Another shoulder issue

[bram99]

I am having major comfort issues and right shoulder pain with a newly acquired. 12 fret L-00 (Keb Mo). This has taken me by surprise because the most comfortable guitar I have ever played is my LG2. They are both very similar is size....

 

LG2

Body length 19 inches

Upper bout 10 3/4

Waist 9 1/4

Lower bout 14 1/4

 

Keb Mo

Body length 19 1/2

Upper bout 10 1/4

Waist 8 1/4

Lower bout 14 3/4

 

I don't think it is the twelve fret neck itself because the short neck is very comfortable....but I think it is the right arm adjustment I have to make because of the different bridge placement. On the LG 2 the bridge saddle is 11 inches from where the 14th fret meets the body. On the L-00 the bridge saddle is 12 1/2 inches from there the 12th fret meets the body. This seems minor but it requires a shift of my right arm away from my torso....it is the only thing I can think of. When I hold it where it feels comfortable my right hand ends up over the fretboard not the sound hole....on the LG-2 everything lines up just right....

 

I have tried chasing down these kinds of problems with straps and holding the guitar different etc..twice before on electrics and both times got tired of fighting it and sold the guitars....anyone else ever notice this with 12 fret guitars? I have never had this issue with classical s but I alway held those like a classical....can't see going that way with a blues guitar and am considering swapping this one out for a 12 fret (EDIT I mean 14 fret) L-00...any thoughts appreciated. Feel like this new relationship might not work out.....bummer too because this guitar sounds amazing.

[62burst]

Wow- It sounds like you're doing everything right, & doing your homework in trying to get to the source of the discomfort while playing. This problem is more normally seen after extended playing time on a super jumbo, not

guitar sizes going in the opposite direction like the L-00. Have you taken a hard look at what activities you might be doing outside of guitar playing that might be predisposing you to shoulder problems when you do finally pick up a guitar? That's what did it for me in the past. Took it easy for a few weeks, & have been able to continue playing, but I am more careful now with biomechanics with respect to that shoulder. Hope you get some relief.

[bram99]

I have been playing my LG2 right along with it without issue....sitting on the sofa, floor, chair and stool. It just starts with having a hard time getting comfortable and then after about a half hour the shoulder starts letting me know its there...then after an hour I've had enough. The best adjustment so far has been hold like I normally would but the right hand ends up over the fretboard a little when playing...too far forward........when I bring my arm back near the bridge side of the sound hole where i am used to playing..it starts....it's that repositioning of the arm to the right that does it..although the upper arm position is similar on my j-45 i tend to rest my upper arm on the side so it is quite comfortable and my righthand ends up über the sound hole where it should because of the bigger body of the J-45.....I just can't seem to find the sweet spot on the Keb Mo.

[JuanCarlosVejar]

bram ,

 

sorry to hear about the problem .

maybe you need to visit a doctor ? or a therapist ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

JC

[Motherofpearl]

I understand ya.

When playing the 12 fret you need to lift and bring your arm back towards the lower bout to play behind the soundhole.

What if you played in the classical position? The neck being closer to you on a 12 fret it may not be that bad? I know it may take some getting use to? Or try one of those John pearse arm rest things. It won't harm your guitar if you remove it.

[onewilyfool]

I think Nodehopper put up some great stretching techniques for guitar players....or links to a website...sorry to hear about your problem...keep pluckin'!!!!!

[Jerry K]

Well, the relationship between the waist of the guitar and the leg that it is fitting over is unchanged, but the neck and bridge have moved a couple inches toward your right with a similarly sized 12 fretter. So you have to figure out some sort of adjustment in the way you hold it in order to maintain the same comfortable angles with your arms and hands. Play standing with a strap maybe or just attach a strap to the lower bout strap button and sit on the rest of the strap such that it holds the guitar in the place you need. Or you could play sitting but with your torso turned a bit to the right, the guitar no longer parallel to the front of your torso. I think that might also compensate, but it may feel odd. Possibly position your right elbow further down the lower bout, almost at the end of the guitar.

 

Or maybe you've found your ideal shape in the LG-2 and it's time to trade the 12 fretter.

[ParlourMan]

Wider neck putting you off angle perhaps?

[blindboygrunt]

If you like you can send me the guitar and I'll see if I have any problems :)

 

Feeling charitable today

[Bryn6490]

I have problems with my shoulder also. You should try adjusting your shoulder strap so your guitar is higher or try using a guitar step if you play sitting down. I also noticed that my Taylor guitars are slightly slimmer than my Martin and Gibson and Takamine, but not taylor GC guitars.. The smaller bodied Gibsons are a bit thicker than the J-Gibsons. You should have your shoulder checked out. You might have a rotator cuff tear. After my shoulder surgery the only acoustic guitar I could play for more than 10 min was a Taylor GS Mini with a 23 inch scale. I played a Martin Eric Clapton 000-28 that did not hurt my shoulder but I could not afford it. The 00-18 I played was also easy on my shoulder. Now all of my acoustic guitars are set up with Med-Lites or Lite gauge strings. The best thing about Gibson is that they are 24 3/4 scale. One more thing ... I notice that when playing a Gibson J-45 J-35 or any D shaped guitar the guitar sits higher on your lap making it easy and less stessfull on my shoulder. When playing a small body Gibson, Taylor or martin the guitar sits lower in your lap causing stress at your neck and shoulder. The smaller body guitar causes you to slouch over when playing. Sorry about rambling on I have not slept in over 24 hours.

[bram99]

Thanks for all of the suggestions here...When the solution comes down to straps, pads, footrests and other devices I think it is time for me to move on...I am returning the guitar... chalk it up to buying a guitar online based on specs without playing it. The Keb Mo is outstanding and the tone is amazing (the neck is the best ever!), but i cant seem to get with it just by holding it differently. I dont think i am dealing with an injury or anything other than ergonomics, becuase i spent alot of time on my LG2 and J45 the last few days without issue....it is the combo of the small upper bout which makes the guitar sit low, the 12 fret neck shift of the bridge toward the lower bout along with the wider lower bout raising my arm....

 

At this point I think Jerry K is right and the LG is the guitar for me (and the right torso turn you suggested does help (thanks) but not quite enough)....I have about 10 guitars right now, and several of them were ones that were close but not perfect....so shortly after i got them i was gassing again and buying. I am trying to avoid that now and holding myself to not compromising...hard to do with a beauty like the KebMo L-00....

 

So the quest continues......My LG2 is my favorite guitar, but it is a more generalist daily guitar and i was hoping for something more clearly in the blues camp tone wise. Now that I have this new perspective on body shape, I think i will look at an older LG-1 or one of the adi top LG-2s reissues that come around every once in a while....I also plan on making the rounds to see if the 14fret L-00 is better for me although i realize the sound will be different due to the bridge placement.....thanks for comments here folks.

 

bram