mrtrew Posted April 27, 2011 Share Posted April 27, 2011 Hi folks. wandering if anyone has had this before: Rewired my dot and all seemed fine neck pickup worked bridge pickup worked and volume and tone seemed fine. Then I moved my selector switch to central position for both pickups and the bridge pickup drops out. no volume, tone, crackle nothing. So both pickups work fine independently just not together. Switch is fine as I tried three others with the same result. You'd think the bridge vol pot is dud but why does it work on its own. don't know what sort of grounding issue would cause it. Got me perplexed! Any ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stein Posted April 27, 2011 Share Posted April 27, 2011 Perplexing. I am not sure, but just thinking in my head, if by chance 2 of the wires were reversed going to the switch, the reversed wires would still work with the circuit independantly, but in the middle position, the treble pickup hot would then be connected to the neck pickup ground, shorting it out. The neck pickup would still work. So, just a guess, but look for reversed wires going from the switch to the controls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrtrew Posted April 27, 2011 Author Share Posted April 27, 2011 Perplexing. I am not sure, but just thinking in my head, if by chance 2 of the wires were reversed going to the switch, the reversed wires would still work with the circuit independantly, but in the middle position, the treble pickup hot would then be connected to the neck pickup ground, shorting it out. The neck pickup would still work. So, just a guess, but look for reversed wires going from the switch to the controls. Mmm shall have to check it out. haven't had the harness back out yet (need to view it with fresh eyes). It's got to be shorted out somehow; reverse wire or trailing wire over back of pot. I do wander if the vol pot has gotten burnt and shorted out. pretty sure wires are where they should be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
disaster Posted April 27, 2011 Share Posted April 27, 2011 It's not a problem it's a feature....... The way Gibson/Epi wire the 3-way is that if EITHER vol pot is off & you switch to the center you get no output. This is what's known as a logical AND. The vol pot which is off is grounding the output of the circuit, which in this case is both pickups. There is a way to re-wire the switch so that you get the logical OR. This means that with the switch in the center position you only get no output when BOTH vol pots are off. I don't have the circuit handy nor a way to upload it to the site. But if you do a little research at a few of the electric guitar re-wiring websites you should find the prescribed circuit. I have the same "feature" on my Epi SG & was bummed until I learned it can be re-wired to correct it. I just haven't gotten around to re-wiring yet. When I get my P-Rails. Good Luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
animalfarm Posted April 27, 2011 Share Posted April 27, 2011 It's not a problem it's a feature....... ...a logical AND, the logical OR. (LOGIC GATES, BOOLEAN ALGEBRA.....GW-A-A-A-A-A-A!!!!!!! ) I don't have the circuit handy nor a way to upload it to the site. But if you do a little research at a few of the electric guitar re-wiring websites you should find the prescribed circuit. Why, SURE we have the "Prescribed circuit" HERE on the EPI Site! In the EPI LOUNGE "Do-it-Yourself" Thread, under "GUITAR WIRING DIAGRAMS", first topic: "3 way switch in middle, turn one volume down, BOTH pup outputs go down. Wanna know why? Also Independent Volume Control wiring..." http://forum.gibson.com/index.php/topic/52411-3-way-switch-in-middle-turn-one-volume-down-both-pup-outputs-go-down-wanna-know-why/page__pid__707012#entry707012 OR, "GIBSON Les Paul and Flying V Wiring Diagrams - Wiring Library" http://www.dominocs.com/AshBassGuitar/WireLibrary-Gibson.html Scroll down to INDEPENDENT VOLUME wiring, or just look at all the schematic variations and just freak out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigneil Posted April 27, 2011 Share Posted April 27, 2011 It's not a problem it's a feature....... The way Gibson/Epi wire the 3-way is that if EITHER vol pot is off & you switch to the center you get no output. This is what's known as a logical AND. The vol pot which is off is grounding the output of the circuit, which in this case is both pickups. There is a way to re-wire the switch so that you get the logical OR. This means that with the switch in the center position you only get no output when BOTH vol pots are off. I don't have the circuit handy nor a way to upload it to the site. But if you do a little research at a few of the electric guitar re-wiring websites you should find the prescribed circuit. I have the same "feature" on my Epi SG & was bummed until I learned it can be re-wired to correct it. I just haven't gotten around to re-wiring yet. When I get my P-Rails. Good Luck There are different ways to wire up a two pickup guitar with 2 vol' and two tone. Modern and 50s and each variant can be wired with or without the independent volume controls. My personal preference is for 50s style with independent volumes. There are some great info on guitar electrics HERE! in the DIY thread. scroll down about half way for the elctrical stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigneil Posted April 27, 2011 Share Posted April 27, 2011 you beat me to it AF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrtrew Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 thanks guys! plenty to work with there. you learn something new every day. I did use a slighty different schematic this time so I'll go back to my drawing board The guardians of tone come up with the goods once again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milod Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 I don't think Animalfarm gets the credit he deserves for that DIY thread. It's THE place to look first, as far as I'm concerned. Some night I plan to dig through it all 'cuz there was a lot of exceptional work done to get it there for us. m Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrtrew Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 Here is the wiring diagram I'll be giving a go soon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
animalfarm Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 I don't think Animalfarm gets the credit he deserves for that DIY thread. It's THE place to look first, as far as I'm concerned. Some night (DURING THE NEXT ICE AGE - )I plan to dig through it all 'cuz there was a lot of exceptional work done to get it there for us. m Listen to Milod... Milod is always right... Obey... Thank you, kind Sir. Just a Project that kind of took on a life of it's own. Sometimes when I scroll thru it, I'm kind of dumbfounded as to how many topics are there... I'm just happy folks can use it if they want to. Other members (RTH & Sjael) have crafted something special, and have given at least a couple of us a "sneak peek". Waiting for feedback regarding the "Great Unveiling". Great Forum, and it gets better and better as more of us feel comfortable here and contribute! Sorry about "Thread-Stealing", MRTREW!!!! Back to the pups..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitmore Willy Posted April 29, 2011 Share Posted April 29, 2011 Here is the wiring diagram I'll be giving a go soon Mrtrew, As to your diagram. Pickup to center lug of volume pot. Switch wire to outside lug....Yup... That should give you independent volumes. The fact that the cap is connected to the same lug of the volume pot as the pickup, leads me to say that it is "modern independent". I can not comment on the fact that the cap is connected to the outside lug of the tone pot with the center lug grounded. Having never tried it with modern, I'm not sure how much (if any) difference it really makes. Connecting the cap to the tone pot in such fashion is something I usually associate with 50s wiring. Where did you get your diagram from? Anyway, I'm always up for learning something new. Let us know how it works out! Willy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrtrew Posted April 29, 2011 Author Share Posted April 29, 2011 Thanks Willy, Have updated the image since reading your reply and having studied animalfarms resources a little more. Its based on a 50's style wiring. Drew the drawing myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitmore Willy Posted April 29, 2011 Share Posted April 29, 2011 Thanks Willy, Have updated the image since reading your reply and having studied animalfarms resources a little more. Its based on a 50's style wiring. Drew the drawing myself. The revamped drawing is now what I know as 50's independent. Willy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
animalfarm Posted April 29, 2011 Share Posted April 29, 2011 The revamped drawing is now what I know as 50's independent. Willy I CANNOT get mrtrew's drawing (post #10) to show up no matter which way I HIT the computer. Is this what YOU can see? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitmore Willy Posted April 29, 2011 Share Posted April 29, 2011 AF, I'm having no trouble seeing it with Firefox. I tried Internet Explorer and it wasn't showing up....Go figure? See if this comes through....it is a somewhat out of focus smaller version, but, it is his drawing. I used a web capture to snap the pic. Thus, the poor quality. Willy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrtrew Posted April 29, 2011 Author Share Posted April 29, 2011 This is the address of the image http://img696.imageshack.us/i/335wiringdiagram.jpg/ I'm using safari (mac) which could be the difference there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrtrew Posted May 3, 2011 Author Share Posted May 3, 2011 Had a chance to put all the theory in practice. It works! We have independent volume control Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaSTuS Posted May 3, 2011 Share Posted May 3, 2011 Had a chance to put all the theory in practice. It works! We have independent volume control The only way to fly IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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