AL-355 MAESTRO TREMOLO AND TUNING

[canon_mutant]

Kahler, Schaller, Schmaller . . .

 

Geez, Can't understand why anyone would get them confused?

 

Irregardless, per my experience, we now know at least that the Schaller roller will not work on this axe without modification of the posts. Too bad as I do believe the roller saddles would lend itself to this design better.

 

Sadly, the local Luthier said that my bridge was a burred up mess. He also worked on a couple of slots down by the tuners and adjusted the neck a couple of turns. No wonder I was having troubles. It still gets back to why GCS wouldn't take the time on a $3700 guitar [actually $3400 for me but I've got a friend] to make sure the damn thing wasn't right to begin with.

 

You mentioned getting all your axes set-up by a Luthier but I frankly have never had to. Until I bought a $3400 Gibson. I've adjusted actions and set intonations myself and haven't had a functional or in this case a dysfunctional reason to.

 

Still staying in tune so far and I'm using the trem for just subtle vibes.

[Wondo]

Canon,

 

Very glad to hear the Lifeson is playing better now. It is worth it to have a tech work on a guitar after you get it. Gibsons are never set up the way I like them when I get them. My luthier has a way of getting disgustingly low action with minimal buzz on all my guitars and for that alone is worth it.

[LerxstLee]

I will post a picture of a 1990s article on Alex's 355 when I get home. Alex states in this article that this guitar used to go out of tune even if he looked at it. It is typical of the Maestro. That being said' date=' if you put pencil graphite in the nut slots and either Nut sauce or Graphit-All in the Bridge saddle slots that will help a bit. But, you will not be able to use the Vibrola much more than subtle vibrato. If you use it sparingly, it does work very well. However, I would agree with Staxman, in that the place I would use that is in the studio, not live. If I have to use tremelo I will use one of my (now 2) guitars equipped with a Floyd. I play Wicked Game by Chris Isaak and there is subtle tremelo throughout the song, however that first bend on the B string would make a Maestro go out, but not a Floyd. That is just the nature of the beast. Best advice (as said earlier) tuck it behind the tailpiece and forget about it. Does that seem like a waste of a tremelo system? Maybe, but many owners of the ES355 TDSV swear that the whole tailpiece assembly adds to its unique tone. So, it does serve a purpose.

[/quote']

 

I have that magazine article somewhere also , I think that was the " guitar of the month " correct ?

 

I am not busting nutz Wondo as you are one of the finest source of information and help BUT :

 

Odd how Alex claims tuning problems , yet he used it restored with the Maestro for

" Most of Victor " and is using it on tour NOW along with one or more of the " proto's " for the artist series

in concert because he " Finds it can no longer hold it's tuning " :)

My conclusion is that (1) he no longer looks at the guitar so now it stays in tune .

(2) it made him better at tuning as he claims .

I do agree using it live is pointless . As Alex does , he keeps the trem out of the way .

Yet when the money talks it sure stays in tune " now " .

 

As someone else posted they had a maestro on a thunderbird and it worked great for them .

For what ever reason my old AL was great for holding tune and being a bit rough with the trem

with little problems . Just luck for me perhaps ? as if it did not do the above you know " I " would surely have

*****ed about that :) .

Nothing will compare to a floyd nor most locking systems . I do not think there is any arguement there .

If I understand the history of bigsby and lyre , it was a way to have a " tremelo effect " as many amplifiers

were dropping the " tremolo " option on their amps back then . With a trem on the guitar you could simulate

an amp without trem quite effectively . There was no diveboming tunage back then either :) . Why simply put

is there were no locking trems , and they knew the limits .

Perhaps some of the tuning issues on the production models are from that huge carve out on the neck .

Put any other gibson nut to nut and you will see just how " long " the carve out is on the back of the neck .

Christ the Gibson CS logo looks out of place on it even :)

/cheers

[LerxstLee]

I hope none of you get the new Rush DVD of the tour . With freeze frame and enlarge you will now see just what

ES-355 Guitar(s) he used or DID not use . Now what will you in the 50th row say you saw through your binoculars .

That is still too funny .

One the original has the regular 70s volute , and the proto he used that night /cough , I know you saw it on a different night , but this video proves the proto has no volute . So Bucky would be correct . Alex is happy

with "his" version . Admin did not ask bucky " does he like that mess of a volute . Doubtfully .

Alex has some nice "inspired by" but after that is where the volute was carved in .

I sure do miss Ian waller and Pete Stevens as I have wonderful memories of chatting with true gentlemen who built my

three WaL basses . Two excactly like Geddys and One just like Paul Mcartney's five string .

My second neck was boarded with rosewood . I never specified the fretboard for my second WaL. A call to U.K I talked to Pete " I really wanted an ebony Fboard . Pete replied , Send the neck back and I will put an ebony board on it for you .

HOw much ? No worries , put returned for repair on the custom form . What service , and someone will be taking over WaL basses again , they are already making them but working on the payed back orders as Pete has become ill .

What does this have to do with price of made in japan bridges , tailpeices , and trem arms you ask ? Customer service , Customer service , oh and Customer service .

With honor , honesty , and integrity .

Thank you Gibson for screwing (ME) on the AL-355 , never will I buy another poorly made covered up junk item from you again .

I will keep my 4 Les Paul's and '63 melody maker , those are really nice and you actually had luthiers when they were made .

Playing guitar and bass gives me great enjoyment . Waiting for a resolution that just was put off , and off , Namm , vacation , meetings

then a big F.YOU for an answer that made it too late to send the guitar back .

Good Riddance scammers , you won't scam me ever again . It will still be ruthlessly handed from manufacturer to manufacturer ,

from source to scource , you WILL get the point .

Screw an artist and a Customer , you Screw yourselves 100xs over .

Take a look at the ES-355s rolling of the we try hard sometimes , but we never try for a better guitar nor quality assurance .

Yet find a nice new ES-355 if you can . That is all I asked for . Yet it was too much .

Did I mention I am speaking for myself ?

 

/exit stage left

[PJLCC14]

Thats too funny.......I did the same thing watching the DVD...freeze frame.....slow mo forward.....freeze frame.......LOL. And like you, I came to the same conclusion......Big Al plays a modified version of what we were sold!

 

Do you think the Custom Shop told Alex he would have to pay to get that done???

 

Too funny at this point!

 

LerxstLee........you can speak for me on this subject!

 

PS......I notice the eBay value has taken a crap on these guitars lately!!!!

 

Bravo Gibson....Bravo. Stand up and take a bow on this one! While your at it, pat yourself on the back!

[turkeyT]

Take a look at the ES-355s rolling of the we try hard sometimes ' date=' but we never try for a better guitar nor quality assurance .

[/quote']

 

To paraphase Lisa Simpson, "I know all those words, but that post makes no sense!"

 

LerxstLee........you can speak for me on this subject!

 

Really?! Personally, I wouldn't let him speak for a lemonade stand.

 

Are you guys sure you were watching the new Rush DVD? If I were you, given the clarity of thought displayed in your posts, I'd doublecheck you weren't watching a Jonas Brothers disc by mistake.

[Envirotech]

AL-230 gets a reprieve . . .

 

Well' date=' the Schaller won't work without modding the guitar so it's going back to Schaller. Too bad as I think the roller bridge on this particular setup would be superior. Didn't realize that the Schaller posts are only M5 and the ES-355 posts are like M10. You could replace the inserts or perhaps find or fabricate a converter but too much hassle.

 

Anyway, I took AL-230 to my local Luthier today and he spent better part of an hour on it. There were a number of issues . . . burrs in particular and the D string saddle notch needed some enlargening. Combined with a fresh setup when he was done . . . drum roll please . . . I can actually play this thing.

 

And that's wonderful because I was seriously ready to RA this and buy something I can actually use. Get this, he charged me for a set of strings. So, I stuck a $20 bill in his palm shaking hands as I was leaving. Gotta love this guitar when it's in tune! True tone monster.[/quote']

 

My G string always seemed to sound dull compared to the rest of them. A very light once over with a file took care of that. I snapped a photo of the bridge before I did the work and it's all gold plated on the G and B string saddles, the others seem a bit more scratched up where the strings sit and do their magic. For all I can come up with; the string must resonate better on the bare metal than on the gold plating. I also put on 9-42 brite strings, on my next string change I'm switching back to the 10's I found they gave the guitar a bit more oomph.

[Staxman]

this video proves the proto has no volute

???How are you coming to that conclusion?? I just watched every frame of The Trees, the only song on the DVD that Alex plays the prototype on, and there is definitely a volute on the guitar. There are no closeups whatsoever of the back of the neck during that song but at one segment shot from behind the drum kit you can see the back of the headstock, and when you zoom in on it there is definitely a volute there. Not clear enough of a shot to see exactly where the volute is placed, but it's there, shadows don't lie and there is a crescent shaped shadow right where the volute is.

 

BTW when I saw Rush in St. Paul (second leg of tour) I was not sitting in the 50th row with binoculars. I was sitting right behind the guitar pit about 30 feet away from the stand holding all the axes...WITH BINOCULARS. There were 2 AL prototypes on the stand as well as the original, and they did have volutes. Can't say conclusively where the volutes were placed, but there were volutes on both that's for sure.

[Superdick2112]

For any of you Rush fans who have ever wanted to add some real Moog Taurus pedals to your setup, Moog announced yesterday that they will be building a one-time only run of 1000 new Taurus Pedals. If you are among the first 250 people to order, you will get a $300.00 price break - act fast if you want one, I ordered a set this morning and was informed that they have already taken over 100 orders. Now if I could only scrape together $7000.00 for the Rickenbacker 4080 doubleneck thats on Ebay right now...

[Staxman]

For any of you Rush fans who have ever wanted to add some real Moog Taurus pedals to your setup' date=' Moog announced yesterday that they will be building a one-time only run of 1000 new Taurus Pedals. If you are among the first 250 people to order, you will get a $300.00 price break - act fast if you want one, I ordered a set this morning and was informed that they have already taken over 100 orders. Now if I could only scrape together $7000.00 for the Rickenbacker 4080 doubleneck thats on Ebay right now...[/quote']Funny how time changes things...and prices. I bought a set of Taurus Pedals brand new about 25 years ago for around $400. Now I can't remember what I did with them, must have sold them at some point. I've been using a Roland PK5 into a Roland 1080 and that works great for Rush stuff, as well as triggers samples since it is midi. Would be fun to play the Taurus again after all these years, though.

[PJLCC14]

 

To paraphase Lisa Simpson' date=' "I know all those words, but that post makes no sense!"

 

 

[/quote']

 

Somehow, it doesn’t surprise me that you take your intellectual prowess from a cartoon!

[turkeyT]

Quiet. The adults are talking.

[1meanmalibu]

In regards to the latest comments made by Staxman and LerxstLee, I posted a photo back on July 15, 2008 in the forum page called "Custom Admin: Volute on Lifeson 355". When you click on the link below, scroll two-thirds down the page and you'll see a photo of Alex's guitar case that I took at the Toronto show (Molson Amphitheatre) on July 9/2008. I hope it helps.

 

http://forums.gibson.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=4424&p=5

[Staxman]

In regards to the latest comments made by Staxman and LerxstLee' date=' I posted a photo back on July 15, 2008 in the forum page called "Custom Admin: Volute on Lifeson 355". When you click on the link below, scroll two-thirds down the page and you'll see a photo of Alex's guitar case that I took at the Toronto show (Molson Amphitheatre) on July 9/2008. I hope it helps.

 

http://forums.gibson.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=4424&p=5

 

 

[/quote']Thanks I missed that shot before. As far as I can tell that photo is absolute proof that Alex's Custom's have the more pronounced volute, just like ours do. So wether it was a screwup or not he is playing them that way, and playing them well.

[Wondo]

LMAO!!

 

I knew after the release of S&A Live there would be these posts. I have not been to the Custom Forum in a while. I have been concentrating on finding answers about the Dark Fire. As I was reading the thread, I was getting ready to go and get 1Meanmalibu's picture, but then he came in and posted it. There's your proof. Also, somewhere in that original post, there was a link to the Lifeson on a website that had a picture of the prototype without "Alex Lifeson" on the truss rod cover and it most definately had the volute. So, look all you want the volute is there. We in psychology call this a confirmation bias. This is when you are looking for something to confirm your bias, you will find it. Of course one could argue this could work both ways (i.e., ones looking for the volute will see a volute and ones looking for no volute will see no volute). But, 1Meanamaibu's picture proves it and it has been proven before many months ago.

 

LerxstLee,

You are a nice guy. We've talked through PM. But, let it go already. I believe you gave up your Lifeson? I have played mine recently and I still love it. Admin made it clear that the white wood neck was done before any Lifeson's were made, that means Alex got one just like all the rest.

[truthoffiction]

Enough with this volute crap already! Who cares!?! Other manufacturers put the volute in the same exact place. Here's a couple of new Ibanez models...

 

 

 

[canon_mutant]

I'm just thrilled that AL-230 is still remaining cooperative since my luthier spent more than a half hour on it. Loved some of his editorial comments about Gibson during the process. Though it's always out of tune each time I go to play it [unlike my other guitars] I can tune it up and play it quite a while with now only an occasional incident.

 

Though I personally don't care about the volute issue either, it is frustrating that my $800 [1990 dollars] Carvin is going on 20 and has never seen a luthier, plays like butter, and still sounds great. And if I'm too busy to play, it even can remain on the stand for weeks sometimes yet generally is still in tune despite the Wilkinson trem it sports.

 

The issues I've had with my $3400 Gibson has me thinking twice about whether I want to spend more of these kinds of dollars on these guitars. Would love to have a LP Supreme, Custom, or especially a 50th R9 for my 50th next year but it's going to be perhaps 2X what I paid for AL-230. Meanwhile, the built to "my specs" Carvin CS6 with a custom electronics tweak will play like butter and look like a million as only flamed KOA can for <$2K.

 

And for those of you like on other posts that are going to start flaming Carvin again . . . do you actually own one?

 

I now own 2 and have ZERO complaints. Not zero complaints for the dollars I spent . . . ZERO complaints period.

[Wondo]

Enough with this volute crap already! Who cares!?! Other manufacturers put the volute in the same exact place. Here's a couple of new Ibanez models...

 

 

 

 

The top picture looks just like the Lifeson volute. The bottom one is steep. Looks like you could get altitude sickness from that one. I think that these two pictures show what I was trying to say about the volute some time ago. The top picture is like the Lifeson. The bottom picture looks like pictures of a 76 355 I posted, but a bit lower. In the case of the bottom pic and the 76 I posted, the volute is higher but steeper. And the top pic and the Lifeson are lower however they are more shallow and not as steep. I agree, I have gotten over the volute thing quite some time ago. The guitar in every other aspect is just great. However, I will say that the fact that Ibanez makes their volutes like this does not make me feel any better about Gibson not making it just like Alex's 76. But, Alex plays the prototype of our Lifeson Signatures. So, it ain't a big deal for him, and since I have gotten used to it, it ain't no bi deal for me either. Rock On!

 

I'll take the squire in the box to the left.

[Wondo]

The issues I've had with my $3400 Gibson has me thinking twice about whether I want to spend more of these kinds of dollars on these guitars. Would love to have a LP Supreme' date=' Custom, or especially a 50th R9 for my 50th next year but it's going to be perhaps 2X what I paid for AL-230. Meanwhile, the built to "my specs" Carvin CS6 with a custom electronics tweak will play like butter and look like a million as only flamed KOA can for <$2K.

 

And for those of you like on other posts that are going to start flaming Carvin again . . . do you actually own one?

 

I now own 2 and have ZERO complaints. Not zero complaints for the dollars I spent . . . ZERO complaints period.[/quote']

 

Great to hear the LIfeson is acting better. If it is out of tune when you take it out of the case, is the case lid depressing the trem arm at all? Are you making sure it is getting humidified?

 

Also, as much as I love the Lifeson, and I did get a pretty good one where the neck feels really nice, if you have ever played an R8, R9, R0, you know these guitars are in a league of their own. Those guitars play extremely well. I would vote for the R9 over a Les Paul Supreme or Les Paul Custom any day!

[truthoffiction]

FWIW, my company just hired an ex Gibson employee who worked closely with the engineer who drew the specs for the Lifeson ES-355. This engineer has made some mistakes in the past, but they were all caught before the instruments went into production. He confirmed the volute was definitely misplaced, but Gibson doesnt want to do anything about it. Nice to hear it from the horses mouth. So, now you all know the truth and its just as expected.

[Wondo]

If this is true, then Gibson is acting and had acted just as we suspected. By the look of the white Ibanez posted above, perhaps this engineer once worked for Ibanez and then joined Gibson or perhaps they used an Ibanez to decide where the volute should be rather than a real 1976 ES 355. Since they were meeting with Alex to negotiate the guitar, how hard would it have been for him to bring the original with him and they draw up specs? Oh well, what's done is done. In the long run though, Gibson would have been smart if they took care of the problem somehow. It was only 300 guitars. Considering how many guitars they make overall. This would not have been a problem to fix. They probably think that their reputation is on the line should they admit to a mistake. But, look how good this would have been for the company...a known flaw in design and manufactuering and Gibson stands behind their work and their promise and replaces all the guitars or fixes the problem. I guess they don't look at it this way.

 

If you get a chance, ask this guy why Gibson would not do anything about it or why it ended up where it did and if he knows if Alex knew anything about it.

[LerxstLee]

 

Really?! Personally' date=' I wouldn't let him speak for a lemonade stand.

 

Are you guys sure you were watching the new Rush DVD? If I were you, given the clarity of thought displayed in your posts, I'd doublecheck you weren't watching a Jonas Brothers disc by mistake.[/quote']

 

turkeyT Posted: Monday, December 01, 2008 10:50:54 AM

 

 

Rank: Advanced Member

 

Joined: 4/11/2008

Posts: 87

Location: Edmonton, Canada

LerxstLee wrote:

Take a look at the ES-355s rolling of the we try hard sometimes , but we never try for a better guitar nor quality assurance . off the assembly line

 

 

 

To paraphase Lisa Simpson, "I know all those words, but that post makes no sense!"

 

 

PJLCC14 wrote:

LerxstLee........you can speak for me on this subject!

 

 

 

Really?! Personally, I wouldn't let him speak for a lemonade stand.

 

Are you guys sure you were watching the new Rush DVD? If I were you, given the clarity of thought displayed in your posts, I'd doublecheck you weren't watching a Jonas Brothers disc by mistake.

 

Sorry for the mistake there C*ck Gobbler / right

[LerxstLee]

 

turkeyT Posted: Monday' date=' December 01, 2008 10:50:54 AM

 

 

Rank: Advanced Member

 

Joined: 4/11/2008

Posts: 87

Location: Edmonton, Canada

LerxstLee wrote:

Take a look at the ES-355s rolling of the we try hard sometimes , but we never try for a better guitar nor quality assurance . off the assembly line

 

 

 

To paraphase Lisa Simpson, "I know all those words, but that post makes no sense!"

 

 

PJLCC14 wrote:

LerxstLee........you can speak for me on this subject!

 

 

 

Really?! Personally, I wouldn't let him speak for a lemonade stand.

 

Are you guys sure you were watching the new Rush DVD? If I were you, given the clarity of thought displayed in your posts, I'd doublecheck you weren't watching a Jonas Brothers disc by mistake.

[b'][/b]

 

Sorry for the mistake there C*ck Gobbler / right

 

Take a look at the es-355s rolling ( OFF the belt nice with no volute also )

Can I sell lemonade now C*ck gobbler ?

[LerxstLee]

 

The top picture looks just like the Lifeson volute. The bottom one is steep. Looks like you could get altitude sickness from that one. I think that these two pictures show what I was trying to say about the volute some time ago. The top picture is like the Lifeson. The bottom picture looks like pictures of a 76 355 I posted' date=' but a bit lower. In the case of the bottom pic and the 76 I posted, the volute is higher but steeper. And the top pic and the Lifeson are lower however they are more shallow and not as steep. I agree, I have gotten over the volute thing quite some time ago. The guitar in every other aspect is just great. However, I will say that the fact that Ibanez makes their volutes like this does not make me feel any better about Gibson not making it just like Alex's 76. But, Alex plays the prototype of our Lifeson Signatures. So, it ain't a big deal for him, and since I have gotten used to it, it ain't no bi deal for me either. Rock On!

 

I'll take the squire in the box to the left.[/quote']

 

I want all of my old gibson to look like the new improved Ibanez .

Wow , now Gibson is stealing plans from Ibanez for improvements that are well imHo incorrect .

I knew it was a conspericy , now what would be the theory

[sparky]

 

Take a look at the es-355s rolling ( OFF the belt nice with no volute also )

Can I sell lemonade now C*ck gobbler ?

 

i've been watching these forums (and your sad performance on them) for a long, long time without posting, but now i just have to say...nice work with the homophobic slur.

 

i've sent an email to the Gibson corporate webfolks asking them to ban you. enjoy your last couple days here...after that it's back to your parent's basement, or your van down by the river, or wherever it is people like you live.