 10-46's and I find them better than anything I've used before in terms of strings. I've used anything and everything out there. One more thing, could be time for a setup. My guitar usually goes in once a year to a tech just for any routine things.

 

Hope that helps.

[jamman]

Don't take it the wrong way as i'm just trying to figure out what's happening. swleary, has got ir right. try it, that's the correct way,imo.

If your not doing this ,they are not really stretched . I still think the strings are not locked in on the tuners. pics would be helpful. we could give better advice from pics. btw, about how many steps up do you bend your strings? 2 1\2 - 3 ?

[canon_mutant]

No, I never bend more than 2 full steps if you're talking about "while playing." After a restring, the higher strings probably get 3 steps though.

 

Here's some pics of a restring. Hopefully, I'll learn what I'm doing wrong.

 

Nut Pre-string. Dab on plenty of Graphtec then use the excess on the saddles.

 

 

Saddles Pre-string. With excess nut lube smeared on.

 

 

Nut Post-string.

 

 

Saddles Post-string.

 

 

String 1. Not terrible happy with this. May redo it.

 

 

String 2.

 

 

String 3.

 

 

String 4.

 

 

String 5.

 

 

String 6.

 

[swleary]

The string wrapping looks great to me. I'm a little concerned about the nut, looks like your treble strings just don't sit right in the nut itself. I'd really recommend taking it in to get a pro to set it up. I have a traditional and since I went to the Ernie Ball strings, no more tuning issues and I get longer life than the gibson strings I was using.

 

Didn't mean bending the strings while playing. Maybe I didn't make it clear. Here is the method I use, maybe give it a try

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PUvDdYYs0Zc&feature=related

[BigKahune]

Maybe you ought to try the winding method outlined in the Gibson guitar manual. The first wind goes over the sting (coming out of the post hole) and the rest of the winds go under. The bevel of the post forces the strings together as you tighten and pinches down on the protruding string end, helping lock the string in place and keeping it from slipping. (All your winds are under the string).

 

If you still have trouble with slippage (going flat), then try this -

 

[T Bone]

No expert here, so please feel free to discard this thought, but I wonder if you may have too many wraps? I've read that "less is more" and that too many can cause more room for slippage/stretching. Now if I could only recall where I read it... (had the file saved in a "Guitar Reference" folder in my favorites list, unfortunately a recent computer crash has made those inaccessible ).

[swleary]

No expert here, so please feel free to discard this thought, but I wonder if you may have too many wraps? I've read that "less is more" and that too many can cause more room for slippage/stretching. Now if I could only recall where I read it... (had the file saved in a "Guitar Reference" folder in my favorites list, unfortunately a recent computer crash has made those inaccessible ).

 

 

Yes you are actually correct on that, I read that too. Too many wraps can cause slippage,not sure where I read that either.

[canon_mutant]

Maybe you ought to try the winding method outlined in the Gibson guitar manual. The first wind goes over the sting (coming out of the post hole) and the rest of the winds go under. The bevel of the post forces the strings together as you tighten and pinches down on the protruding string end, helping lock the string in place and keeping it from slipping. (All your winds are under the string).

 

If you still have trouble with slippage (going flat), then try this -

 

 

 

Actually, per my first post, I have tried the under and over. I've tried just one wrap over up to several. Can't believe they are staying in tune with a total of one wrap as pictured.

 

thanks anyway,

[canon_mutant]

No expert here, so please feel free to discard this thought, but I wonder if you may have too many wraps? I've read that "less is more" and that too many can cause more room for slippage/stretching. Now if I could only recall where I read it... (had the file saved in a "Guitar Reference" folder in my favorites list, unfortunately a recent computer crash has made those inaccessible ).

 

I actually used to use fewer wraps but increased wraps because of the slippage. Figured, once seated, more wraps would provide more locking resistance. Though I don't bend "away from the fingerboard" after stringed, I bend up [higher] or down [lower] as far as they'll bend. I then retune and I start my low to high scales progression which practices the scales and a great finger exercise while doing bends all the way. Once I do this, it's pretty good, just won't stay. And, it's always out of tune the next time I pick it up. All my other "locker" guitars will generally stay in tune on the stand or for weeks in the case sometimes if I haven't been able to play them despite all having tremolos.

 

I appreciate the feedback guys but I have tried fewer wraps and the over and under. I slip most on B and G strings but they are the ones that get bent the most and most often. Then it's high E, followed by D. A and low E rarely have issues but I never bend them more than a 1/2 step while playing.

 

I think I need another LP that I am not afraid to put lockers on and that I am also not afraid to leave the house with. Yeah, that's it. Would love a Goldtop Traditional!!!

[T Bone]

I'd still try stretching a bit more (different manner). Have a look how Justin does it (go to about 4:20 in video part 2). I also saw a guitar tech video where the guy simply pulled straight up (similar to Justin, but without fretting and supporting over the bridge).

[jamman]

I'll say , i never heard that to many wraps story.but what i did see , that i thought was a problem was the D and G strings were not "over than under" wraped. just my 2 cents on this. I've been doing it that way for 40+ years and than 3-4 wraps,stretch and i'm good to go. Have you tryed bending the string in one direction or another(where you cut the excess off,so you make a 90 or so degree angle) as to lock it in better. I find with my prs i need to do it so i get stable tuning. And it has locking tuners. try it,it might help.