Daddyash1 Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 Hi, I am hoping some of you guys can help. I have recently bought a j 45 red spruce ltd tv that sounds and looks amazing. The action and set up on the guitar is fantastic when plaing open chords but when capo'd on the 5 th and 7tth fret the strings are choking. The neck looks almost straight with little to no relief with the strings on, so I tried to slacken off the truss rod, however when I tried I found that the nut was spinning and was as loose as it will go. This seemed strange to me so I took the guitar back to the shop who are telling me this is how the true vintage guitars are built and that they only have a 'single action' truss rod rather than a normal dual action rod. It seems strange that this is the case and thereis no way to achieve a little more relief. I don't want to use thicker strings as I know the adi top is lightweight. I use gauge 12's. Any help on this matter would be really appricieted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duluthdan Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 The truss rod on my 2010 J-45 TV is single action. The nut, however doesn't spin. Are you sure you are using a 5/16 long socket drive? These can be tricky because the space for the socket tool is quite limited. None of my standard tools fit it, I had to buy a special driver from Stewart McDonald. http://www.stewmac.com/shop/Tools/Special_tools_for_Truss_rods/Hex_Truss_Rod_Wrenches.html Are you sure you are getting a good "bite" on the nut? Or is it possibly rounded off? Can you tighten the nut? I have 12-54 gauge strings, tuned down half a step - I turn my truss rod 1/8 of a turn clockwise to tighten, counter clockwise to loosen. Had to tigten just a smidge when I decided to tune down all the time - don't think I've had the occassion to loosen the rod yet - but my luthier did when he fixed a top crack and re-setup my guitar last spring to these detuned 12s, from the standard tune 13s that were on it. Hope its a simple fix for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddyash1 Posted September 16, 2012 Author Share Posted September 16, 2012 Hi thanks for the reply. I do have the right tool however I didn't need it, as when I tried to loosen the nut it was already so loose I could turn it with my fingers, so couldn't put anymore relief in the neck. I can tighten the nut but this would make the problem worse, As the action is perfect playing open chords at the headstock end it's just I use a capo a lot down the fretboard to the 7th fret, I didn't want to mess around taking the action up. I just think it seems strange that there is no room for adjustment, as I can't be the only player who uses capos on these guitars, and with the neck being so straight it just doesn't sound as good as it could. I just wonder if it a fault on this particular guitar. I have taken it to a luthier friend of mine who cannot understand it, he says he has never seen anything like it, but he hasn't seen a true vintage before either. The shop is saying that Gibson make them like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedzep Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 When you barre up that high, do you get the same sense that the tone is cut off significantly? Also, do single notes picked above the 7th die out too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blindboygrunt Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 what would that mean jed ? ...... in case he doesnt come back i wouldve guessed that the truss rod had ready been turned as much as it will go leaving no more neck relief possible ,, or do they tighten at each end of the threads?? or , heaven forbid , that its been stripped Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedzep Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 My first thought was that his capo was causing the problem, but not likely. The dealer sounds like he sells cars. The 'they're all like that', comment is one you hear when a problem can't be solved. That neck seems locked in at dead straight and unless D'ash can get another guitar to compare it too (provided by the shop owner or by going to another dealer), he'll be stuck tweeking the action up slightly with a taller saddle. A minor string angle there could bring it to life...but I'd want my new 'car' to run perfectly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddyash1 Posted September 16, 2012 Author Share Posted September 16, 2012 The single notes don't completely die out but still "clack" a bit. when barring or capping on 5th and mainly 7th it does loose the tone a bit because it's catching the frets. When I say the nut is loose I mean when I turn it anti clockwise to achieve relief I can do this with my fingers as it is loosened off as far as it can be, if I keep turning the nut would eventually come off, and it is not adding any relief. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedzep Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 Good luck with this...yet another tale of woe and intrigue regarding new Gibsons. Ease out the saddle and temporarily shim it slightly higher to check out your theory that slight relief would help. I might also try tuning up a half or whole step to see if the change needed is so slight that higher string tension would pull the neck angle just enough for your ear to detect improvement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddyash1 Posted September 16, 2012 Author Share Posted September 16, 2012 Thanks for the replies. I just hope it's not a fault on the guitar. I don't think I should have to be doing this on a less than a year £2 k guitar. Also does anyone know anything about this exact model, the product code is RSGC4TVSNH1 and I have noticed this is different to normal true vintage j45s also in the label in the the sound hole just states j45 where as another true vintage I saw said j45tv also the guitar has aged finish (vos) and aged binding but the tuning buttons are bright white and are single rather than 3 on a strip. It does say custom shop on the back of the neck/ headstock and came with a certificate that states red spruce limited. There is nothing on the Gibson web site about it. Could it be a limited run just for certain dealers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dchristo Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 try putting medium strings on for a little while, it might help get a slight bow in the neck, then put lights back on the light spruce top will handle the mediums, I keep mediums on mine all the time maybe Jeremy will chime in with some good avice good luck, and keep us posted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdd707 Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 It appears that you simply have a defective instrument. If it was correct, you would be able to adjust the relief up or down. I have an AJ that two respected luthiers were unable to adjust and the third found that my truss rod was broken. That is probably not the case with yours, but it could have been improperly installed, the rod could be defective, or any number of thinks could have gone wrong at the factory. If you bought it new then you must insist that it be made right. Gibson will do so .... their service regarding repair of new instruments with problems is excellent! Do not take the answer from a dealer that "it's just the way it is" or "they are made this way". If Jeremy (Morton) doesn't pick up this thread, private message him through this site. No one works harder to make customers happy than the Bozeman folks. It appears that you are in Europe. That certainly complicates things! There may be warranty differences and who knows what other considerations .... not to mention shipping! If you bought it from a authorized Gibson dealer, hold their feet to the fire. Don't be like me and play an expensive guitar with a problem for years. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParlourMan Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 I had a defective instrument recently, A woody G model... My dealer became a bit of an SOB about things, after two attempts at repairing it. So I contacted Gibson myself, it was collected, examined, destroyed and a replacement J-45 issued. So much for all the criticisms their QC & repair get, it was them who sorted me out, the dealer wanted to charge me the price diff for the same model as it had risen since I bought it the year before. If your guitar is new, PM Jeremy Morten if your dealer won't man up about things, if it's not a new instrument and you have no warranty you're looking at a bit of a repair bill to right the problem. It sounds like your guitar is one of the 1st 167 TV Models, nice score, certainly worth fixing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddyash1 Posted September 18, 2012 Author Share Posted September 18, 2012 Thanks for all the help. I've taken it back to the shop again who say they will send it back to Gibson or an authorised repairer so I'll wait for their verdict. I'll keep you posted. Thanks for the info on the model parlour man it was only built in 2011 and I got it from new in February. Hopefully it will get sorted if not I will message Morton as you advised. Many thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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