KDRR Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 When I got my 339 it came from the factory about 85% setup the way I like it. The only problem I`ve had with it is the strings catching in the nut. Now I took it to my guy who works on my guitars and he grooved the nut some lubricating it but I`m still having some trouble with mainly the G string when I bend the G up sayat the 12fret the G goes Flat then I press the G behind the nut and it goes back in tune. Nothing worse than a G string to flat or to sharp. Now I guess I can file the nut more. I`m also looking into a Bone Nut. Has anyone else had this problem with their 339 nut? Thanks Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigKahune Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 . In recent years, Gibson has a fairly well known problem getting nuts cut correctly. There have been many posts on this topic. A lot of players have a setup done after purchase with an eye on nut problems - pinching, incorrect slot depth, high E too close to the edge of the fretboard, etc. You're on the right track. A tad more width on your G slot should remedy the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDRR Posted October 10, 2011 Author Share Posted October 10, 2011 Thanks BigKahune Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PP_CS336 Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 . In recent years, Gibson has a fairly well known problem getting nuts cut correctly. There have been many posts on this topic. A lot of players have a setup done after purchase with an eye on nut problems - pinching, incorrect slot depth, high E too close to the edge of the fretboard, etc. You're on the right track. A tad more width on your G slot should remedy the problem. BigKahune, I think you hit the nail right on the head when you say, "Gibson has a fairly well known problem getting nuts cut correctly." I've had a problem with my new (March 2011) SG Standard with one of the problems you mentioned, "High E too close to the edge of the fretboard". I'm having problems with the high E slipping off the fretboard when I do certain chord forms like the G chord that uses the 2nd finger as the root on the 6th string and the 3rd and 4th on the B and E strings playing the D and G notes respectively on the 3rd fret. The E string just slides off the fretboard at times. Or if I do a Dsus4 chord with hammer ons and pull offs in the second position, the E string slides off again. I just brought it back to Alto Music where I bought the SG and the guitar tech there said as you did, that Gibson's nuts are very poorly cut and he's had to do quite a few repairs lately. He's going to put a whole new bone nut in for me and fix the problem. I'm looking forward to getting my guitar back without the E string slip-sliding away anymore. It was real annoying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigKahune Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 .... the guitar tech there said as you did, that Gibson's nuts are very poorly cut and he's had to do quite a few repairs lately. He's going to put a whole new bone nut in for me and fix the problem. I'm looking forward to getting my guitar back without the E string slip-sliding away anymore. .... Sorry to read about your problem. Some get very upset about it these nut problems, I'm glad you seem to be taking this in stride. A new nut with spacing set to your liking should do nicely for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rolling56 Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 When I got my 339 it came from the factory about 85% setup the way I like it. Thanks Keith Keith almost every guitar that leaves the factory has the nut filed just a little bit shallow so when the person gets it they can have it setup to their liking. It's not just Gibson, it's all guitar mfg'ers......plus most of them are not bone either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDRR Posted October 10, 2011 Author Share Posted October 10, 2011 Bob , I get that , it`s just that he worked on it before and we (He) thought it was good. I`ll have it worked on tomorrow or Weds. Love the guitar but I can`t have these kind of problems on a 2 thousand dollar guitar or any guitar for that matter. K Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarzan55 Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Yes, I have had that same problem with my 339. I got it in March -- 95% set up the way I wanted it. Not bad. Soon, I started having a tuning problem. The G was constantly going out -- as was the B and the high E, but not as much. Like you, the G would go flat -- go sharp -- but it got to where I was tuning it every bend. Before taking it to a Tech who might make matters worse or at least more confusing, I got some Dr. Bends Nut Sauce from Musicians Friend -- and it fixed my problem straight away. I have to re-apply the Nut Sauce roughly once every other month -- and everything is just about perfect. Literally, now it's rare that I ever have to tune it -- Since you've already had it worked on a bit by a Tech, I don't know if the Nut Sauce would still be as effective, but I'd try it before doing anything else. And if it doesnt work, look to seriously get some work done. I have talked with other 339 owners with the same problem, and virtually all were successful with the Nut Sauce. Good luck. I know how that drives you crazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerial Man Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 I took the standard nut out of my es 137 classic. Thought it was plastic, but it was bone. Changed it for a tusq xl nut and the difference is very noticeable, more harmonics, no binding, better tuning and intonation. Your 339 probably also already has a bone nut, but with soft areas in the material causing binding. When you drop both nuts onto a hard surface, the Tusq xl nut material sounds more resonant and bell like sounding than the bone nut. I think the standard factory setup is usually fine for the purposes of deciding if you like the tone and feel of a guitar when choosing to buy. But then when you buy that guitar it's your job really to set that guitar up to exacly how you like it. If every guitar came out of the factory with no adjustment left in the nut, bridge and saddle heights, that would totally suck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDRR Posted October 11, 2011 Author Share Posted October 11, 2011 Yes, I have had that same problem with my 339. I got it in March -- 95% set up the way I wanted it. Not bad. Soon, I started having a tuning problem. The G was constantly going out -- as was the B and the high E, but not as much. Like you, the G would go flat -- go sharp -- but it got to where I was tuning it every bend. Before taking it to a Tech who might make matters worse or at least more confusing, I got some Dr. Bends Nut Sauce from Musicians Friend -- and it fixed my problem straight away. I have to re-apply the Nut Sauce roughly once every other month -- and everything is just about perfect. Literally, now it's rare that I ever have to tune it -- Since you've already had it worked on a bit by a Tech, I don't know if the Nut Sauce would still be as effective, but I'd try it before doing anything else. And if it doesnt work, look to seriously get some work done. I have talked with other 339 owners with the same problem, and virtually all were successful with the Nut Sauce. Good luck. I know how that drives you crazy. Thanks guitarzan55 , I want it fixed for all time. I know he lubed it before but with what I don`t know. But hes a savoy guy so I`ll let him work on it again. I`ll let you know the results. K Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerial Man Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Thanks guitarzan55 , I want it fixed for all time. I know he lubed it before but with what I don`t know. But hes a savoy guy so I`ll let him work on it again. I`ll let you know the results. K Get a nut made from a tusq xl nut blank, I gaurantee youll love it. I tune my guitar up with a peterson stroboclip, and it's never that far out when I pick up the guitar, treble strings dont go 'tink' at the nut either. Also check that your strings do not touch the back of the tune-o-matic bridge. The force from strings can make your bridge collapse. If there is not enough clearance over the bridge you can top wrap the strings over the stop bar tailpiece to get the bridge down lower. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badbluesplayer Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 When I got my 339 it came from the factory about 85% setup the way I like it. The only problem I`ve had with it is the strings catching in the nut. Now I took it to my guy who works on my guitars and he grooved the nut some lubricating it but I`m still having some trouble with mainly the G string when I bend the G up sayat the 12fret the G goes Flat then I press the G behind the nut and it goes back in tune. Nothing worse than a G string to flat or to sharp. Now I guess I can file the nut more. I`m also looking into a Bone Nut. Has anyone else had this problem with their 339 nut? Thanks Keith I hate to see people just start automatically filing out the nut when they can't get the thing to stay in tune. I wonder how many people mess up their new guitars by assuming that there's a problem with the nut instead of getting to know their new guitar and making sure they're stringing and tuning properly. Using nut sauce or graphite is a good place to start. But please don't just let some guy start filing out the nut. FYI, 339 nuts are Corian, which is a synthetic, like tusq. When you say you can't tune the g string, can't you just stretch and bend the string until it doesn't go flat anymore and just leave it? Pressing down the string behind the nut is always going to make it go out of tune. You're not supposed to do that. Filing out the nut so there's no friction is not the way to solve the problem. Contrary to popular belief, the guitar will tune easier and more stably if you have a little friction in the nut. It's a matter of tuning the guitar so you take all the slack out of the strings around the tuner posts and even up the tension in the strings on either side of the nut. If you do that and have a little friction at the nut, the guitar will tune properly and stay in tune. If you do a lot of string stretching and bending and you file out the nut so there's no friction, you'll always be fighting the guitar to try to keep it in tune. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badbluesplayer Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Keith almost every guitar that leaves the factory has the nut filed just a little bit shallow so when the person gets it they can have it setup to their liking. It's not just Gibson, it's all guitar mfg'ers...... No, no, no, no, no. Not Gibson, and not anybody I'm aware of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerial Man Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 I hate to see people just start automatically filing out the nut when they can't get the thing to stay in tune. I wonder how many people mess up their new guitars by assuming that there's a problem with the nut instead of getting to know their new guitar and making sure they're stringing and tuning properly. Using nut sauce or graphite is a good place to start. But please don't just let some guy start filing out the nut. FYI, 339 nuts are Corian, which is a synthetic, like tusq. Agreed. But that does not change the fact that in order to make the setup optimal, some nut filing and shaping will most likely be in order on any new guitar. Along with other things beside. List of improvements made to my 2009 es137 classic 1) Neck relief adjusted to a nearly straight neck with 10-52 Rotosound Blues nickel strings. Just a touch of relief. 2) New Tusq xl nut with nut action and final shaping adjusted (i just couldnt get the original nut to behave itself because of soft patches in the material)it would always bind. 3) Top wrapped strings over tail piece to allow the tail piece to be screwed tight to the body with low action at the bridge. (the result is more sustain, more acoustic volume, and more harmonic content coming through) 4) Radiused bridge saddles to 12" to match the fingerboard radius, then final shaping and smoothing. Action then adjusted and finally intonation with a strobe tuner. 5) Pickup height adjusted and polepieces radiused to match 12" radius 6) Misissippi Queen p90 pups (more of an upgrade than setup issue, but relevant all the same) My 137 came like all other gibsons do with a Plek job done at the factory (a so called perfect fret job). I bought a fret rocker from technofret on ebay and suprise suprise 2 frets right at the top of the neck are very slightly high (not bad, but could be better right?). Also with the factory setup, the strings were resting on the back of the nashville bridge, over time this could collapse the bridge. So long as you know how not to damage your guitar when working on it, you have nothing to lose and everything to gain. No mass produced guitar on this planet would have come from the factory playing this good, and if I didn't have the balls to tinker with it id still be stuck here with an average OK setup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDRR Posted October 11, 2011 Author Share Posted October 11, 2011 I hate to see people just start automatically filing out the nut when they can't get the thing to stay in tune. I wonder how many people mess up their new guitars by assuming that there's a problem with the nut instead of getting to know their new guitar and making sure they're stringing and tuning properly. Using nut sauce or graphite is a good place to start. But please don't just let some guy start filing out the nut. FYI, 339 nuts are Corian, which is a synthetic, like tusq. When you say you can't tune the g string, can't you just stretch and bend the string until it doesn't go flat anymore and just leave it? Pressing down the string behind the nut is always going to make it go out of tune. You're not supposed to do that. Filing out the nut so there's no friction is not the way to solve the problem. Contrary to popular belief, the guitar will tune easier and more stably if you have a little friction in the nut. It's a matter of tuning the guitar so you take all the slack out of the strings around the tuner posts and even up the tension in the strings on either side of the nut. If you do that and have a little friction at the nut, the guitar will tune properly and stay in tune. If you do a lot of string stretching and bending and you file out the nut so there's no friction, you'll always be fighting the guitar to try to keep it in tune. Pressing behind the nut is something I normaly don`t do , but it tells me where the nut can need some work , all the other strings bounce back but the G locks up. When the G is in tune I bend up at the 12th fret the G goes Flat , I push the G behind the nut and its in tune again. Nobody is going to to something stupid to my guitar as far as filing the nut.I`ve been playing guitars for 45yrs now I know about pulling on strings...ect. But I do appreciate your input. Thanks Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badbluesplayer Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Pressing behind the nut is something I normaly don`t do , but it tells me where the nut can need some work , all the other strings bounce back but the G locks up. When the G is in tune I bend up at the 12th fret the G goes Flat , I push the G behind the nut and its in tune again. Nobody is going to to something stupid to my guitar as far as filing the nut.I`ve been playing guitars for 45yrs now I know about pulling on strings...ect. But I do appreciate your input. Thanks Keith Cool!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rolling56 Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 5) Pickup height adjusted and polepieces radiused to match 12" radius This is something a lot of people don't do or have even heard of doing. You get the most out of your pickup when doing this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rolling56 Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 No, no, no, no, no. Not Gibson, and not anybody I'm aware of. Whatever you say there bbp...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SG Jester Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Also check that your strings do not touch the back of the tune-o-matic bridge. The force from strings can make your bridge collapse. If there is not enough clearance over the bridge you can top wrap the strings over the stop bar tailpiece to get the bridge down lower. This is exactly why I came to this forum! To get such tips as these... I've been having tuning problems with an SG for a while now. And yes, the strings do touch the back of the bridge! I've often seen people wrap strings over the stop-bar and wondered why. I guess I've been asking the wrong people, 'cos until now I really wasn't aware! Thank you Aerial Man. Mat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rolling56 Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 This is exactly why I came to this forum! To get such tips as these... I've been having tuning problems with an SG for a while now. And yes, the strings do touch the back of the bridge! I've often seen people wrap strings over the stop-bar and wondered why. I guess I've been asking the wrong people, 'cos until now I really wasn't aware! Thank you Aerial Man. Mat Well you can raise the stop bar tail piece up if needed or go top wrap...... check your string action setup at the 12th fret first before doing this, you might be able to lower the bridge instead. Some people do it because it looks kewl..........others do it for more "tone" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerial Man Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 This is exactly why I came to this forum! To get such tips as these... I've been having tuning problems with an SG for a while now. And yes, the strings do touch the back of the bridge! I've often seen people wrap strings over the stop-bar and wondered why. I guess I've been asking the wrong people, 'cos until now I really wasn't aware! Thank you Aerial Man. Mat No sweat. I learned this stuff from Dan Erlewine books and Videos. It's amazing the stuff you can learn from this guy. With some basic tools and a few nut files and radius gauges and some sandpaper you can do wonders for your setup. So long as you go carefully and understand how things work and why your doing what your doing you can not break anything. If you mess up a nut or saddles you can just buy replacements and start again. It's crazy some of these amazing players struggling with bad playing guitars when theres no need. Oh and SG jester, if you do the top wrap you will need to take the old ball ends from your strings and thread the new strings through them so that the end wrappings of the new strings dont endup on the edge of the tail piece, because that can cause them to unravel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDRR Posted October 12, 2011 Author Share Posted October 12, 2011 Update! Took my 339 back to my tech and he filed the nut some more and lubed it too. But the G string still is hanging up some. He thinks that the material the nut is made out of is soft can causing that. The other thing that some on this thread have mentioned is he thought the spacing of the nut was different from what guitars usally are. He said the low E is more in the fretboard and the high E is closer to the outhside , just the oppiset it usally is. Bottom line, I`m getting a new Bone Nut and he is going to fix the spacing. Guys here have mentioned that. I get it back Saturday. So there you have it. Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
endpin Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 My CS-356 bone nut had a similar sticking problem. I looked over the factory detailing of the nut pretty good and believe they are cut on a Plek machine which leaves the groove rather squared-off on the bottom and they apparently don't touch them up by hand to give a more rounded groove. Don't know for sure, but I bet the 339 is the same way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerial Man Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 My CS-356 bone nut had a similar sticking problem. I looked over the factory detailing of the nut pretty good and believe they are cut on a Plek machine which leaves the groove rather squared-off on the bottom and they apparently don't touch them up by hand to give a more rounded groove. Don't know for sure, but I bet the 339 is the same way. The nut on my 137 got plenty of attention from a set of nut files. The bone was just soft and could not work unfortunately. This put me off using bone again due to the time it takes to make a nut from scratch. Really a Tusq XL nut sounds awsome, the harmonics just started jumping out of the guitar and chords just sounded so much more crisply in tune. I did start using a strobe tuner around the same time, so I give half of the credit to that too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerial Man Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 My CS-356 bone nut had a similar sticking problem. I looked over the factory detailing of the nut pretty good and believe they are cut on a Plek machine which leaves the groove rather squared-off on the bottom and they apparently don't touch them up by hand to give a more rounded groove. Don't know for sure, but I bet the 339 is the same way. The nut on my 137 got plenty of attention from a set of nut files. The bone was just soft and could not work unfortunately. This put me off using bone again due to the time it takes to make a nut from scratch. Really a Tusq XL nut sounds awsome, the harmonics just started jumping out of the guitar and chords just sounded so much more crisply in tune. I did start using a strobe tuner around the same time, so I give half of the credit to that too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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