Tim Tim

So it seems clear that the current "Historic Collection" guitars are not very closely based off the original vintage examples. When comparing the modern examples—specifically the Historic collection J-45 1942 and J-35 1936, I'm still wondering the exact body and bracing differences. So far, it seems clear the J35 has advanced x bracing and a wider neck, and the J45 has standard x bracing and the narrower nut. Questions remain about body shape and depth. Do these two guitars have the same body shape, or are they different. Here are photos of the tops and body depths from Gibson and Sweetwater. The body depth (profile) looks the same to me (especially compared to deeper Jumbo, last image for reference), but the contours, especially upper bout and waste, seem different, no?:

Be glad it’s not a martin, or it could take a year! (and I say that as a martin fan.)

This place is starting to read like the foxnews reader comment thread. Only difference is, I don’t recall seeing mention of Gibson guitars over in the foxnews comment threads. Maybe less hyperventilation about viewpoints that don’t match our own and more hyperventilation about Gibson guitars would make the “Gibson Brands Forum” more fun. Just a thought…

I thought the shapes looked slightly different but always thought they were the same. Help me understand the body difference. Is the j45 body deeper than the 35? 35 upper bout looks maybe a bit more narrow, or is it that the lower bout is wider?

Hi all, I’m really curious about the tonal differences between the Historic collection Banner J-45 and the 1936 J-35. I know they say the J-35 advanced x bracing is louder and bassier, but I haven’t found any other good comparison clips that demonstrate that. Also, the Gibson site is pretty poor about listing all the specs. Are the body depths (at heel and tail) the same, or is the 35 shallower or otherwise different somehow? Any help understanding the sound difference between the two would be hugely appreciated. Thanks, Tim

Most people are chronically dehydrated at baseline…

I agree with you in the sense that I would never buy that guitar (astronomical price aside) because it’s far too gaudy for my personal taste, and I play the snot out of my guitars and just want something functional. But I also acknowledge that the world would be a rotten place if we all had the same preferences and that a guitar like this is not created to be a recording work horse—it’s a limited edition art work designed to show some skill or new innovation. Someone clearly had fun making it, and I can see why certain people would be drawn to it. It’s a cool guitar in that sense. I do wonder what it sounds like. Not sure martins ever built with redwood before…

Hyperbole much? I don’t like the guitar, but if you can’t see the craftsmanship in that, your eyes are bad. Also, CEOs don’t get canned because their tastes differ from yours. Bottom line, like it or hate it, it’s a work of art and an interesting guitar.

That martin barley and hops guard is a real work of craftsmanship. Could be you don’t prefer it, but look closely. The wooden pickguard is inlayed into the top to make that happen…

Don’t forget to factor in an extra few hundred dollars to have the adjustable bridge converted when it arrives.., 😂

I slotted the bridge on my J45 Banner Historic. No-brainer; superior long term design. (I’d slot the bridge on any Gibson I was planning to keep.). Break angle is good, so ramping is unnecessary.

I had a 2006 Legend, which had straight (unscalloped) bracing, and I have a 2019 custom J-45 with the same specs as the 2020 Historic, which has scalloped bracing. They sound worlds apart, and the Legend was gone in a heartbeat.

I think this is right on. OP is asking about vintage guitars at CME, and most folks are reporting about modern guitar experiences. I've only bought one guitar from them (2010 Martin, used), but the experience was excellent. I can't commend on their vintage acumen, but they do have a strong reputation. I wouldn't hesitate to buy vintage from them, but I also think the basic rule of thumb for buying vintage from ANYONE is have it checked out by someone legit once it arrives. Good luck!

Forum member messaged me about one he hasn’t listed yet. I did see another at Carter’s that had the neck sanded way down. Did you see that one, or another?

Looks like I may have found an '06 Legend! Still eager to play it alongside a 40s or early 50s slope, but thanks for everyone's help so far!!

Hi Armen, I'd be interested in the 50 if you decide to list that one. Got any photos handy? (I'm the op, he's hijacking me). If you decide to list the 50, please shoot me a pm w details. Thanks! Tim

I thought so too, until I played a few…

Resurrected! Welcome back to the land of the living!

No doubt. Don’t know all the details, but in this market, if there’s nothing major and it has “it,” not a crazy deal. Out of my budget, part of why I’m looking for a J-45.

Better price... https://www.retrofret.com/product.asp?ProductID=10146

I play lots of Neil young on my J-45. I think his stuff sounds really great with that dry woody slope shoulder sound. My favorite strings on it are Martin retros (monels), but you HAVE to play the guitar a week or two until they start to break in before they really hit their stride. From there, they last six months sounding great. Also, “expert factory setup” or whatever they call it is rarely acceptable. Nut slots on mine were way high when I got it. I really think medium strings sound best, and if you have a good tech check the nut, relief, and saddle, it should play like butter and sound amazing. A proper setup will make the guitar sound better (not worse) because you’ll be better able to play the notes without buzzing or trouble. And if you must, use True Mediums or Medium-Lights, but much lighter than that, and you lose tone IMO. Have fun!

How fat are we talking? Can’t imagine you have measurements, but any other comparable necks on modern guitars? Does the legend neck compare at all with the new Historics? Or the Slash J45? Or one of the Martin authentic necks like the D-18A 1937, if you’ve played one?

Welcome back, Bruce! 😆

Re read above. I was pointing out that a lot of people don’t realize that when Martin introduced cnc in the 90s, they changed the body shapes on most of their models. They did not correct that when the Authentic line was created, which is now one way in which the Authentic specs deviate from the originals.

It’s discussed ad nauseum over on the UMGF. People taking out their vintage Martins and tracing the body shapes along side new ones. John Arnold explains exactly when the cnc process was introduced and how the bodies got reworked. Here’s a link where Todd Yates (Martin guru) mentions it, but it’s discussed in dozens of threads over there. https://umgf.com/viewtopic.php?p=2636951#p2636951 On page 1 of that same thread, George Schneider mentions he was privy to a project at Martin pre Covid where they made new body molds to start making them properly again. Covid hit, and it got tabled. It’s not an “accusation,” just the way modern factory production and business decisions that go along with that. But the notion that Chris Martin is worried someone will mix up an authentic with a real prewar Martin is just ridiculous. The big vintage guys definitely don’t view these historical inaccuracies favorably. Don’t get me wrong, I think the Authentics are the best guitars Martin has made since WW2, but things like different body shapes, deep saddle pockets (instead of the true shallow cut thru saddle slots), and that they often don’t put a true representative period correct neck on them all (ie D-28 A 1937) are detractors for some. I have to imagine if it was cost-free to correct some of these things, it would have been done. I guess, to the point of the thread (drift was totally my fault lol), you can start to see why I’m interested in the J-45 Legend as a true vintage replica.